Posted on 08/14/2024 8:10:19 PM PDT by logi_cal869
Passengers aboard an Alaska Airlines flight bound for Jackson Hole, Wyoming, were miffed last week after the pilot explained over the intercom that he could not land the plane at their destination. Instead, the flight was diverted to Salt Lake City.
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“Hey, I’m really sorry folks, but due to me not having the proper qualification to land in Jackson Hole, we need to divert to Salt Lake City, Utah. We’ll keep you posted on the next steps,” the pilot explained.
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After the flight diversion to Salt Lake, the Reddit poster said the pilot offered no further explanation and simply left the plane.
“[T]he pilot got off the plane (in a walk of shame since his bag was in the overhead in the back of the plane lol) and then a new pilot from Salt Lake City got on the plane and we flew into Jackson,” the passenger posted.
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The Jackson Hole Airport is at an elevation of over 6,451 feet and is framed by the Teton Range, soaring more than 13,000 feet in elevation. Experienced pilots report the approach as “tricky” because of frequent downdrafts and windshear, combined with a short runway.
The complexities of landing at JAC earn the airport a Special PIC (pilot in command) qualification for the airport — in place since 1990 — as well as a SAAT level 4 rating, requiring a more experienced line check airman sitting copilot.
Each individual airline has its own standards of training requiring varying minimum hours of flight time.
Many qualified captains with thousands of flight hours may not meet company minimums behind the wheel of a particular aircraft or flying into certain airports with ceiling and visibility minimum requirements.
(Excerpt) Read more at cowboystatedaily.com ...
One of my first times flying in a small plane, we crossed the mountain next to the airport after a long climb, and hit a downdraft.
Didn’t need to change my pants, but it was close. Mountains next to airports create very tricky wind patterns.
Tricky airport.
Still funny that this happened after it was in the air.
But does he IDENTIFY as qualified? If so, then no problem.
Yes, especially in the summer. My dad used to fly for Braniff.
I live near Baltimore and you’re exactly correct. People think a 3-hour drive is similar to an Everest expedition. For my job, 10-12-hour drives are common. My wife and I will be doing a cross-country road trip to Washington State in a few weeks. I can’t wait to get west of the Mississippi into God’s Country.
We bought a overland camping rooftop tent rig and will be picking it up and camping all the way home.
I’ve flown into Jackson Hole many times as the Teton National Park is our favorite backpacking destination (even backpacked there for our honeymoon). It’s so beautiful that it makes me forget how dangerous it is to land there. I always felt like landing in San Diego (where I went to visit grandchildren for several years) is a lot scarier…. Flying down into a valley, between tall buildings!
If this was an Alaskan Airline flight what does that have to do wuth AA or SW?
I’m not going to read the whole way to the end of the thread, but I will try to explain.
Each airline has different FAA approved qualification criteria for “Special Airports”. Many Special Airports require the first entry to be done with an approved company Check Airman in the cockpit. (Some require the Check Airman to be in a pilot seat. Some allow the Check Airman to be in the cockpit jump seat).
Some Special Airports may be approved for first entry to be accomplished without a Check Airman if the First Officer has made entry before and certain weather conditions are met. Those conditions could be wind, landing runway, ceiling, visibility, etc. it’s all between the airline and the FAA with consideration being given to past practice and company training practices. There is not, AND SHOULD NOT BE, a one size fits all requirement.
Today’s computerized crew scheduling and dispatch systems make it nearly impossible to send an unqualified crew member to a Special Airport. I’m guessing the company tried to squeeze too much blood out of the staffing turnip and got burned. Unfortunately we are snickering at the pilot for doing the right thing.
EC
The Flight Plan was in Spanish Braille Ebonics and nobody on the flight could translate it.
Full disclosure: I am NOT a commercial pilot and have never been through any airline's training - to include FAA regs - whatsoever.
That stated, are you suggesting that a US-trained/certified commercial airline pilot would NOT know of the VERY SHORT LIST of PIC-certified airports in the contiguous US and that his/her/its known destination before pushback wasn't among his/her/its qualifications?
This incident smacks of a dei eff up: An unqualified pilot promoted to a position of authority - piloting >9 passengers - without enough responsibility to know up front that the office screwed up before entering the landing pattern.
Yeah, I could be wrong. But the gaslighting nature of the story supports my view.
He knew before he took off, as did the co-pilot and others managing Alaska flights that day. The special requirements for landing at Jackson are not a secret. What to do about now that they’ve been caught?
Yeah, we carry a flip chart of airports in the US with all the information about it.https://www.flightaware.com/resources/airport/KJAC/APD/AIRPORT+DIAGRAM
What type of aircraft was he flying? I’m thinking a twin turbo of some kind.
> That stated, are you suggesting that a US-trained/certified commercial airline pilot would NOT know of the VERY SHORT LIST of PIC-certified airports in the contiguous US and that his/her/its known destination before pushback wasn’t among his/her/its qualifications?<
Quite the opposite. The pilot knew exactly what the requirements were, hence, the diversion. I’m suggesting the company felt they could get away with sending him there by wagering the weather and conditions would be sufficient…..and something changed.
Through my 41 years as an airline pilot I’ve seen these squeeze plays happen many times. Most of the time they work. Now with the over abundance of social media, every screwup becomes international public news and everyone becomes an overnight expert.
I could be completely wrong since I don’t have all of the facts. I’m just hesitant to blame the pilot because I’ve seen “pilot pushing” too many times in my life.
More on “pilot pushing”:
https://www.alpa.org/news-and-events/air-line-pilot-magazine/schedule-with-safety-ftdt
EC
I wholeheartedly disagree. I believe it was about the certifications.
(due to Watching my son go thru the whole process.)
Hmmm - on a 6300ft rwy ...
My point exactly.
They’re sweeping it under the rug, just like the nonexistent assassination attempt, and in this case it exposes the ongoing endangerment of the flying public with federal policies both in the cockpit and the ‘tower’ so-to-speak. This also exposes a much deeper problem at the airline level (not just dei, but ‘pilot shortages’) which were denied throughout the plandemic (i.e., ‘mandates’).
It’s all gaslighting. If I’m wrong, so be it.
But somebody prove you/me wrong. Right?
It's the Pelosi Flight Plan.
You have to accept the flight plan and take off before you can see what is in the flight plan.
PLANES LANDING AT SAN DIEGO COME IN LIKE A MALLARD ONTO A POND.
HA! True.
Yep. Our entire culture has changed dramatically over just the past three years. Behaviors that would have once resulted in immediate and severe punitive actions (the firing of the SS Director after the assassination attempt —or better yet, her somewhat honorable resignation in order to allow an unbiased investigation and protect the reputation of her Department— for example) are now accepted; decency and common sense seem to have surrendered. Every aspect of society is just ‘off’ in a peculiar and unnerving way, and it leaves me with an uneasy feeling in my chest...
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