Posted on 07/26/2002 11:29:06 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
Welcome to The Green Dragon Inn
This is a chapter discussion of The Two Towers, volume two of the Lord of the Rings. It is a continuation of our discussion of Lord of the Rings that started with Fellowship of the Ring and finished a few weeks back. FoTR discussion thread.
We will cover one section of the book per week. Sometimes short, related chapters may be combined, and the process may evolve as we go to keep everybody happy! If you are joining late, jump right in, but please stick to the chapter currently being discussed. We should be a bit careful with topic and spoilers (especially if we are joined by some reading for the first time) but feel free to draw lines related to other events in the story. If you do misbehave too much you will be sent to Took's Corner. As always, if you want to chit-chat or share other news… I would probably be best to post that in The Hobbit Hole thread.
It is OK this time to share images from the Two Towers (that illustrate the current chapter of course!) They are fun snapshots that show our story coming to life. Use your head, we don't want to slow down the thread too much, but most of us love a few pics in the thread.
Every week I will ping you to the new chapter or section …. Let me know if you would like to be on - or off - this list. I will serve as the Thain of the list.
So lets read, listen and become inspired by the many aspects of The Lord of the Rings that touch us deeply and reconnect us to the values we aspire to. Many great discussions have already been had, and I hope that this thread will produce even more. Many FReepers have wonderful things to say about LoTR, whether the fantasy reconnects them with their faith, with their relationships with friends and family, or simply illustrates the splendor of great acts of heroism and sacrifice in the constant battle of virtue versus corruption.
Besides, we Tolkien fans need something to keep us busy while we wait for the film to come out December 19. This thread will adjust the schedule as necessary to be finished before the film comes out!
At least PJ will be breaking it up better in the movie.
Am I what!
You know what, I can feel TTT coming....like a distant drum getting louder and louder and louder...
Have had my head buried in writing a fan fic...trying to come up for air, but am determined to finish before I plunge...aiming to finish by the end of the weekend.
See y'all then!
One of the letters, which was really complaining to the publisher about the name, said something like 'It'll be confusing to the reader, but I guess it doesn't matter, there are a lot of opposing towers in the book and it could be any one of them'
I've always thought it was Minas Tirith and Minas Morgul but then what does a Fool of a Took know?
It seems that the title was picked by the publishers and JRRT wasn't exactly thrilled with it. From The Letters of JRR Tolkien, 143 From a letter To Rayner Unwin 22 January 1954
I am sending now Book III, first half of Vol. II, carefully corrected. Book IV is nearly done and shall follow on Monday.I have also revised Vol. III and can let you have the MS. of that (as far as the end of the story) as soon as you wish. The matter for the extra 50 pages I shall not be able to do just yet.
I am not at all happy about the title 'the Two Towers'. It must if there is any real reference in it to Vol II refer to Orthanc and the Tower of Cirith Ungol. But since there is so much made of the basic opposition of the Dark Tower and Minas Tirith, that seems very misleading. There is, of course, actually no real connecting link between Books III and IV, when cut off and presented separately as a volume.
Sneak a peak at the last half...just to make sure he's okay.
Aragorn and Legolas are wind hogs!
'You left the East Wind to me,' said Gimli, 'but I will say naught of it.''That is as it should be,' said Aragorn. 'In Minas Tirith they endure the East Wind, but they do not ask it for tidings.'
I bet it doesn't get changed. If the rumors are true, they won't get to Cirith Ungol until the third movie.
I think there are still wings, no one got sent to the corner today. if ksen shows up there, don't let him have any!
Also, they've been waiting for Frodo to decide all that time. Frodo made his decision to go alone so maybe respect for Frodo helped Aragorn make up his mind to follow the two youner hobbits.
Aragorn wanted to save the hobbits that he thought were defenseless in the situation (his heroic nature). We also know that he (Aragorn) knew that Minas Tirith was truly his goal -- to claim the kingship. And he seemed drawn in that direction even from the start -- and not drawn toward Mordor, where Frodo had to go. There is no doubt that Sauron was not expecting a lone (or two) hobbits, unaided by an army, to infiltrate Mordor -- and was much caught by surprise when suddenly his end appeared at the Mountain of Doom. Aragorn's presence with Frodo would have put the "radar" up everywhere, and much reduced the chances of success. Aragorn was a lightning-rod in that situation -- his presence would not have allowed the Orcs to write off the capture of Frodo (later on) as merely an unusual spy of no great account -- so Sauron's attention would have been immediately drawn to Frodo if Aragorn had been with him.
Well g'nad and I do, but we're above average.
Dwarves channel their creativity through the work of their hands, not their voices. We're doers rather than talkers (or singers).
Well that would certainly satisfy the goobers that were trying to change the name of the movie...then again, maybe it wouldn't.
I think the reasonable split at that point would have sent Legolas in search of Frodo and Sam by himself. All three of the remaining fellowship members were quite capable of operating in the woods alone, and Legolas might have been able to track Frodo and Sam. While his presence would have ruined the mission as Tolkein wrote the situation, I think Legolas and two hobbits would have had a better chance of sneaking into Mordor than any other combination.
Rather than chasing the orcs that took Merry and Pippin, I would have taken Gimli and gone directly to Minas Tirith or maybe to the Paths of the Dead. While no one can fault the compassion in the choice to try to rescue the two hobbits, Aragorn's real obligation would have been elsewhere. Gimli would have been a helpful fellow fighter if Aragorn had encountered trouble on the way to Minas Tirith, but Gimli would have sorta been out of the story at that point.
A third option would have been for Gimli to chase the orcs alone while Aragorn went to Minas Tirith. Gimli likely wouldn't have made as much progress or ever made contact with the riders of Rohan. This option would have again put him out of the story except maybe to wander to Minas Tirith eventually.
WFTR
Bill
It took a great deal of humility and wisdom (great qualities for kings and anyone else) to admit that he could no longer assist the most important aspect of the mission, and to attempt it would only guarantee failure. All his physical prowess and command authority, even as king, would not do the job. All he can do is trust in some unlikely hobbits, while he turned to lesser, but still vital, tasks.
Considering the towering egos (justified or not) of politicians and kings, this was a remarkable action on Aragorn's part.
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