Posted on 09/05/2019 5:43:26 AM PDT by FtrPilot
“Dr Bernstein is 84 years old type 1 who has done keto for years. You should see him. He is extremely healthy and very fit.”
Yep. That guy is incredible!
Sure thing, you’re in!
“Bob, can you recommend any good books about Keto?”
I haven’t, and none come to mind off the top of my head. My first question is what are you looking for, as in how to do it, or perhaps the politics and history of how we got into this mess, or maybe specific recipes?
Once you’re specific, I’ll ping the list on this thread (rather than waste a new thread on it)...and we’ll see what we get!
Yep, you’re in too!
Carbs are not total evil. Protein can spike insulin as well as carbs. Beef & fish are in the 50s (51, 59) on an insulin index. Pasta at 40 and brown rice at 62. 59 for an apple and 60 for an orange.
And most of us do not eat rice by itself, for example. A handful of rice with salmon and mixed veggies is not a horrible meal. Particularly if you eat one mixed meal a day and go low carb for a snack - and eat modest amounts.
The glycemic of a flour tortilla is 30. “Cooked white rice has 0.2% fat and a GI of 64; a meal of white boiled rice, grilled hamburger, cheese, and butter has a GI of 24.” When fat is added to a carb, the MEAL’S glycemic index - and maybe its insulin index - changes.
I don’t do a keto diet in part because I don’t see a need to treat all carbs like sugar. Combining an interest in reducing my insulin spikes and wanting a rest between them, it seems eating a combination meal - one with a decent amount of fat - once a day would keep that insulin reaction modest, and eating a second light meal (500 cal or less) of reduced carbs ought to work. And then there is no need to remove the bun from every hamburger.
A McDonald’s triple cheeseburger from the value menu (about $3) has 520 calories: 28 g of fat, 35 g of carb and 32 g of protein. If that is your entire meal (with coffee or tea), I doubt your body will freak out just because there are carbs there.
Another interesting concept is glycemic LOAD versus INDEX, based on how much people actually eat at one time. Watermelon has a GI of 72 and a GL of 8. Carrots are 47 versus 2. In a beef stew, carrots and even potatoes might be fine, provided there is ample meat and some fat for flavor!
https://nutritiondata.self.com/topics/glycemic-index
My objection to Atkins and Keto are that food and our body’s reaction is much more complex than just carb/no carb. This Wiki article gives 3 scales: Glycemic, Insulin and Satiety.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_index
Apples (50, 59, 197) and oranges (39, 60, 202) don’t do too bad against beef (21, 51, 176). It won’t do much worse to your insulin and keeps you satisfied longer. So...an apple and cheese for a lunch snack, then a mixed meal at dinner may be a good way to do things.
Neither does Keto. You can eat cruciferous vegetables, that do have carbs on Keto, but not Starches. You can eat low-glycemic fruits, like berries, and they do have carbs.
I haven’t studied keto and don’t know what a cruciferous vegetable is. However, low-glycemic, to a point, misses the point. What an individual food does, eaten by itself, isn’t what it does when eaten in a mixed meal.
The “Fat is Bad” teaching shoved on us by government and the AHA for 50 years is wrong because fat is crucial to moderating the effect of high glycemic foods on our bodies. White bread, eaten by itself, is very high on the glycemic and insulin index. What about “white bread with a thick slab of butter”? I’ve never seen THAT number. But the GI of a flour tortilla - white, refined flour plus lard - is 30. Well below meat.
Could it be that Atkins and Keto are both overthinking the problem? Atkins in particular, since the book I bought on it said I should eat a minimum of 5 times a day! Could it be a healthy diet is as simple as restoring saturated fat to its rightful place as what our body needs most, and then just not eating so darn often and so darn much?
Consider the long-maligned egg. GI of 42. Insulin Index of 31. Sustainment score (I find “satiety” awkward to say and write) 150. It is a near perfect food. But apples (50, 59, 197) are also outstanding. An orange (NOT orange juice) is 39, 60, 202 - also outstanding. Now combine an apple with a slice of cheese. What happens? Don’t know, but the example of the flour tortilla makes me suspect the combined result would be a low insulin spike and little desire to eat for hours. And ONE apple and ONE oz of cheese might be enough to do the trick.
My gallbladder was removed way back in the 1970s.
I am hypothyroid, on a high dose of levothyroxine.
I have lost 110 lbs on keto, and finally feel like energetic, with no more brain fog.
This article isn’t very well researched, in my humble opinion. Also, the only studies that are worth paying attention to are clinical studies, not the cheesy epidemiological ones that got us all into trouble for the past 50 years.
I have Hashimoto’s disease of the thyroid. I have been on 125 mcg levothyroxin for years.
This is an autoimmune problem, caused by inflammation. If I had known about Keto back when it began, my internist tells me I might have been able to arrest it by doing Keto to stop the inflammation.
My internist tells me it is too late to fix it by diet, but that I might be able to slowly He is delighted with my weight loss and health improvements on Keto.
I worry about people trying keto because it is the latest “hot fad”, failing to realize that it is a way of life, not a temporary fix.
Not true in my case. I do just fine with only 20 total carbs a day.
That's a valid concern. After doing Keto with IF for a few months now, I don't see how I could ever go back to doing things the old way. I may bump up my calories a bit, but it will still be just more of the same foods I'm eating now. And frankly, I am discovering the joys of cooking my own meals, and discovering how to make "Keto-Friendly" dishes.
Hashimotos, Me too! And levo and liothyronine. Interestingly, my hash # dropped from @372 to 139 in last, recent test. Naturapath wants to know what I did. I eat low carb and lots of protein and fat...plus take lots of supplements. Could be that in past 6 months I upped my Vit C to @10,000 daily.
I think I probably would too.
Check out the youtube videos of the low carb conventions. A lot of research is being done on keto with long-distance runners and cyclers.
The findings suggest that these endurance athletes do have a drop in performance early on with the Keto Diet, but that after a few months their performance dramatically improves, and they no longer “bonk” or hit the wall.
You may not have given your body enough time to adjust.
Look up Shawn Baker and the Carnivore diet. Check out his age, and his record holding in extreme cycling.
I already know the basics of it - eating high amounts of "good" fats, limited protein, limiting carbs to 20 net grams of carbs per day, and so forth, but I was hoping to find a good book written by some trusted, reliable health professional with just a little more depth than that. (Things like what kinds and amounts of various foods to eat to ensure you get daily essential amounts of each of the vitamins, minerals, and other required nutrients (Vitamin C, Potassium, Calcium, etc., without using dairy or oranges, and so forth.)
I know we can find tons of recipes, and lots of Keto advice online, through youtube, and other places, but I was just hoping there was a compact but thorough reference guide to all those kinds of things, available in one place whenever I need it. (Some time ago, I got a couple Keto books through Amazon, but they turned out to be a small recipe book, and a shallow "guide" which offered less than I could find through Google. I think some publishers slapped a bunch of those kinds of worthless books out quickly, to take advantage of the "Keto fad", and I think those publishers artificially pump up their ratings on Amazon.
(Alternatively, do you know any specific web sites you trust that offers comprehensive Keto information like that?)
Dr. Eric Berg is a great resource, lots of videos on YouTube.
Yes, it may take a period of time to get Fat-Adapted.
Thanks for the post.
I agree there are better ways to remove your Gallbladder than with KETO.
Thanks for your response...it helps me a lot. It also explains to me what I am experiencing when I exercise. I don’t go to 90% or higher. Typically I am between 80% and 85%. My “adverse reactions” (although they are not really adverse) are similar to yours.
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