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The Dangers of Ukrainian Revanchism
The American Conservative ^ | Jan 28, 2023 | Michael Warren Davis

Posted on 01/30/2023 12:37:10 PM PST by MarMema

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"Why on earth would anyone argue that we should support Ukraine’s claim? There’s only one possible answer. The United States simply wants to hobble Russia. "
1 posted on 01/30/2023 12:37:10 PM PST by MarMema
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To: MarMema
As far as the territory Ukraine held before the current war, Putin's alchemy has transmuted millions of Russian speakers into ardent Ukrainians.

Regarding Crimea, who actually knows since there certainly have not been anything like free and fair elections since Russia's takeover. As far as booting the Russian population out, it seems like fair play given Moscow's tradition of replacing the local populations in its empires with Russians.

2 posted on 01/30/2023 12:44:41 PM PST by pierrem15 ("Massacrez-les, car le seigneur connait les siens" )
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To: pierrem15

“Putin’s alchemy has transmuted millions of Russian speakers into ardent Ukrainians.”

So very true.

I remember speaking to Ukrainians in Warsaw back in 2010-2012 and all were pretty meh about national identity.

But Putin’s invasion has made them ardent Ukrainians


3 posted on 01/30/2023 12:48:23 PM PST by Cronos
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To: pierrem15
As far as the territory Ukraine held before the current war, Putin's alchemy has transmuted millions of Russian speakers into ardent Ukrainians.

This hasn't happened at all. Ukraine's war against the Donbass since 2014 has transformed Ukraine's Russian-speaking population into hardcore Putinists.

Regarding Crimea, who actually knows

If you've been to Crimea, you'd know. It's totally pro-Russian.

4 posted on 01/30/2023 12:51:03 PM PST by Right_Wing_Madman
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To: MarMema
Crimea and the Donbas (the easternmost part of Ukraine, which contains Donetsk and Luhansk) are ethnically Russian. They speak Russian.

Were they majority Russian before the war? NO. All these regions of Ukraine(Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia and Kherson), except Crimea are MAJORITY Ukrainian. Language does not always correspond to national identity. Something Putin and fellow Russians cannot seem to understand.

Russian troops appear to open fire on Ukrainian protesters in occupied-Kherson

5 posted on 01/30/2023 12:52:39 PM PST by tlozo (Better to Die on Your Feet than Live on Your Knees )
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To: tlozo

“Were they majority Russian before the war? NO.”

Actually they were.

What makes you think otherwise?


6 posted on 01/30/2023 12:56:57 PM PST by MarMema (Orange Putin Bad)
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To: Cronos

🇵🇱Megalomania and corruption have brought Ukraine to a deplorable state, the ex-Foreign Minister of Poland believes.

In an interview with Krytyka Polityczna, Radoslav Sikorsky noted that the Ukrainian elites hid their corruption behind stories about a big game with the USA, Russia, China and Europe and wasted time.

The former Foreign Minister recalled that after leaving the USSR, Ukraine was in a better condition than Poland due to fertile lands, nuclear power plants and the aircraft industry. And by the beginning of the special operation, its GDP was already four times less than the Polish one.

Ukrainians now have to pay dearly for the actions of the current government, Sikorsky summed up.

Earlier, he stated that in the early days of the special military operation, Poland was considering the option of dividing Ukraine.


7 posted on 01/30/2023 1:00:30 PM PST by MarMema (Orange Putin Bad)
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To: MarMema
Well, there's a second answer, ... it's a lot easier to steal from Russia using Ukraine and expendable Ukrainians as a Front.

Of course no American war has ever been about economics, WE fight for Principle only.

8 posted on 01/30/2023 1:02:30 PM PST by Navy Patriot (Celebrate Decivilization)
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To: tlozo

The Ukrainians also engaged in widespread ethnic cleansing in Odessa, Kharkov, etc. The neoliberal USA regime provided tacit approval- this are the same tactics that have been employed against Serbians in “Kosovo” and Bosnia.


9 posted on 01/30/2023 1:02:55 PM PST by mikegreenwell39
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To: tlozo
All these regions of Ukraine(Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia and Kherson), except Crimea are MAJORITY Ukrainian.

Then why are the Donbass militias, who are Ukrainian, allied with Russia against the Ukrainian government? Shouldn't it be the other way around? Why are they fighting for the wrong side? Putin mind trick? An international communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids?

10 posted on 01/30/2023 1:03:02 PM PST by Right_Wing_Madman
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To: Cronos

🇮🇩 Anti-war rally in Poland.
They demand to stop dragging Poland into the war.

https://t.me/fr0m_Russia_with_L0ve/15331


11 posted on 01/30/2023 1:06:10 PM PST by MarMema (Orange Putin Bad)
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To: MarMema; pierrem15

Putin’s annexation of Eastern Ukrainian territories has put Crimea back on the table.

It demoted Crimea from the unique status of “voluntarily associated part of Russia” to just another territory in the list of Russian land grabs in violation of the treaties signed and acknowledged by Putin.

The West’s grudging acceptance of the fact from 2014 is now gone.


12 posted on 01/30/2023 1:08:06 PM PST by Cronos
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To: Right_Wing_Madman

It was 44% pro Russian before Putin invaded in 2014.


13 posted on 01/30/2023 1:08:47 PM PST by Cronos
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To: MarMema
it’s easy to forget that this conflict really began in 2014, when separatists in Donetsk and Luhansk declared their independence from Kiev.

never mind the alphabet agency backed overthrow of the government in Kiev prior to that.
14 posted on 01/30/2023 1:09:13 PM PST by mrmeyer (You can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him. Roberor thert Heinlein)
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To: tlozo

Residents of Kupyansk await the return of the Russian army

The correspondent of The Economist visited the Kharkiv region and talked with people living there.

▪️The publication reports that people are filming the Ukrainian military on camera and tracking the movements of representatives of the administration.

▪️Residents of Kupyansk try to watch Russian channels that the Armed Forces of Ukraine are unable to drown out, the journalist says.

The Economist correspondent notes that the majority of the region’s residents have always been pro-Russian.

▪️ Of the 214 members of the local city council, 200 people left for Russia with Russian troops before the arrival of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

Some of them maintain relations with local pro-Russian activists and provide news to the population.

https://t.me/fr0m_Russia_with_L0ve/15310


15 posted on 01/30/2023 1:09:28 PM PST by MarMema (Orange Putin Bad)
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To: MarMema
“Were they majority Russian before the war? NO.”

Actually they were.

What makes you think otherwise?

Perhaps the facts:

Share of ethnic ukrainians among the population of Ukraine, census 2001


16 posted on 01/30/2023 1:09:53 PM PST by Petrosius
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To: MarMema

Russian fake news.

Russians in Putin’s Russia are liars. No wonder honest Russians, 1 million of them, have fled Russia since march 2022


17 posted on 01/30/2023 1:10:02 PM PST by Cronos
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To: tlozo

Why isn’t that young man protesting on the tank in the military fighting for The Zelenskyy?


18 posted on 01/30/2023 1:10:33 PM PST by JonPreston
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To: Cronos

🇮🇩 The Polish brothers are tired of friendship with Ukrainians and use their flag for the stove.

Great video.

https://t.me/fr0m_Russia_with_L0ve/15246


19 posted on 01/30/2023 1:15:52 PM PST by MarMema (Orange Putin Bad)
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To: Right_Wing_Madman

One would think the number of Ukrainian army volunteers and conscripts from Donbass would be much greater than the number of DPR/LHR militia…right

Fighting for liberation


20 posted on 01/30/2023 1:43:08 PM PST by silverleaf (“Freedom ultimately means the right of other people to do things that you disagree with”. T. Sowell )
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