[2ndDivisionVet]

I think they mean the Council of Nicea, not Nice.

[SkyDancer]

"In 1901 Dr. Duncan MacDougall determined that the soul weighed 21 grams by weighing dying patient’s right before and right after death. "

Maybe it's just what oxygen weighs after it is expelled from the lungs at the dying breath? Just wondering.

[Lurking Libertarian]

a board certified Past Life Regression Therapist

Stopped read right there.

[Zeneta]

Do religious experiences come from God, or are they merely the random firing of neurons in the brain? Drawing on his own research with Carmelite nuns, neuroscientist Mario Beauregard shows that genuine, life-changing spiritual events can be documented. He offers compelling evidence that religious experiences have a nonmaterial origin, making a convincing case for what many in scientific fields are loath to consider—that it is God who creates our spiritual experiences, not the brain. Beauregard and O'Leary explore recent attempts to locate a "God gene" in some of us and claims that our brains are "hardwired" for religion—even the strange case of one neuroscientist who allegedly

http://www.amazon.com/The-Spiritual-Brain-Neuroscientists-Existence/dp/0061625981

[bunkerhill7]

I done a lot of soul-searchin` lately

but never did find one...

[bigbob]

I thought they meant the Council of Noetics...oh, no that was Dan Brown.

Memory is hazy because this topic is filed right next to memories of dorm room bullsessions and beer-drinking sessions. Having played about with hypnosis in college, the past-life regression “memories” are quite fascinating, even if they are nothing more than random stream-of-consiousness fabrications of the subconscious mind.

[Kartographer]

I don’t need anyone’s word on if I have a soul. I know it because Jesus told me that it is so.

[I want the USA back]

The article does not show any scientific proof. There can not be, and will not be any scientific proof, unless you include the works of St Thomas of Aquinas under science. They are indeed science, but not under today’s interpretation of the word science.

[BerryDingle]

I always thought Soul was a kind of food.

[ottbmare]

The article cites Dr Evan Alexander, but he’s apparently a charlatan who wrote his best-selling book to make money because he was facing costly malpractice suits and was in a lot of financial trouble.

[E. Pluribus Unum]

Science has no explanation or patience for consciousness.

The only science that even touches consciousness is quantum mechanics, where nothing exists independently of a conscious observer.

Does the soul exist independently of consciousness?

Is the soul consciousness?

[G Larry]

“Past Life”?

That defies the initial judgement.

[concentric circles]

I am troubled by the title of this story. Science deals with the observation and measurement of material phenomena. If the soul is not material then it lies outside the purview of science and in the realm of psychology or religion.

The closest science can come to a conclusion of a religious nature is that the cause of a measurable effect can not be determined and proved.

This is as it should be. Religion is founded on faith, the capacity to believe, even to know and experience, that which can not be seen and touched. It is rightfully said that God is love and it is forever true that love can not be measured.

[ClearBlueSky]

“Luminous beings are we not this crude matter...” Master Jedi Yoda_The Empire Strikes Back. Kiddie movie...right. /sarc

[daniel1212]

Dr. Duncan “Om” MacDougall (c. 1866 – October 15, 1920) was an early 20th-century physician in Haverhill, Massachusetts who sought to measure the mass lost by a human when the soul departed the body at death. MacDougall attempted to measure the mass change of six patients at the moment of death. His first subject, the results from which MacDougall felt were most accurate, lost “three-fourths of an ounce”, which has since been popularized as “21 grams”.

Of the four successful measurements he obtained an average weight loss at the moment of death of 15 grams. The total average unaccounted for weight loss in these four subjects was found to be approximately 29 grams.

n 1901, MacDougall weighed six patients while they were in the process of dying from tuberculosis in an old age home. It was relatively easy to determine when death was only a few hours away, and at this point the entire bed was placed on an industrial sized scale which was reported to be sensitive to “two-tenths of an ounce”. He took his results (a varying amount of unaccounted for mass loss in four of the six cases) to support his hypothesis that the soul had mass, and when the soul departed the body, so did this mass. The determination of the soul weighing 21 grams was based on the loss of mass in the first subject at the moment of death.

MacDougall later measured fifteen dogs in similar circumstances and reported the results as “uniformly negative,” with no perceived change in mass. He took these results as confirmation that the soul had weight, and that dogs did not have souls. MacDougall’s complaints about not being able to find dogs dying of the natural causes that would have been ideal led one author to conjecture that he was in fact sacrificing the experimental animals, as is standard practice in scientific experiments.[1]

On March 10, 1907, before MacDougall was able to publish the results of his experiments, New York Times broke the story in an articls titled “Soul has Weight, Physician Thinks”. MacDougall’s results were published in April of the same year in the Journal of the American Society for Psychical Research and the medical journal American Medicine.

MacDougall’s experimental results have been regarded by many as flawed, due to the limitations of the available equipment at the time, a lack of sufficient control over the experimental conditions, and the small sample size. Author Robert L. Park raises objections to MacDougall’s findings in his “Superstition: Belief in the Age of Science.” [2]

Nonetheless, MacDougall’s finding that presumably the human soul weighed 21 grams has become a meme in the public consciousness, mostly due to its claiming the titular thesis in the 2003 film 21 Grams. MacDougall’s experiments have not been repeated, and his research remains the most accurate measurements of the mass of the human soul performed to date. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duncan_MacDougall_%28doctor%29

[tired&retired]

“In the most compelling scientific evidence to date validating reincarnation, Dr. Ian Stevenson documented over 3,000 cases of children who remembered their past lives.”

I liked Ian’s work, but it lacked scientific credibility. One of the main reasons is that he used local interpreters rather than bringing his own to interview the children. I discussed this with Dr. Raymond Moody who worked with Ian and was a friend of his at University of Virginia, Charlottesville.

[Pajamajan]

bookmark

[tired&retired]

“which incidentally was banned by the Council of Nice in 553 AD”

This guy writes fiction. He is referring to the 2nd Ecumenical Council of Constantinople, which was also the 5th ecumenical council. It was the one where the Emperor Justinian kidnapped the Pope Vigilis and held him prisoner for eight years until he agree to call the council.

[tired&retired]

This guy does not have pure motive. He is a media hound....From his website:

HATHAWAY IS AVAILABLE FOR HYPNOSIS STAGE SHOWS where he provides fun and entertainment suitable for the whole family. He will demonstrate the amazing power of the unconscious mind and call upon volunteers to act as subjects. The demonstration, which lasts from an hour and a quarter to an hour and a half, is tailored to the age level of the audience, and is both fun and educational. Great for schools, clubs, private parties, and fund-raisers.

[tired&retired]

Here is a pic of the author. I've net him several times at conferences. Jesus was very correct in that the eyes are the windows to the soul:

[Talisker]

Wow, everyone seems to need to believe this guy is a crackpot. But why? Jesus said we have souls, this guy is validating that. Where’s the problem? Reincarnation? The miracle is that God incarnated us the first time - additional times would be easy once He got some practice in. It’s all one long lifetime for the soul, though, because you’re either with God or you’re not. Of course, eternal hell gets replaced by an almost eternal hell. But that makes more sense for a God of Love to most people. And as for those who do a head count and say that there are too many people and animals now to make up the few in the past, I say read “Forbidden Archeology” - and contemplate the number of stars in the sky.