Posted on 05/16/2021 7:22:09 AM PDT by DIRTYSECRET
:Because the growing communist menace was just not an abstract idea, but a growing military threat to democracy and the western world. Have you not heard of the decades-long Cold War between the US and Russia with all their nukes?”
From one Navy vet to another, I absolutely knew about the nukes. The submarine I served on was one of about six that faced down the Soviets off the coast of Cuba with torpedo tubes fully loaded and ready to launch. So, yes, I know all about that!
Our government plays chess with our lives. While I believed the BS about the USSR taking over Vietnam at the time, I saw the light and now believe our government did not know what the hell they were doing. On the other hand, maybe they did and they just had another goal in mind. They used the Soviets as a psyops campaign to try and convince the American public to send our best there to fight a jungle war with their hands tied behind their back.
Think about this. Russia is still fully armed with nukes that could turn us into a glass parking lot and they are standing up for their country — something we should do, but are only doing a half-ass job. We focus on political correctness in our military with LGBQTXYZ and transgender rights while our adversaries are fighting to win a war — not socially engineer their military.
Think about it. Almost 20 years later the USSR collapsed thanks to Reagan and his Star Wars agenda (which was poo-pooed by the dems as a fantasy). The lies the govt has told us reads like a novel. Only their lies are called psyops and they don’t send their own kids to die. They’ve used it in other countries and they have used it on us. How can any sane person look back over the last four years of Trump and not come to that conclusion? It goes on to this day and it has gone on for a very long time.
I am proud of my service. I lost friends in Vietnam and saw many come back broken into pieces. I would have given my life for my country in the ‘60s but not the country I live in now. They left me — I didn’t leave them.
The last real war we fought was WWII. Everything since has been a psyop, half-ass effort.
I had a very dear friend who taught German to inner-city kids in Dallas. I didn’t know him when he had considered going to Canada with the support of his family. He ended up with a high lottery number and wasn’t called. It was a constant agony for him that he considered going. He was killed when an illegal uninsured Mexican killed him at an intersection on a Saturday morning. I will never decry my volunteering for Vietnam and going (67-69). But I feel shamed that a Nation doesn’t give a shit about the loss of 58K+ who could have had a decent life. It wasn’t worth the lives to test the Soviets. Listen to the words, “And the Band Played Waltzing Matilda” which describes those who came home exactly.
The reason we fought was to stop the takeover of South Vietnam by evil, communist bastards who got heavy support from the rest of the communist bastards. We were there to keep the friendlies safe and only peripherally there to keep the Soviets out.
I'm proud of you that you went - as I did and my younger brother did too.
We learned that our country lacked the guts and determination to stick with it. We learned that our country could turn against us - can you imagine how things would have gone if most young American men volunteered and the enemy had to face a country united? The VC/NVA would never have had a chance.
I really don't give a damn whether our country cared about us or all of those fine young men we lost. I care about those young guys we knew and their families care about them - and we learned a very important lesson about the limits of our country's faith in us and themselves.
The most difficult part of that war was that we were there to kill the enemy (or at least convince him to quit) while protecting the people. That meant that we couldn't "bomb them back to the stone age" like WWII. I had some dullwitted WWII vet, a former gunner on a B-24 ask me "why can't you win your war like we won ours?". Simple: we weren't there to kill everyone in sight and if we had, how many allies would ever ask for our help again?
“My view is much different than yours. If Vietnam was so important why didn’t we fight that war to win?”
Because rarely discussed, but right there in the minds of our leaders, was the Korean war a few short years earlier. Nearly 1.5 million Chinese joined the war when we stormed right up to the Chinese border. We were being very careful to not provoke a similar reaction by invading North Vietnam or something. Not only might they invade to assist North Vietnam, they might start the festivities in Korea again, and god only knows what the Russians would do with that opportunity.
So when people say “we didn’t fight all out”, or “we should have landed and taken Hanoi”, there were some damned big worries besides how the meat grinder was going for our men. Maybe the policy makers didn’t do it all right, but the effort in Vietnam did not exist in a vacuum. It wasn’t and couldn’t be fought as though the rest of the world didn’t exist.
That made it suck more for our guys who knew how it woulda happened in WWII, but it really couldn’t.
A lot of people in charge were very scared about stumbling into a world war, or a giant land war with China. And we were about a decade into a truly credible Soviet nuclear threat. There was a lot of learning this new nuclear world and exactly where the limits were.
In reality, the strategic moves were probably about as good as could be done within the larger world picture. Really sucked for our men, but that’s probably just one more thing that did.
“In reality, the strategic moves were probably about as good as could be done within the larger world picture. Really sucked for our men, but that’s probably just one more thing that did.”
Well, we agree on one thing, “it really did suck for our men!” Especially for the ones that came back in body bags or left their limbs in Vietnam. Tell that to the families that lost their son, husband, or father. It sucked.
You and I will continue to disagree on the “Why” that made that sacrifice. We’ve put men on the moon and robots and drones on Mars. Certainly, the most powerful country on the planet could have found a way to win a war with a third-world country — and they did not do it.
From one Navy vet to another.
“Simple: we weren’t there to kill everyone in sight and if we had, how many allies would ever ask for our help again?”
I chose to enlist without any duress. I don’t know your situation but I’m sure you served honorably and you went through hell. I get that.
My viewpoint is not with you and those like you, but the people who sent you. It was all a game to them. And we in the military were the pawns.
I can’t change your mind and you certainly will not change my mind.
Thank you for the sacrifices you made for what you thougt was a noble cause.
A very true statement. Just ask any Servicemember that walked through, rolled through or limped thru an American airport in uniform in the 60's or early 70's. The Band played Waltzing Matilda may have been about Aussie troops from WW1, but the reception they got that prompted these lyrics were echoed for returnees from the 'Nam.
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They collected the wounded, the crippled, the maimed And they shipped us back home to Australia The armless, the legless, the blind and the insane Those proud wounded heroes of Suvla And when the ship pulled into Circular Quay I looked at the place where me legs used to be And thank Christ there was no one there waiting for me To grieve and to mourn and to pity And the Band played Waltzing Matilda When they carried us down the gangway Oh nobody cheered, they just stood there and stared Then they turned all their faces away Now every April I sit on my porch And I watch the parade pass before me I see my old comrades, how proudly they march Renewing their dreams of past glories I see the old men all tired, stiff and worn Those weary old heroes of a forgotten war And the young people ask "What are they marching for?" And I ask myself the same question And the band plays Waltzing Matilda And the old men still answer the call But year after year, their numbers get fewer Someday, no one will march there at all
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Absolutely! Can’t listen to this song without going back to the 1960’s and shed a tear for those who never had a chance to pursue life, liberty and happiness.
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