Posted on 11/11/2015 6:56:46 AM PST by xzins
The big winner was Cruz, and the big loser was Bush. See below.
Just to get started on the right foot, let's state at the outset that "the moderators" could not be the winners of a national debate. They can certainly be the losers, however, if they impede, if they are biased, or if they are infantile. That describes the CNBC moderators and the first Fox News moderators, Kelly/Wallace/Baier. They were losers.
But for moderators to 'win' means we have relegated the issues and the candidates to some kind of back row.
Who were the real winners last night?
I believe it was those who were brutally honest with us: Cruz, Paul, Trump, and Fiorina. I'll not be applauded for two of those names.
The losers were those who played the party line. These are Kasich, Bush, and Rubio.
Carson held his own but still has to turn in his assignment.
Cruz: A+ -- Senator Cruz laid it on the line with every response he gave. It was bold, brutal honesty on display. His points were amazing, and the "journalists crossing the Rio Grande" moment was the score of the night for me. He attacked illegal immigration, called the establishment candidates amnesty supporters, advocated abolishing the IRS, called for the closure of Departments of Commerce, Education, HUD, IRS, and Energy.
Paul: A -- Senator Paul makes some excellent points. It is not conservative to add new entitlement spending, and it isn't conservative to drive the nation to bankruptcy. A great military can only be great if they have the money to train, to research and develop, and to maneuver and operate.
Trump A -- Trump was absolutely brutally honest about illegal immigration. A nation without borders and a nation without laws is not a nation at all. Cruz supported that statement. Trump called China to task for violating trade agreements via money manipulation. While Paul was accurate that China isn't part of the TPP, it is also true that that treaty assumes China as a major partner of the Asian countries who are part of that treaty. Trump sticks to his themes. Some like it, and some don't. But it is disciplined.
Fiorina B+ -- Carly Fiorina was fearless in her attack on the establishment lack of budgeting. She's right on the money about knowing where each dollar is spent. Like her or not -- and some of her canned speeches are OK, but they shouldn't be issued as if they are profound -- she is right about zero based budgeting.
The Losers:
Kasich D -- Kasich is dead wrong on amnesty. Without borders and enforcement of laws we aren't a nation. Even when Kaisch says thoughtful things, he comes across as condescending to us in the audience. He acts as if he is a father instructing children.
Bush F -- Bush lost his ability to speak at one point last night. He could not articulate what he was trying to say. If that had been any of the anti-establishment candidates, it would be all we would hear reported this morning. If it happened in a debate with Hillary, he would be so pilloried in the media that the campaign would be over. And when he's finishing his sentences, even then he sounds so unsure of himself. He came out for amnesty in spades.
Rubio C+ -- You might not have noticed it last night, but Rubio came out for allowing illegal immigrants to stay in this country. He was silent on it during the debate, but said later we should build the wall (lack of courage not to support Trump on that), but then he said we can give everyone a green card for 10 years. IOW, Ten Years After they are citizens. He also wanted to add a new entitlement. I appreciate his regard for the family -- he's right that it's the foundation of society -- but a bankrupt nation doesn't help anyone.
Carson "I" -- Carson gets an incomplete. He didn't really engage beyond his personal story. He stepped carefully with every question, and I'm not sure where he'd actually come down.
I didn’t know he was an exec VP. What I do know is that he tends to avoid personal attacks, childishness, and ranting....unlike a few bombastic hosts on their sister network.
I think you are correct - in the end, it’s all a matter of character.
Differences between men and women aside, in my experience people who manage power and authority over others well and gracefully, are usually those who genuinely like and are interested in *other people*.
And liking and being interested in others generally stems from liking and being confident in *oneself*.
-JT
Four Losers: Rubio, Bush, Kasich, Carson
Jehova’s Witnesses deny the deity of Christ.
I agree with all except Carson.
He had a neutral evening.
Well, now, that would depend on whether the Republicans decide to field a winnable candidate this time around, wouldn't it?
Trump wasn’t going to pledge allegiance to the republican party unless he was fairly treated.
I’m going to say the same thing.
I’m going to watch this thing and look for fair treatment for my candidates. I support Cruz and Trump. They must be fairly treated. If not, then I’ll pull out of this.
It will be a sign of “what’s the point?” As with the McDaniels campaign this past election, if I see anything even approaching that, then I’m out of here.
Will I settle for a lesser candidate, if mine have been fairly treated...to include the delegate rules and counts? I would vote for a Carson, a Rubio, or even a Paul. (And Jindal, but he’s not going anywhere, imho.)
I’ve gotten drunk and voted for the lesser of two weasels for the last time. It may take Hillary and a good old fashioned counter revolution to get this country back.
I feel pretty good about Trump wrapping this thing up. He’s not a choke artist. He knows how to close a deal.
Voting Rubio in would be almost instant amnesty as Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell would ramrod it through Congress and Rubio would sign it whether the border was secure or not.
You can take that to the bank. And once that's signed, securing the border gets tossed out the window - once again.
Of all the candidates, Rubio's the one about whom I'm most worried. He's a silver-tongued devil.
On second thought, I agree with you. His was neutral.
My mistake, I should have said he is a Senior VP.
Dunno...you’d have to ask Maggie Thatcher or Golda Meir about that.
Extraordinary women.
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