Posted on 08/14/2011 12:20:37 PM PDT by DrewsMum
Can anyone tell me the difference in John McCain and Rick Perry on illegal immigration? I am having a difficult time finding a difference between the two.
He isn’t for giving them citizenship. He wants them to be able to come and go as they please.
“Texas shares a 1,254 mile border with our number one trading partner, Mexico. More than 1/3 of Texas citizens can trace their lineage to our southern neighbor and relationships of family, friends and free enterprise flow across the border to the benefit of both. However, criminals also see our border as a gateway to their own illicit prosperity, requiring Texas to maintain an aggressive approach to border security” -—from his website
“This candidate will s*ck on immigration but will do other pleasing things to keep the voters intrigued. It will merely depend on how voters feel about the issue. Are voters at the break point or not?”
This voter cannot choke down another open borders nominee. Perry will either have to do a mea culpa in which he unequivocatingly renounces his former views on immigration issues or I will not vote for him. Immigration is killing us as much as deficit spending (and immigration is tied into that issue).
Texas Gov.Rick Perry was traveling in Mexico today, and gave a press conference. You might want to take a gander at this article, see if anything stands out to you.
Texas Governor Rick Perry Opposes Border Fence, in Mexico
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2763487/posts
It is interesting that he doesn’t use the work ‘amnesty’, but discusses reforming immigration laws.
Now why in Hell should we reform something that isn’t being enforced? There is no way to know if the new immigration laws will be enforced: it certainly didn’t happen after Reagan granted amnesty in exchange for immigration enforcement that never materialized.
If you have "researched the subject" why did you post a thread and immediately start arguing with the people who responded with answers you obviously didn't like.
For many reasons that have nothing to do with immigration, I don't like John McCain.
Pssssst! Perry isn't running against McCain. As far as thinking about the differences between Perry and McCain, WHY? I think it's irrelvant and can't imagine why you would have thought about it. OH! I get it! It's...
Just a contrived excuse to connect Perry and McCain and immigration to make Perry look bad...knowing people don't like McCain.
Nope, to show the hypocrisy of people who rail against Juan McAmnesty but worship at the feet of Perry.
And actually, I really was wondering if there were any differences.
Now let me break this down for you again. Pay close attention.....I researched the subject. Didn’t find any (well, ONE minor difference that I mentioned in the original post) differences, so I thought I would ask. Some people have posted untruths. I called them out on it. Some people have told me what I already know....the numberous areas where Perry agrees with McCain on immigration. So I respond with “yes, I know that”.....
You don’t have to get upset that I am comparing them, sheesh! Seems I hit on something, as several people have noted they are way more similar than I even first thought.
I understand Rick Perry’s economic stands and his small government stands much more than immigration (and also free trade for that matter). However, I’ve been trying to learn a little more about this too so I can understand what may come up about this issue.
Here are a couple of things I found of interest.
1. Rick Perry has aligned himself with the Border Sheriff’s Coalition, supporting their recommendations for how to patrol the border and keep it safe from illegal entrances into the country. Believing boots on the ground, eyes open wide, and local law enforcement working in cooperation with federal border control agents, he believes in beefing up the efforts of the local and state’s law enforcement agencies tasked with the job of protecting the borders alongside federal agents, not by themselves but ALONGSIDE AND IN CONJUNCTION WITH federal agents.
He does not believe border patrol is the ultimate responsibility of the local or state law enforcement officers. He believes border patrol is a federal responsibility but believes state and local officers should be well equipped to do their own specific law enforcement jobs and be funded enough to work well with and cooperate effectively with federal agents and border patrol on the nation’s borders.
Here is a great URL that has info about his efforts to fight illegal immigration through funding and boosting local and state law enforcement agencies that work with federal border agents. The page also has a lot of other info and links plus a short little advertisement video of the Border Sheriff’s Coalition.
http://www.governorperry.com/blog/new-tv-ad-border/
While Rick Perry is a small government man, he believes the federal government should be protecting our country’s borders by following our federal immigration policies that are in place, allowing local and state law enforcement agencies to focus on local and state crime and on coordinating their local efforts with federal border patrol as needed.
How many times have we heard that Arizona’s new laws would never have needed to have been written had this administration (Eric Holder, etc.) have honored the laws already in place for our border’s protection? Arizona themselves basically said it was the SAME laws, that is why they said there was nothing wrong with the laws they wrote. Their new laws were already federal laws for border protection granted by the federal government, only they were taking charge of the oversight since this administration was not doing it.
Rick Perry believes the country’s borders should be protected by our country’s border control laws with local and state law enforcement assisting them on the local level.
2. While Rick Perry says he believes boots on the ground are better than an un-attended fence, he believes boots on the ground can be augmented by new technology that can help federal, state, and local law enforcement agencies charged with protecting the borders.
This youtube video reflects one such advanced protection technique: the use of surveillance planes, predator jets, drones.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEHDDktDn8o
Here is another example of something Texas has funded to provide more real-person involvement in protecting our borders from illegal immigration across the borders:
The above link is a public-private collaboration which provides live surveillance camera footage of border areas known to border agents to be illegal traffic areas. Citizens from all over the country can help give eyes to these areas through the live webcams and provide a warning when needed to agents in the area responsible for border protection in that area.
Here is an article about one such citizen who has been involved with this program.
http://dfwimmigrationlaw.clarislaw.com/border-enforcement/mom-patrols-us-border-from-her-den.php
Rick Perry does admit some fencing could be beneficial - strategic fencing - but he believes just putting a tall fence along the entire thousands of miles (Texas along has 1,200 miles of border) is not the only, or even best, way to keep illegal immigrants from entering illegally.
You can see all his views come together in this article (next url). It reflects how Governor Perry believes Homeland Security should be doing their job on border patrol so the border states can do their own local law enforcement (instead of doing Homeland Security’s job) and be available to work with federal agents as needed and in a cooperative effort.
http://blog.chron.com/texaspolitics/2010/07/gov-perry-secure-the-border-mr-president/
Governor Perry’s official site shows this on border protection: http://governor.state.tx.us/initiatives/border/
Many believe taking the above approach to border protection is not the best way to handle illegal immigration, many believing a tall wall built by the various states along their borders is a better way to handle it.
3.) Rick Perry along with state conservatives passed the voter ID legislation which required any Texas voter to show identification so as to prevent fraud and abuse in voting such as double voting, supposed voting by people who have passed away, and preventing non-American-citizens from voting.
http://trailblazersblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/05/perry-signs-voter-id-bill-to-c.html
4. While the above 3 points do not necessarily show negatively towards Governor Perry’s desire for border security and at most describe a means of protection different than what some want, his Texas Dream Act is more difficult to understand, at least for me at this time.
Governor Perry has stated that if a child has been going to a Texas public school, has graduated (or will soon graduate) from a Texas public school, and is currently working towards U.S. Citizenship as their own individual person, they should be granted the opportunity to stay in the Texas educational system on the higher level (Texas colleges and universities) as an instate student (with instate tuition). This has been called the Texas Dream Act, providing a means to qualify for in state tuition to these students who are Americanized already and old enough to finally go through the legal citizenship process themselves but whose parents have not gone through the official citizenship process themselves.
From: http://www.unionleader.com/article/20110724/NEWS0605/707249985
It says: In 2001, Perry signed into law the first state “DREAM Act,” which allows children of illegal immigrants to pay in-state tuition at state universities as long as they graduated from a Texas high school and are working toward attaining citizenship.
Although criticized for it by some conservatives and some elements of the Tea Party, Perry stands by it, while opposing such a law on the federal level.
(End of Excerpt)
“opposing such a law on the federal level”... above...
That is not to say Governor Perry would be against an Americanized young adult of a non-citizen resident applying for American citizenship or from going through the process of becoming an American citizen in another state in the country. Instead, as I understand it, that is to mean Governor Perry’s Dream Act (instate tuition for children of illegal immigrants who have gone through Texas schools and are in the process of American citizenship but not completed fully yet) is a Texas state policy for Texas colleges and universities only, not granting instate tuition to other states’ educational institutions. That makes sense since Governor Perry believes in giving the local government oversight over their own education instead of placing educational policies for a local entity at the federal level. If OTHER states wanted to set up such instate tuition rates for their own young adults who are not yet fully through their citizenship process, that would be each state’s decision to do that with their own states’ colleges and universities.
Wow, that last one is really a difficult one to get through!
As I said, I’m still trying to figure out Rick Perry’s unique take on all the various immigration issues... they seem to be very complex.
However, at least it looks like we both got a start on understanding him with these resources, if only just a little bit!
Sorry I can’t compare to John McCain since I don’t know John McCain’s views, but hopefully this helps a little with where Rick Perry stands at least!
Don’t Know about the immigration enforcement on normal stops, but I have had DPS friends assigned to border positions to STOP the entry of Illegals INTO TEXAS.
That is the part the US Government won’t do properly and where they have failed.
As I said, that was your intent but it's irrelevant.
If both were governors or both were senators, a comparison would be more relevant.
IMO, you are comparing apples to oranges because they have different job descriptions, responsibilites and come from two different places.
If anything, McCain has not lived up to his job of protecting the borders as a US Senator which is a senator's job more than the governors of the 4 border states.
Why don't you research how much McCain has hindered the 4 border states in not being tough on illegal immigration! A comparison of the Govs of CA, AZ, and NM to Perry would be a lot more relevant than anything you've come up with.
He was New Hampshire, Waterloo, Iowa and Mexico all in the same day?
Opposing the border fence doesn't equate to opposing border security. Texas spent over $100 million securing the border on Perry's watch.
Given that there are only 12 million illegals, why should we take anything you say seriously?
And, Perry has taken significant measures to secure the borders in Texas with state spending over $100 million dollars to do so.
So, going to claim the Gipper was naive?
And, Perry hasn't even proposed amnesty, let alone granted it.
The “12M illegals” number is from the Dept of Homeland Security, and comes from 2003. The number of illegals entering the country each year is from 700,000 (DHS) to 4M (State of Arizona Task Force on Illegal Immigration). Get with the program.
Governor Perry in 2001: “President Fox’s vision for an open border is a vision I embrace”.
Perry supports open borders, NAFTA, the TTC, sanctuary city policies, benefits for illegal aliens, amnesty, and he has signed legislation to keep guidelines to prevent law enforcement from finding illegal aliens. Perry has signed also signed legislation to grant in-state tuition to illegal aliens. He believes that border enforcement is a federal issue, so please show us a link to back up your assertion that he’s tough on illegal immigration.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/02/us/02immig.html?_r=1 Perry supports open borders
Rick Perry's record on border security.
» Starting in 2005 with Operation Linebacker, the state has sought to provide funding, manpower and equipment to local law enforcement agencies operating along the Texas-Mexico border.
» The state's latest operation, Border Star, builds on the successes of previous operations with unprecedented local, state and federal law enforcement coordination. With the assistance of the 80th and 81st Legislatures, the State of Texas has been able to appropriate more than $110 million each session to fund and amplify these efforts.
» In response to a rising tide of gang violence in Texas communities, the Governor allocated $4 million in criminal justice grants to cities across the state to increase patrols of gang hotspots. In 2009, Gov. Perry worked to secure more than $10 million in state funding for enhanced anti-gang efforts during the 2010-11 biennium.
» In September 2009, Gov. Perry announced the formation of highly-skilled Ranger Recon Teams — which include Texas Rangers, Texas National Guard Counterdrug forces, Highway Patrol and DPS Aviation assets — in order to address threats building in the unincorporated areas along the Texas-Mexico border.
» Since early 2009, Gov. Perry has repeatedly called on Washington to authorize the deployment of 1,000 Title 32 National Guard soldiers to the Texas-Mexico border to support border security operations currently underway. (see letter to President Obama, letter to Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano and request to Defense Secretary Gates)
» Gov. Perry has also recommended an expeditious deployment of unmanned aerial vehicles to provide real-time surveillance and intelligence to law enforcement on the ground.
Several years ago one of the large Wall Street firms conducted their own survey to get a more accurate estimate of the number of illegals in the US, an estimate without political spin manipulating the count. Their number was well over 20 million at a time when the official count was only half that number.
Remember this thread?
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2591559/posts
Bush didn’t do enough as president and neither has Obama. The Governor doesn’t have the power to put boots on the groud that aren’t under his direction (i.e. the National guard or the US military)
IOWs his options are limited without federal help.
http://governor.state.tx.us/files/homeland/Border-Security-Report.pdf
Fail.
Using the NYT as a resource for rational debate in a non-starter.
You’re proving my point. Look at half the points you pasted: they’re all talk. Perry “recommends”, Perry “calls for”, leaving the actual action up to someone else. Likewise, allocating resources to fight crime and gang violence is not, by any stretch of the imagination, taking a hard line on illegal immigration.
Makes sense to me, also.
We can sit hear and bitch about illegal immigration but, the way I see it, Perry has had to deal with and has done more about illegal immigration than ANY of the other candidates, bar none.
http://governor.state.tx.us/initiatives/border/
A *President Perry could do a lot more.
Because they are not the same thing. He doesn't believe in amnesty.
If you're not from Texas, you might not know what has been done to protect our border nor the lack of help provided by the FedGov
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