Posted on 07/09/2025 8:50:56 PM PDT by P.O.E.
Forgiveness isnt for the other person. Its so that you can get past it and move on. Lots of times life gets placed on hold and you’re stuck. Fixated. Obssessed. Forgivensss is giving yourself the ability to continue on with life.
It doesnt mean no accountability or no consequences for the other person(s). It really means you won’t let them have this continuing power over you, taking up your thoughts and time and mental energy.
You can forgive someone, but have consequences. Like never seeing them again. Or never having a certain kind of relationship ever again. Because some things aren’t fixable once broken.
Johannes Gutenberg was the inventor of the printing press and widely regarded as the one who brought literacy to the masses. It all began with the Gutenberg Bible and its initial print run of 180 copies. Little known, however, is that one of his investors managed to take his printing press and all of his supplies when he couldn’t repay his debts. Gutenberg eventually got another printing press with the help of friends but never realized the financial gains he was owed.
One of those two men is revered. The other is largely forgotten. Both are dead, but Johannes Gutenberg arguably got his ultimate revenge: he is now immortal.
Good points.
I believe I have the strongest desire for revenge of anyone on FR. Everything is unsatisfying unless it culminates in revenge. A sad way of life.
I am the person the many forgiveness authors and Kimmel look down upon.
Dr. Thane Rosenbaum, author of Payback: the Case For Revenge and Gary Egeberg and Wayne Raiter, authors of The Forgiveness Myth might have compassion for me.
The Payback author would say everyone else hypocritically lets the state imprison people or give them the death penalty on their behalf as “justice” when deep down it is for revenge. And people don’t like to admit schadenfreude.
If someone argues with me, ask a few people what to do with people who habitually torture dogs or who rape and murder a number of young children. Then point out the details of how particular ones were victorious in court through technicalities or withheld confessions and evidence the judge rules on, or had a crafty lawyer get them off as they laughed at the losers in the courtroom.
Coda.
Never in my life have I actually gotten revenge. I end up doing something kind or virtuous instead. Probably why I still have sleep problems and ruminate about the past.
So we should go back to reading and studying the Bible? Perhaps Matthew 5?
You’re right.
Bible was part of my summer reading project last year. I admit skimming the “begats” sections, but “Psalms” slowed me down (would read a few then get tripped up by one that would strike my fancy and get lost re-reading it). I’m going to put it back on “resume” this summer.
I agree - forgiveness does not mean no consequences.
Spot on.
A person close to you who betrays you must still be forgiven, right? But, as you can imagine, going up to them and saying, I forgive you for this and such bad thing you did to me, is ever so likely to go over like a lead balloon. So, a better practice is to forgive the person, to commence praying for them, specifically by name, and, should you have occasion as time goes on to interact with that person (it’s presumed that you may have been forced to limit such interactions, even more or less eliminate those interactions which are discretionary), to behave toward that person in such a way as to cause them to think: I’ve been forgiven!
Charity gives us a way out of resentment and injustices.
Saints look at their neighbors from the perspective of Heaven.
________________
St. Thomas More
Why should I now hate one for a while, who shall hereafter love me forever more, and why should I be now then an enemy to him with whom I shall in time be coupled in eternal friendship?
But on the other side, if he will continue to be wicked, and be damned, then is there such an outrageous eternal sorrow before this poor man, that I may think myself a deadly cruel wretch if I would not now pity his pain, than malign his person?
Almighty God, have mercy on __n__ and __n__, and on all that bear me evil will and would harm me, have mercy on them, and by such easy and tender and merciful means as thee can best devise, grant that their faults and mine may both be amended and redressed, and make us saved souls in Heaven together, where we may ever live and love together with thee and thy blessed saints.
O glorious Trinity, grant this for the sake of the bitter passion of our sweet Savior Christ.
Amen.
Please see This Guy’s #’s 48 and 49, and consider doing as This Guy has been doing for the past, oh, about four years.
Pro tip: Keep your list of names (__n__, __n__) in strict confidentiality, and...in pencil!
I agree.
No thanks. Holding people accountable is not ‘revenge’.
There’s a difference between the two. Accountability and consequences are still needed. But I think the author’s talking about the physiology of the emotions of revenge.
Forgiveness opens the prison door - and we find the prisoner was us.
Re “… The greatest revenge is outliving your adversary...”
Yeah, maybe… but seeing our adversary dragged off to jail for real crimes and THEN outliving them is even better.
No one should ever get away with harming other people… but too many do.
I get the forgiveness side but comparing revenge tendencies to alcohol and drug addiction is looking for away to justify the issue. Oh he’s addicted to revenge and needs counseling. I’m not buying that.
Responsibility for your actions. You make a bad choice you need to pay.
Charles Bronson could not be reached for comment.
You saved me a lot of keystrokes.
Capital Murder trial 1995…a witness had finished testimony and was dismissed with neither side electing right to recall him.
In the hallway of the courthouse I found him seated on a bench and I took a good picture of his face and walked off.
He had a fit inside the hallway and the DA investigator came up to me with the butt hurt guy. Both knew who I was and I told butt hurt that it was best that we never cross paths ever again.
Like what the left seeks everyday in every way possible ?
No , this plea from the left for forgiveness, a virtue of and from the Godly that they mock and gun for every day , is the height of rank hypocrisy.
Justice is not revenge, no matter how loud the left shouts that it is.
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