[knarf]

I've used this illustration many times before;

A scene in Ben Hur when an incoming Centurian (to rule Judea) is conversing with the outgoing one and the statement is made by the outgoing Centurian that for the most part, Judea was easy to govern and rule, but that these Hebrews had this damnable idea about having only one God ... and how do you deal with an idea?

Later on in the movie, an event happens that allows the incoming Centurian to refer back to that remark and state,

"You once asked how do you deal with an idea ... I will show youo ... with another idea"

I'm trying to get off the computer and get ready for church and it occurs to me that we are bombarded with ideas.

Ideas that require at least the mental time to consider it's validity and even argue the point.

I have a Norman Rockwell calendar I stare at when at my desk, and this month is a scene of a gran'pa, a boy and a dog all going fishing and the scene is so ... yesteryear.

As all of Rockwell's are.

And yesteryear, to my 64 year old mind wasn't so bad.

I didn't really have a lot to think about.

The future would happen, I hoped to get a girlfriend, a job, money, a car.

To me, all of that may have taken time of my mind, but they were not perplexing and devastating thoughts ... they were just ... life.

I just got through glancing through an article posted here in FR about Raul Casto's daughter is coming to San Francisco to speak about accepting queers or some such notion and .. bingo! .. it hit me.

I (we) am/are being flooded with ideas that require me to determine if I am mad and out of touch, or the world is.

I find myself shaking my head and too often these days, attempt to comment on an article like that and find myself in a mobius loop of logic trying to show how insane that particular thought is.

I aften quit, erase the reply and go on reading in other areas of FR.

Oh, for the good ol' days, when life was easier ... even war.

We get newspapers posted here from an archive that daily tells us how the war is going and from what I can tell, most of America was patriotic and behind our war effort and no matter the outcome of a battle, we were in it for the duration, and our troops came home to honor, glory, respect, and a job.

I don't think my mind can continue rationally contemplating a queer muslim illegal alien bastard as the president and all the confusion that entity is frascilitating.

I think I'll think my thoughts away, I think I've thought enough.

[melsec]

When most people believed and thought the same there was little necessity to have to think and question about every little pinnickitty thing!

Mel

[RoosterRedux]

Julian Jaynes agrees with you...

The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind

"When Julian Jaynes...speculates that until late in the second millennium B.C. men had no consciousness but were automatically obeying the voices of gods, we are astounded but compelled to follow this remarkable thesis through all the corroborative evidence..."

- John Updike, in The New Yorker

"This book and this man's ideas may be the most influential, not to say controversial, of the second half of the twentieth century. It renders whole shelves of books obsolete."

- William Harrington, in Columbus Dispatch

"Having just finished The Origin of Consciousness, I myself feel something like Keats' Cortez staring at the Pacific, or at least like the early reviewers of Darwin or Freud. I'm not quite sure what to make of this new territory; but its expanse lies before me and I am startled by its power."

- Edward Profitt, in Commonweal

"He is as startling as Freud was in The Interpretation of Dreams, and Jaynes is equally adept at forcing a new view of known human behavior." - Raymond Headlee, in American Journal of Psychiatry "The bold hypothesis of the bicameral mind is an intellectual shock to the reader, but whether or not he ultimately accepts it he is forced to entertain it as a possibility. Even if he marshals arguments against it he has to think about matters he has never thought of before, or, if he has thought of them, he must think about them in contexts and relationships that are strikingly new."

- Ernest R. Hilgard, Professor of Psychology, Stanford University

"The weight of original thought in it is so great that it makes me uneasy for the author's well-being: the human mind is not built to support such a burden."

- D.C. Stove, in Encounter

[nevergore]

Me Thinks, Me Likes this thread.....

[Stalwart]

Matthew 6:27

Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?

[nevergore]

Me Thinks, Me Likes this thread.....

[Copenhagen Smile]

I just wish things were simpler. There is so damn much information these days. You have to know so much to get by. Wouldn't it be nice if we just went back to running family farms. Honest simple work in God's outside.

Maybe throw in some indians and French-canadian marauders for a little excitement every now and then.

[nuconvert]

When my brain needs to go into neutral, I watch classic tv shows from the 50’s & 60’s....I Love Lucy, Leave it to Beaver, Dick Van Dyke, Perry Mason

[SVTCobra03]

Oh, for the good ol' days, when life was easier ... even war.

We get newspapers posted here from an archive that daily tells us how the war is going and from what I can tell, most of America was patriotic and behind our war effort and no matter the outcome of a battle, we were in it for the duration, and our troops came home to honor, glory, respect, and a job.

I am the same age as you and graduated from college in 1969 and then entered the Marine Corps. I remember the hippies and war protestors and the Sexual Revolution. It was a time of discontent and upheaval and a rejection of the culture of the 50's. This was the beginning of the Marxist takeover of education, mass media and government that is bearing it's poisonous fruit today. I long ago gave up my faith in men, who only pursue power, pleasure and possessions. I put my faith in the Lord and eagerly await His return.

[Yashcheritsiy]

I dunno - the quality of thought itself seemed to be better back “in the day” when we didn’t have a million little distractions. People today don’t seem to be able to concentrate and think clearly, much less want to to do so.

[UCANSEE2]

I think when we express a desire to be in, or go back to, simpler days, we're really wanting less thought.

Freedom of choice is what you got
Freedom from choice is what you want

[patriotUSA]

I wonder why I wonder,

I wonder why I why;

I even wonder when I wonder,

why I wonder why.

[martin_fierro]

it occurs to me that we are bombarded with ideas.

And so you thought you'd post this.

[Liberty Valance]

*half though-out bump* - great thread. ;o)

[no-to-illegals]

Am not wanting to muddy the waters yet here goes.

Once upon a time men thought and the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were drafted and enacted. The history has been what our history has been. Today, in the present, those who lead us seek to rewrite and revise the documents of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution in thought and deed as has been throughout history. The only thought I have is, Will those who lead succeed? Now don't take what I say wrongly ... Many good things have happened because of revisions for our nation. In addition many terrible things have happened and more terrible things could happen if another hope and change comes.

Perhaps I do think too little, or too much. In any event may the jury say ... guilty.

[trebb]

I think when we express a desire to be in, or go back to, simpler days, we're really wanting less thought.

I think they really want to go back to times when one didn't have to think about and twist issues in order tojustify themselves. There was a time whjen society KNEW things like the difference between right and wrong and was able to put pressure on those who strayed. Stigmas were attached to faulky behavior and those who were so inclined either felt shame or fear which made them hide it rather than flaunt it. I ache for a return to those times.

[yefragetuwrabrumuy]

There is an interesting and practical theory about thinking, or really, the incessant talking to ourselves that we call thinking, and why we, as a species, began doing this.

It has long been known that the first thing a person needs to do to meditate is to “clear their mind” of chatter. The reason is that when we *don’t* talk to ourselves, our minds can move into a state of strongly focused attention, ignoring the distractions around us; or it can become very unfocused, allowing our creative mind to come into play.

Unfortunately, both a very focused and a very unfocused state are not good in a survival situation, say if you are being chased by a tiger. So way back, humanity figured out an interesting trick.

When you talk to yourself, it tends to keep you centered, bouncing your attention back and forth between focused and unfocused. So since then, we all talk to ourselves, and unknowingly even teach our children to talk to themselves.

However, there aren’t so many tigers around these days, which means we are losing out on a lot of the benefits of a more focused, and more unfocused, states of mind.

But we have learned a bunch of trained techniques to learn how to get control over our talking to ourselves, so we can shut up. And the more you do it, the better you get.

In practical terms, say you want to take a very difficult written examination. If you could totally focus on it, ignoring all the distractions around you, it would be like adding another 10-20 IQ points.

Likewise, if you wanted to paint a creative picture, if you could go into an extended state of unfocused concentration, it would come uninterrupted from your most creative mind.

But it goes even beyond these benefits. Some people are so good at talking to themselves that they can barely complete a sentence without getting distracted. And bouncing back and forth consumes a lot of energy, over time making them mentally tired and frustrated.

Those who try the various techniques to get more control are generally happier with the result of being able to turn on or turn off their internal chatter at will.

[savage woman]

We each have our own unique thoughts and we want to express them. The internet pulls all those thoughts together and we go into overload...
We want to consider each view and contemplate on whether or not it meshes with our own point of view. Mostly they don’t mesh, and know we are faced with the daunting task of finding a place in our brain to store and lock away all those hideous thoughts and deeds of others.
So yes, I too want to go back or should I say (move forward) to a new type of Norman Rockwell Era...

[SES1066]

As an amateur historian, I tend to shorten these horizons to something more manageable in my imagination.

1012AD: With my ancestry, the majority of my ancestors would have been yeoman or serf-equivalents in a feudal and theocratic world of northern Europe. The daily routines of farming and household were little different from previous centuries and there was little to see changing in the future. Very little decision making was needed for the average person.

1262AD: Very, very slight changes have appeared with the knowledge gained from the returning Crusaders in the individual’s world-view. Still almost no change in everyday life for the average peasant.

1512AD: All of Europe has been roiled with the changes forced by the waves of the Bubonic Plagues that have done much destruction to the Feudal World as well as the monolithic Church. Society is far more mobile in both potential for travel as well as change in cultural position. The Mediterranean Renaissance and the exploration voyages are starting to echo in northern Europe. Individual lives are far more tied to external and distant events than ever before in their past millennium. Real decisions by individuals result in real outcomes.

1762AD: Europe and now North America are where my ancestors reside. Europe bears almost no resemblance to its image of 500 years ago with the total replacement of feudalism by nation-states. The monolithic Christian Church has been replaced by Roman Catholicism and a myriad of Protestant and other churches. In North America, individualism is sparked by the concept and reality of the frontier where no government rules. Even in the very real cities of the nascent United States, the freedom of individual liberty provokes reaction to statist doctrines from old Europe. Individuals have power and knowledge far beyond the wildest imaginings of earlier philosophers. This is the start of our modern world.

So what are my conclusions from this very brief outline of visualized history? I believe (nothing original to me) that there are two very differing philosophies at work in our modern world, i.e.. NOW! There is a very real desire by many for a calm and orderly world where there is equality of outcome and everybody has a secure place and comfortable living. To me this resembles the Medieval world of 1012AD when there were good crops and no plague or wars. Frankly, to me this is the view of the left with all of its scattered views, to have government be the ultimate parent and provider.

For me and I think my fellow FReepers and conservatives, it is the chaotic and uneven world of individuals making the best of a world deriving from an equity in opportunity, one where no government or organization can dictate outcomes. A world that permits new industries to spring from garage inventors who may violate OSHA and EPA regulations designed to mitigate large corporations but applied bureaucratically to the smallest as well. A World where one-time millionaires are later in poverty while former ghetto residents are millionaires. A world where the quality of character and perseverence means far more than skin color or perceived societal standing!

[blueunicorn6]

I always thought David Crosby must have known my Dad.

“And the reason that she loved him
Was the reason I loved him too
And he never wondered what was right or wrong
He just knew, he just knew.”

HERO - David Crosby

[Celtic Conservative]

The same amount of information has always been out there, what has changed dramatically is our access to it. With the advent of the information age the level of accessible information has expanded exponentially. Our inherent ability to process it, however has not signifigantly changed. This leaves us feeling awash in reams of information we are helpless to process or change. Another point is what I consider to be the American worldview, e.g. that we must be filling our very waking hour with doing something. We have lost the understanding of simply being. like the famiy going fishing in the Rockwell painting. Being with family, rather than doing something. it's kinda a zen thing, but as I grow older I find more value in simply being sometimes.

CC