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I'm going out of my comfort zone on this one but the article in The Federalist glossed over this and I couldn't let it go.
1 posted on 02/18/2021 8:30:54 AM PST by ProgressingAmerica
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To: x

Were you aware of this?


2 posted on 02/18/2021 8:32:14 AM PST by ProgressingAmerica (Public meetings are superior to newspapers)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

Bkmrk


3 posted on 02/18/2021 8:35:59 AM PST by RushIsMyTeddyBear (RIP my "teddy bear".)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

Hegel, Kant, Sneezchie, Marx. These men were moochers who lived on the nickels of others. Their “philosophies” lead to the most brutally and senselessly murderous era in human history. And it’s not over yet as pedo-Joe tosses China’s oppressed minorities under the bus.


4 posted on 02/18/2021 8:36:34 AM PST by Seruzawa (TANSTAAFL)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

The Hegelian philosophy of thesis-antithesis-synthesis is the foundation for postmodern relativism. It essentially denies the existence of objective reality.


7 posted on 02/18/2021 8:49:26 AM PST by circlecity
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To: ProgressingAmerica

I blame this on Snooki and her new TV show.


8 posted on 02/18/2021 8:50:44 AM PST by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer”)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

I hope no one is looking for philosophical consistency in the slave-holding South in the 19th century. Those fellows had huge swaths of conscience cauterized. Hard to make all the philosophical pieces fit together in that condition.


9 posted on 02/18/2021 8:53:08 AM PST by Migraine ( Liberalism is great (until it happens to YOU).)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

“ We’re led to believe by Civil War buffs and professional historians alike that the Confederacy was this pinnacle of conservative thought or at least deeply conservative in its outlook.”

Philosophy isn’t my thing, but this sounds like BS to me.


10 posted on 02/18/2021 8:53:15 AM PST by bk1000 (Banned from Breitbart)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

Both Marx and Hegel had interesting analysis and terrible prescriptions.


11 posted on 02/18/2021 8:58:03 AM PST by RedStateRocker ("Never miss a good chance to Shut Up" - Will Rogers)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

What a waste of digital bytes in writing this.

That war was very similar to today. That is, two sides could not get along. There were many reasons for that war but, of course, slavery gets the wrap for the whole thing — which is, of course, fake news.

The book Albion’s Seed (http://bit.ly/2Ir3J3M) explains the social and “lifeway” divide that existed in this country which traced its roots back to the mother country. They did not get along in the mother country and, for the most part, they brought it here when they arrived on these shores 400 years ago.

That divide was with us and building up to 1861. And, it did not end in 1865, either.


13 posted on 02/18/2021 9:05:50 AM PST by icclearly
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To: ProgressingAmerica

Who wrote this garbage?


14 posted on 02/18/2021 9:14:45 AM PST by jmacusa (Liberals. Too stupid to be idiots.)
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To: ProgressingAmerica
You'll be truly comforted to know that Lincoln was quite an admirer of Marx's and courted the domestic communist movement. He was so supportive of the struggles of his fellow travelers that he practically drafted the whole of North America's share of the ‘48er diaspora into the Union army and head-hunted officers of the failed revolution for direct appointment into leading positions in his officer corps. He enjoined the unanimous support of self-declared communists the world over and communist histories never fail to endorse him. Perhaps, since you claimed to have studied, you know of a communist historical treatment which takes the side against him.
15 posted on 02/18/2021 9:29:01 AM PST by Brass Lamp
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To: ProgressingAmerica
I dont know how widespread belief or even knowledge of Hegelian thought was in The South, but it seems the ideas mentioned are little different from the concept of "white man's burden" or the attempts at civilizing the natives that missionaries engaged in when getting tribesmen to wear clothes and sing Christian hymns.

Accusing southerners of being closet commies is a stretch. It seems more like they used Hegel to aid in their rationalization of slavery.

16 posted on 02/18/2021 9:33:15 AM PST by who_would_fardels_bear (This is not my current tagline.)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

“Just how deep did the rejection of the Founding Fathers go with those in the south in the 1800s?”

Rejection? Plenty of the Founding Fathers were Southerners. And Southerners in the 1800s took the Founders at their word, especially the Declaration of Independence.


17 posted on 02/18/2021 9:36:46 AM PST by odawg
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To: ProgressingAmerica
The issue is how on earth do we arrive at a place where the southern confederacy is constantly cast as a bastion of conservatism when deep examinations of their ideological works unearths collectivism, Marxism, and Hegelianism?

Nonsense. Their 'ideological works' were primarily to protect, maintain and extend the institution of chattel slavery. Any and every resource possible to further that goal would have been used - including trendy German philosophers.
19 posted on 02/18/2021 9:39:21 AM PST by larrytown (i like pie)
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To: ProgressingAmerica

I think the correct thinker to look at here is the formidable Calhoun. It is certainly correct to note that in many respects he was Hegelian; perhaps in his analysis of class and economics in history, even a bit Marxist - though he probably wouldn’t have thought in those terms.

Calhoun was utterly brilliant. But I think in time we will conclude that his deep thinking was outside the boundaries of what America can accommodate philosophically speaking. And politically speaking.....


25 posted on 02/18/2021 10:53:29 AM PST by ConservativeDude
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To: ProgressingAmerica

We’re led to believe by Civil War buffs and professional historians alike that the Confederacy was this pinnacle of conservative thought or at least deeply conservative in its outlook.”

Ummmmmmmm.......no.

no and no

Not if human liberty and flourishing and civilization is a “goal” of conservatism.

Now all that said....the South had an aristocratic culture, and a healthy culture, should always have aristocratic elements in it. Because of our collective irrational hatred of the South (they are Americans too, so many forget), we tend to not see the beauty in aristocracy. That’s a big topic, and of course, aristocracy (like democracy) has its own inherent defects. But aristocracy is important...it does promote human flourishing when it is part of the mix.

The South is not an enemy. But it’s not the pinnacle of conservatism.


26 posted on 02/18/2021 10:59:28 AM PST by ConservativeDude
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To: ProgressingAmerica

Sorry but the Federalist did not gloss over it and is seems you are making false assumptions. It was Hegel and Marx who were influenced by the implications of the American Republic and not vice versa. Southerners were not advocating for Hegel or Marx but were advocating for the principles of the founding fathers regarding states rights and the importance of a decentralized federal government.


27 posted on 02/18/2021 11:30:08 AM PST by MichaelRDanger
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To: ProgressingAmerica

Marx was interested in what was happening in America. He wrote many articles against slavery and supported Lincoln and the Yankees.


30 posted on 02/18/2021 11:34:48 AM PST by mjp ((pro-{God, reality, reason, egoism, individualism, natural rights, limited government, capitalism}))
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To: ProgressingAmerica

The South most definitely did not reject the founding fathers. They embraced them. The vast majority of the Founding Fathers were in fact, Southerners themselves. Washington, Jefferson, Madison, Monroe, Patrick Henry, James Mason, John Jay, etc etc.

Marx and his disciples were in fact more sympathetic to the North because they were interested in centralizing power. They detested the idea of decentralized power. Decentralized power which the South supported was the antithesis of their whole ideology.


31 posted on 02/18/2021 11:51:48 AM PST by FLT-bird
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To: ProgressingAmerica
Hegel thought Africa was wild and uncivilized and had no place in the development of civilization. It's not hard to see how he came to that opinion. Sub-Saharan Africa was off the usual path of the development of civilization. But in fact Africa did have cities and states and was where mankind first began. While Africa didn't produce great individual thinkers, it did develop working human societies, so the idea that the natives were only fit to be slaves has serious problems with it. Hegel apparently had no knowledge of these civilizations and assumed the whole continent only had tribes, bands, and uninhabited jungles and deserts. It's not surprising that Lamar would draw on him to justify a social order based on slavery.

Interestingly, Martin Luther King cited Hegel's idea of freedom expanding through conflict as an important influence on his own thought.

34 posted on 02/18/2021 12:55:08 PM PST by x
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