10/18/03 -- Jeb's Emails to FR poster, summer, today, re: Terri. (And, a Message to Michael Shiavo)

To: Goldwater Girl

#1- Terri is not terminal. She is not in a vegetative state, per several physicians and other practitioners. She is brain damaged, quite likely at the hands of her 'legal' guardian.

#2- Food and water are not considered advanced medical life support. It is basic life support to every human being, including those reading this thread. It is not extraordinary.

#3- You know as well as I do that once that tube is down, it STAYS down, otherwise it is murder by starvation according to standard medical ethics. There is no debating this point. It is established belief among ethical healthcare practitioners.

The decision to withhold the tube is made before insertion, not after.

#4- There is an incredible, blatant amount of corruption on the part of the judge and her 'husband'. APS should have removed him as guardian long ago. The testimony of a guardian husband who is living with another woman, fathered children by her, and stands to inherit a large amount of money upon the wife's death should never have been accepted. The judge should never have been allowed to hear this case, much less be sitting on the bench if allegations are correct.

Terri had nothing in writing. In that event, you err on the side of life, always.

C_of_D. RN

281 posted on 10/19/2003 1:54:03 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah

To: Goldwater Girl

You still might get flamed, but I just wanted you to know that I appreciated your post. I have zero medical background and very limited legal knowledge. I find it hard to figure things out and learn anything when the posts are so heavy with emotion, capital letters and exclamation points. While I can appreciate passion, the communication often gets lost.... Thanks again.

282 posted on 10/19/2003 1:55:06 PM PDT by CheneyChick (Let the Hauskleaning Begin)

To: Goldwater Girl

I have hesitated to enter this debate, because it is so emotional and personal. The situation with this pitiful woman is truly tragic, and forcing some people to come to grips with their own mortality- perhaps for the first time. As a nurse, I saw many people "saved" through advanced technology- but the quality of life left to them and their families was as tragic as Terri's.

Terri has been denied rehabilitation. As a result, nobody knows, or will ever know, what her state really was back in 1990. That she hasn't recovered in an environment where she is "protected" from visitors and where any efforts at rehabilitation are forbidden doesn't say anything about what she would or would not have been able to do if the $750K awarded for her rehabilitation was actually put to such use.

Florida's "right to die" laws are the result of medical advances- and assert the individual's right to refuse medical treatment. None of us know what Terri would have chosen in an advance directive. Testimony in her case more than 3 years ago- by Michael and friends- claimed she had said she didn't want to be "kept alive by tubes". Her parents disputed that testimony- and the judge ruled in Michael's favor. That is the pivotal ruling in this case- based on sworn testimony given in court.

Actually, I think a more important (and outrageous) finding was probably that there wasn't even the possibility of any conflict of interest regarding Schiavo's care of Terri.

Unfortunately, if a judge declares that there's "clear and compelling" evidence of Terri's wish to die, and there's no significant evidence that there's any possible conflict of interest involving Terri and Michael, it's all but impossible for any appeals court to challenge it.

Maybe they perjured themselves- or maybe her parents are mistaken. The Judge ruled, based on evidence presented, which story was the most credible.

Well, officially anyway. If he was biased (as seems likely) he ruled on which story he wanted to hear.

If Terri had a living will, or advance directive, she could have named any person as her guardian. Since she did not, her husband is her de facto next of kin. The family sought to have him removed for cause- and lost.

Actually, IIRC they won one such case in a trial court, but that decision was overturned on appeal because it hadn't been filed in Judge Greer's courtroom.

He legally represents her interests in court, her funds pay for the lawyers. Apparently, over 13 years of court cases, the money is about gone. Although she probably has Medicare and Social Security income- neither pay for lengthy nursing home stays. Care costs in about $50,000 year here. Only Medicaid pays for nursing homes- and it is for indigent people. Her assets have gone to lawyers- and she is now indigent. Michael will not reap any profit from her death- the money is gone. He cannot sell her organs- that is against federal and state law.

If Michael had succeeded in killing off Terri back in, say, 1993, he would have reaped a pretty big windfall from her death; I think a financial motive would have been pretty clear then. Over the years, however, the malfeasance toward his ward and her affairs has been significant and might--if examined by the right judge--be deemed criminal.

At this point, even if the looting of the trust fund is complete, I suspect Schiavo still fears what would happen if he lost guardianship and Terri were to ever recover. If Terri were to have shown significant recovery after a couple months of therapy, I would suspect her guardian would be able to file a pretty big lawsuit for his mistreatment of her.

Note that while it's by no means certain that Terri would recover, it would certainly seem like a risk Michael would rather not take.

Feeding tubes are legally considered life support for patients who cannot swallow. IV's, respirators, and feeding tubes are all "extraordinary measures" in terminal patients.

Is spoon-feeding? One of the affidavits posted indicates that a nurses' initial attempts at spoon-feeding Terri were successful, until she was discovered and prevented from making any more such attempts. Is there any legitimate reason not to attempt to spoon-feed Terri (other than Judge Greer's forbidding it because it might cause pneumonia?)

"Vegetative" state is not "brain dead"- here is a medical definition: "A persistent vegetative state, which sometimes follows a coma, refers to a condition in which individuals have lost cognitive neurological function and awareness of the environment but retain noncognitive function and a perserved sleep-wake cycle.

It is sometimes described as when a person is technically alive, but his/her brain is dead. However, that description is not completely accurate. In persistent vegetative state the individual loses the higher cerebral powers of the brain, but the functions of the brainstem, such as respiration (breathing) and circulation, remain relatively intact. Spontaneous movements may occur and the eyes may open in response to external stimuli, but the patient does not speak or obey commands. Patients in a vegetative state may appear somewhat normal. They may occasionally grimace, cry, or laugh."

Looking at the edited video tapes as a medical professional- I, too, question whether Terri is in PVS. But expert testimony of physicians in court assert she is- and the court accepted their diagnosis.

From what I understand, making a diagnosis of PVS requires doing considerably more testing, over a longer period of time, than was done.

Additional points: The Legislature cannot pass retroactive laws. Any changes made will apply only after the law passes and takes affect. No help for Terri there.

New legislation could intervene in her case. For example, in the unlikely event that she's still able to accept spoon-fed liquid, the legislature could pass a law mandating that she be spoon-fed. For that matter, new legislation could even mandate that she be IV-hydrated immediately if such treatment is necessary to save her life.

But one of us might benefit if changes are made to insure that people in her situation are given the benefit of the doubt toward life, and guardians seeking to halt life support have to meet a greater burden of proof that the person would have chosen death. Urge your legislators to make these changes.

Actually, looking at this case, I think it highlights a more systemic problem with the legal system: in an effort to discourage judge-shopping and frivolously-repeated litigation, the legal system's rules have given extreme power to unscrupulous lawyers and judges. Given that Schiavo had $750K available to spend on legal fees, the Schindlers would probably have had to spend much more than that to protect their daughter.

To understand part of the problem, consider the case of a building with five unlocked entrances. In such a building, one thief will be able to get past four guards. Likewise, in the cases involving Felos and the Schindlers' lawyers, Felos merely has to unleash one trick the Schindlers haven't protected against; the Schindlers, by contrast, are required to protect against everything Felos might try.

Criminal investigations of the alleged abuse of Terri have been requested and denied- by local and state lawmen. The bone scan in question is 12 years old-the statute of limitations is past, and there is no new evidence of abuse they can use. It has been part of the case file for more than a decade- and only now does it become evidence of abuse. Either their laywer is incompetant or she's grasping at straws.

Terri's lawyers aren't the best. I can't fully blame them for not acting perfectly; they've been way outclassed from the get-go.

As for the questions of abuse, Michael can't be tried for any abuse shown on the decade-old bone scan, but there are some clear allegations of abuse since then. Most of those would only fully come into play if Terri were allowed to recover and did so, but some are clearer and more unambiguous. For example, someone on another thread mentioned a statute that requires feeding-tube tests be given every six months. If such tests were refused, that could constitute abuse. Depending upon the judge hearing the case, it may be possible to introduce other evidence indicating that such malfeasance was part of a pattern of abuse.

Michael appears to be a selfish person- his testimony during the malpractice trials a mere charade. or perhaps he just gave up hope- in either case, it is clear she is not his primary interest any longer. My guess is the years of court battles with her parents have become an ego thing with him- he just wants to beat them again- and Terri no longer matters. He best move to another state, where people are less likely to know his history- and pass judgement on his actions. I have to wonder what his marriage to Terri was like...

She'd told others she planned to divorce him. And otherwise, I suspect his motives are as I said before--he doesn't want to take the chance--however small--that if he lost guardianship of Terri she could recover and her new guardian could sue him and Felos for having withheld treatment for so long.

Terri suffered from bulemia, and starved herself to the point of cardiac arrest from low potassium levels. She was resuscitated after 10 minutes- and suffered severe brain damage.

That is one given explanation for her condition. I must say, it seems odd nobody seems to take an interest in confirming that or looking for anything else. When my wife died suddenly at age 27, the coroner told me that because 27-year-olds don't generally die suddenly of non-traumatic causes (e.g. car accidents) he wanted to do an autopsy. Not because he had any reason to suspect I or anyone else had killed my wife, but rather because it is practice to recard all such events among people that young as suspicious.

Is it possible she wanted to die? Did modern medicine restore her to a life she had discarded- but she is now helpless, and unable to express her true wishes? Suicide is abhorrent to me- but what if that was her intention- and all of us are imposing our morality and will on a person who does not share our views?

Given what she has survived since then, without any sort of respirator or other gear, I'd say the evidence is more likely that she has a pretty amazingly strong will to live. How many people who want to die would survive 60 hours without food or hydration?

Despite the calls for the Governor to take action- legal or not- in this tragedy- I agree with Quinn's dispassionate assessment, and refer you to his comments on this thread. Clinton was the one who was poll driven- the Bush's take their constitutional oaths seriously. Jeb's hands are tied. If the claims of misconduct on Judge Greer's part can be proved, the Legislature very well might impeach him- but it would be too late to save Terri.

I hope that enough of a conspiracy can be proven to get Greer for First Degree Murder, though I'll admit even if Felos and Schiavo sing like birdies it's unlikely.

Like Karen Quinlen so many years ago- hope remains that- if her parents are correct, and the doctor's wrong- Terri's will to live will triumph, and she will wake enough to eat and drink.

According to an affidavit, Terri appeared able to accept spoon feeding and hydration. In this case, however, the judge has forbidden it. Indeed, that specific action--forbidding any attempt at oral feeding/hydration, is what has some people here ost outraged. Removal of oral feeding/hydration is explicitly forbidden under Florida statutes, any judge's order notwithstanding.

Karen did- Terri might.

How? If nobody is allowed to put any food to her libs, how can she consume it?

It would be the miracle her parents hope for- and proof to Michael it is past time for him to divorce her, give up his guardianship, and get on with his new life...

...in prison, preferably.

I am praying for Terri, too. Praying she finds the strength to live, or finds peace as only the truly innocent can with our Father in heaven.

I pray that her years of struggling to stay alive will not be in vain--that even if she dies within the next few days, her heroic struggle will end up saving the lives of others.

And I urge each of you- not to rail against elected officials, or seek vengeance against those you believe let her down,...

Perhaps people are annoyed because Jeb Bush is showing no on-going signs of interest in this matter. Perhaps they're annoyed because he has given no clear reason why a statute which (from my understanding) positively forbids withdrawal of oral food/hydration for the purpose of killing someone should not be enforced, Judge Greer's illegal order notwithstanding.

... but to sit down RIGHT NOW with your families- and discuss how you would want to be treated if you were in Terri's place. Tell them CLEARLY what you want. Write it down in your will- name a person you trust to make decisions for you- learn from this tragedy that was so avoidable. Don't let it happen in your family.

If the person who'd naturally be appointed as guardian is trustworthy, there is no legal cause for concern (though making sure they know what your wishes are is, of course important). And if such a person isn't trustworthy, there'd better be a big legal fund set up in advance or else the other side's lawyers may win the case before setting foot in the courtroom.

283 posted on 10/19/2003 2:05:37 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)

Quinn-
Perhaps logical or factual would have been a better term than dispassionate. I did not mean to imply you don't care- only that you have a grasp of the reality of this terrible situation, and argue your viewpoint well.
As for a will to live- I have seen many miracles medicine cannot explain, by people who simply refuse to die. Survival is the strongest of all primal instincts- as we saw with Karen Quinlan. I know the court order denies her food and water- but the staff are caregivers, not executioners. If she begins to wake- they will do the right thing. Having been in similar situations so many times, I am confident the hippocratic oath is stronger than any order Greer signs.
When Karen's respirator tube was d/c'd- she began to wake- she FOUGHT for her life- against all odds, and proved the doctors wrong. Granted, she did not make a full recovery- but she lived for 10 more years. She was the first publicized case of a right to die- but her parents were the guardians. Others have not survived the order.
This legal euthanasia is contrary to everything medical professionals have devoted their lives to- they are suffering as much as any of us- and hate being in this position. Hospice staff are dedicated to helping people die with dignity- at peace with themselves and their loved ones- as free from pain and discomfort as possible. It is a difficult job, but they are compassionate people, or they would be giving shots in a doctors office somewhere. They understand what is happening here- and know better than any of us what her true condition is.
Because Terri has been on total care for so long- she would have to have therapy to strengthen her tongue and throat muscles to learn to swallow again. They have atrophied from disuse- which is the rationale for denying her the communion wafer. Pointlss, I agree, but Michael seems to think starvation less cruel than aspiration/choking to death. (She did receive the other sacrement,however.)
Nonetheless, it is a long process.
Judge Greer is elected- and will stand for relection. If all else fails, I am certain the voters will send him to an early retirement.

284 posted on 10/19/2003 2:09:54 PM PDT by Goldwater Girl

My husband posited his theory: That Michael wants her dead because he's already contracted to sell her organs.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

As the mother of a heart transplant patient, I do not find the humor in this comment, nor do I find it appropriate for this conversation.

~Heather
www.Emmas2Hearts.com

285 posted on 10/19/2003 2:16:13 PM PDT by Florida Mama (:()

To: Canticle_of_Deborah

#4- There is an incredible, blatant amount of corruption on the part of the judge and her 'husband'. APS should have removed him as guardian long ago. The testimony of a guardian husband who is living with another woman, fathered children by her, and stands to inherit a large amount of money upon the wife's death should never have been accepted. The judge should never have been allowed to hear this case, much less be sitting on the bench if allegations are correct.

A judge is required to appoint a guardian ad litem any time there is even a possibility of a conflict-of-interest regarding a guardian and his ward. That Judge Greer has consistently refused to appoint a guardian ad litem in this case is inexcusable. [nb: I actually find such action surprising; it would have been much more effective and safer to simply appoint a 'yes man' guardian ad lib] I don't know whether Judge Greer got away with this because the Schindlers' attourneys made a major goof, Judge Greer and Felos conspired to blindside them, or what, but it sure stinks.

286 posted on 10/19/2003 2:22:17 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)

To: Florida Mama

"As the mother of a heart transplant patient, I do not find the humor in this comment, nor do I find it appropriate for this conversation. "

I don't think that comment was posted as an attempt at humor.

288 posted on 10/19/2003 2:45:13 PM PDT by honeygrl

I'm saying prayers for her and her parents, summer. I'm proud of you for your attempts to get help for her from the Governor.

This is one of those horrific situations that bring pain to all good people.

289 posted on 10/19/2003 2:49:18 PM PDT by potlatch (1 cross + 3 nails = 4 given)

I don't think that comment was posted as an attempt at humor.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I should have read farther down, my apologies, I thought it was an attpemt at humor.

Carry on and ignore my comment :)

290 posted on 10/19/2003 2:51:25 PM PDT by Florida Mama (Ignore me!)

To: Canticle_of_Deborah

#1- Terri is not terminal. She is not in a vegetative state, per several physicians and other practitioners. She is brain damaged, quite likely at the hands of her 'legal' guardian.

Doctors testified on both sides- the judge accepted the PVS diagnosis. You and I might question it- and do- but he decided- therefore,legally- she is. The doctors who treated her eating disorder were successfully sued for malpractice- after she arrested from lack of potassium- several of them, in fact. If Michael's abuse was the real cause, why didn't they prove that?

#2- Food and water are not considered advanced medical life support. It is basic life support to every human being, including those reading this thread. It is not extraordinary.

The testimony that she did not want to be "kept alive by tubes"- triggered several previous Florida case precedents regarding feeding tubes as "extraordinary measures". The case law is clear- going back more than 20 years. Her spoken statements take on the effect of a written directive. Since he accepted the diagnosis of PVS, and the testimony of her wishes- he was following the law and (again) ordered it removed. To err on the side of life would have been inconsistant with his opinion that she would refuse tubes keeping her alive.

How and why the tube was placed to begin with is questionable, at best. If she was, indeed, able to take nourishment- why was the tube placed to begin with? My guess is it was because of the ongoing legal battle. I know it was removed and replaced at least once before. The ethical question of terminating life support is one many practioners still struggle with. Just as brain death caused a moral and ethical debate within the profession.

#4- There is an incredible, blatant amount of corruption on the part of the judge and her 'husband'. APS should have removed him as guardian long ago. The testimony of a guardian husband who is living with another woman, fathered children by her, and stands to inherit a large amount of money upon the wife's death should never have been accepted. The judge should never have been allowed to hear this case, much less be sitting on the bench if allegations are correct.

The parents first challenged Michael's guardianship 12 years ago- and lost. It was long before the other woman and child(ren). We don't know the facts- but it is not unusual for a judge to side with a spouse over parents, or parents over grandparents, in Florida. Apparently the facts presented in court were insufficient to remove him.
For Terri to qualify for Medicaid in Florida- her net worth must be less than $6000. There is no money left for Michael to play around with- the lawyers have it all.
I agree there should be retribution IF the allegations are correct about the Judge. But there have been a lot of allegations- and they need to be proven. But even if they are not- I believe Judge Greer's career is over when he comes up for re-election.

291 posted on 10/19/2003 2:56:53 PM PDT by Goldwater Girl

I don't beleive that people who die from dehydration/starvation have organs that are usable. The body will consume itself trying to stay alive.

From the FL constitution:

SECTION 1. Governor.--

(a) The supreme executive power shall be vested in a governor. He shall be commander-in-chief of all military forces of the state not in active service of the United States. He shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed, commission all officers of the state and counties, and transact all necessary business with the officers of government. He may require information in writing from all executive or administrative state, county or municipal officers upon any subject relating to the duties of their respective offices. The governor shall be the chief administrative officer of the state responsible for the planning and budgeting for the state.

(b) The governor may initiate judicial proceedings in the name of the state against any executive or administrative state, county or municipal officer to enforce compliance with any duty or restrain any unauthorized act.

Murder by starvation is surely not a legal behaviour.

From the FL Bill of Rights:

SECTION 2. Basic rights.--All natural persons are equal before the law and have inalienable rights, among which are the right to enjoy and defend life and liberty, to pursue happiness, to be rewarded for industry, and to acquire, possess and protect property; except that the ownership, inheritance, disposition and possession of real property by aliens ineligible for citizenship may be regulated or prohibited by law. No person shall be deprived of any right because of race, religion or physical handicap.

If this woman dies, it will be murder by government.

God bless and keep you, Terri.

292 posted on 10/19/2003 3:01:07 PM PDT by lodwick

To: Goldwater Girl

How and why the tube was placed to begin with is questionable, at best. If she was, indeed, able to take nourishment- why was the tube placed to begin with?

If a patient is able to take nourishment orally, but only with difficulty, it is not uncommon to install a feeding tube for the mutual convenience of staff and patient. The use of a feeding tube in no way implies that a patient cannot take food orally or be taught to do so.

My guess is it was because of the ongoing legal battle. I know it was removed and replaced at least once before. The ethical question of terminating life support is one many practioners still struggle with. Just as brain death caused a moral and ethical debate within the profession.

If positive efforts were made to teach Terri to accept food and liquid orally, and such efforts failed, then there might be some basis for discussion. But to forbid any effort at spoon-feeding, and then argue that the person should die because she doesn't want to be "hooked up to tubes", is obscene.

You could take any healthy person and stick a feeding tube in them, and as long as they were denied oral food and liquids, they'd be reliant upon that feeding tube for life. Does that mean we should kill everyone?

The parents first challenged Michael's guardianship 12 years ago- and lost. It was long before the other woman and child(ren). We don't know the facts- but it is not unusual for a judge to side with a spouse over parents, or parents over grandparents, in Florida. Apparently the facts presented in court were insufficient to remove him.

A court is required to appoint a guardian ad litem in any case where there is any possible conflict of interest between a guardian and his ward. Terri had a guardian ad litem initially, but Felos (Schiavo's attourney) was allowed to fire him and not replace him when he had the audacity to suggest that Felos' actions weren't in Terri's best interest. It stretches credulity to suggest that a man in Schiavo's position couldn't possibly have any conflict of interest involving his wife's care, especially after an earlier guardian at lltem was fired for suggesting that such a conflict existed.

For Terri to qualify for Medicaid in Florida- her net worth must be less than $6000. There is no money left for Michael to play around with- the lawyers have it all.

If Terri gets a new guardian, that person will have a duty to demand an audit of Terri's trust fund's books. If money was mis-spent (as seems likely) such an audit would end Schiavo, Felos, and possibly Greer in jail.

Further, if Terri is given therapy and recovers to any meaningful extent, her guardian would be able to file a lawsuit on her behalf for mental anguish caused by Michael's having blocked such therapies for 13 years. The risk to Michael of Terri recovering is pretty small, but it's a risk I'm sure he'd rather not take.

I agree there should be retribution IF the allegations are correct about the Judge. But there have been a lot of allegations- and they need to be proven. But even if they are not- I believe Judge Greer's career is over when he comes up for re-election.

I haven't seen the actual transcripts from Judge Greer's court, so I don't know to what extent he's been acting criminally and to what extent he's merely been helping Felos to sideswipe the Schindlers' lawyers at every turn.

Schiavo has been able to spend $300,000 on his lawyer. Terri's parents have been able to spend next to nothing. While I don't doubt that the Schindlers' lawyers are decent people, they are no match for Felos.

293 posted on 10/19/2003 3:16:27 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)

Also: Barbara Pierce Bush was raised Presbyterian and married GHWB at Rye Presbyterian Church in Rye, New York.

GHWB and BPB attend an Episcopal Church when they're in Texas (or Washington, DC) and a Congregational Church when they're in Maine.

Dubya is now a Methodist because he converted when he married Laura. Jeb became a Catholic a few years after marrying Columba.

294 posted on 10/19/2003 3:20:05 PM PDT by utahagen

To: Goldwater Girl

You are wrong on so many counts I don't even know where to begin.

First, out of all the physicians who offered testimony as to Terri's neuro status, the corrupt Judge Greer only allowed the testimony of one; handpicked by the adulterous spouse and the sole physician willing to state Terri was vegetative. Have you not been watching the news as of late? A neurologist just went on Florida television stating that what they are doing to Terri is murder! He specifically stated Terri is not in a vegetative state.

Second, hearsay is not considered enough to pull a tube. That is ridiculous. I won't say that unethical practitioners have not used it previously, but it is not considered legitimate. Furthermore, that idea contradicts your previous plea for living wills. Why bother with a living will when it's enough for someone to say, "Hey, I heard her say she wanted to die once." Great, let's pull the plug!

The burden remains to prove a person wanted death, not to prove a desire for life. That requires written, legally notarized testimony.

Third, you are making assumptions that the entire legal process has been ethical and lawful. You are giving her 'husband' the benefit of the doubt when facts prove he is immoral and likely criminally complicit in her injury and financial defrauding. Ditto for Judge Greer.

Please take the facts in this case into account before you render judgement.

295 posted on 10/19/2003 3:23:47 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah

To: Florida Mama

I'm sorry you thought my post was in any way an attempt at humor. I was deadly serious. And as the wife of a triple bypass patient myself, I congratulate you and your hubby for having courage and strength to go through worse.

I know my fear when my husband was in surgery so I can only imagine multiplying it tenfold for a heart replacement.

If I offended you in any way, please accept my apology.

Peace

296 posted on 10/19/2003 3:23:55 PM PDT by Humidston (Do not remove this tag under penalty of law)

CORRECTION: Your son or daughter went through replacement surgery. Sorry!

297 posted on 10/19/2003 3:25:31 PM PDT by Humidston (Do not remove this tag under penalty of law)

Question of the day: Why oh why wouldn't the govenment allow Terri to receive communion?
Answer: It would prove she can swallow!!!!! They'd have to stop the murder by decree, and declare the death of the greatest growth industries ( spell that s-c-a-m ) by the two evil sisters - religion and government!!!

Go To:

JOIN THE TERRI JELLO BRIGADE!!! -- DAY FIVE

Attorney Christopher A. Ferrara argues that Michael Schiavo has violated Terri's rights under federal laws, including the Americans with Disabilities Act, by withholding medical treatment and refusing to allow her to fed by mouth.

"(The Schindlers) are about to lose their daughter because no one wants to put a teaspoon of Jello to her mouth," Ferrara said. "It's insane."

Join the Terri Schindler-Shiavro Jello Brigade Today !!!

Do something that will really tick 'em off!!! Let your pesky little envelope be one of many that will fill their offices with the dreaded packages of jello they dare not feed Terri. My family sent three envelopes addressed:

No More Wiggle Room - Jeb Bush
Governor, State of Florida
400 S. Monroe Street
The Capitol
Tallahassee, Florida 32399-0001
Save Terri Schindler-Shiavro's Life Today!!!

Give 'em a fit........but more importantly.........you're telling them.......

Change the way your running this country. We're watching you, and we don't like the way you're doing business in our name.

Related costs: Jello .99; Envelope 1.19, stamps 1.29

298 posted on 10/19/2003 3:25:52 PM PDT by Robert Drobot (God, family, country. All else is meaningless.)

Your theory about Michael being afraid of Terri recovering is entirely plausible. It explains why he has refused to divorce her and relinquish guardianship to her parents.
My condolences on the loss of your wife at such a young age. Were they able to find the cause of death? Since Terri survived her cardiac arrest- and her bloodwork showed the critically low potassium level, the doctors treating her bulemia got nailed for malpractice. If it had been questionable, they would not all have lost.
I undertand Terri has been in a series of nursing homes, before coming to hospice. If she was denied therapy for all those years- why did the parents not prevail? Even comatose patients get therapy to prevent contractures.
I don't know why the nurse attempting to wean Terri off the feeding tube was stopped....unless it resulted in aspiration or was against doctors orders-- or maybe it was a nurses aide? There are almost no RN's in nursing homes, they run on LPN's and aides.
About passing an emergency law to help Terri- I'm afraid there are too many lawyers in the Legislature- especially the Senate- to get anything like that passed. Wish it were different.
If there is new evidence of abuse- the parents should have raised that IMMEDIATELY. As far as I am aware, they made multiple attempts to get the old bone scan investigated, but nothing new. Are they working on that now? I read they have given up fighting.
About advance directives- in Florida, at least, written instructions from an individual pretty much trump the legal angle. They are carried out every day without this kind of controversy. Sometimes family members squabble about it- but if judges have your written instructions to go by- it is quickly settled. Finding someone to take on that responsibility is another thing altogether. I chose a friend from nursing school- who understands the medical terms anddisease processes and can make a rational decision on my behalf. It's an important decision- to give someone that much power- look what Michael has done with it. Good luck.

299 posted on 10/19/2003 3:29:38 PM PDT by Goldwater Girl

To: Canticle_of_Deborah

Please follow this link- and read the Florida law for yourself. It clearly states feeding tubes are included, and that, in the absence of a written advance directive, the patient's verbal expression carries the same weight. I am a conservative- I don't read the law to say what I want it to say- but just what it says. And I put more weight into the law, and my personal experience with it, than with news accounts and unsubstantiated allegations. Please read the law (F.S. 765) before you jump to conclusions.
http://www.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0765/ch0765.htm

300 posted on 10/19/2003 3:52:10 PM PDT by Goldwater Girl

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