Unions What Are They Good For? (Disgusting Vanity)

self | 2/21/2011 | Self

[Little Bill]

I have been following , as we all have , the events in WI.

I find this interestng because a branch of my family helped found the Typographers Union in 1858. We were printers under Licience fron the Crown from about 1640 in Dublin, Anglo-Irish.

The Union was organized to obtain tolerable working conditions in print shops, Money was also a factor.

I was active in seveal unions, as were many of my relitives, until the AFL-CIO drove us out when Meany was Prez

[Little Bill]

The thing that has puzzuled me is why an organization would drive out members that are Republicans and was founded by Republicans?

[cripplecreek]

Absolutely nothing

say it again...

[Lucky9teen]

[ReverendJames]

Early on Unions were for the workers. I read about the Pullman and Ford strikes in history. Back then they served a purpose. Child labor, kids working in mines, spinning mills.

Well Ok, they've done their job, now it's time to back off. They're nothing but a corporation that takes workers dues and spend the money on themselves. Then they go to employers threatening them with strikes. The Unions cave when the employers tell them they'll lay off a bunch. It's time for them to go. Companies know they need people and they do, for the most part, take care of their people.

[PGR88]

The idea that unions can raise wages or “living standards” is ridiculous. The best they can do is get more money for their members, at the expense of other workers.

Wages and living standards in an economy can only rise with increases in productivity, and I have seen no clear evidence ever that unions improve productivity. In fact, the opposite is likely true.

[jimfree]

It’s rather a natural progression actually. Democracy, republic, then tyranny. That’s what happens without vigilance - the real protector of liberty.

[FReepaholic]

There was a time when Unions were needed but not anymore. They used to be needed where working conditions and pay were lousy.

We don't see that now, with OSHA and other agencies protecting the workers.

Disclosure: former Union member.

[ez]

At the risk of getting flamed, I will try to answer this honestly. Where I worl there are all sorts of hostile work conditions...asbestos, lead, black mold. Many times my co-workers are told to perform tasks which place them in harm’s wayand it is the union threat which forces management to clean the area before the worker must go in. That said, I think the unions have been hijacked by mobsters intent on enriching themselves at the expense of the taxpayers.

[mjp]

Unions, what are they good for?

One or the most widespread delusions of our age is the belief that the American worker owes his high standard of living to unions and to humanitarian labor legislation. This belief is contradicted by the most fundamental facts and principles of economics - facts and principles which are systematically evaded by labor leaders, legislators, and intellectuals of the statist persuasion.

A country's standard of living, including the wages of its workers, depends on the productivity of labor, and high productivity depends on machines, inventions and capital investment - which depend on the creative ingenuity of individual men - which requires, for its exercise, a politico-economic system that protects the individual's rights and freedom.

[DonaldC]

That is the funniest post I have read in a while. Just look at how a multinational runs a company on the US side opposed to their 3rd world counterpart.

[cripplecreek]

SEIU protests planned for today and tomorrow. (Don’t these people have jobs?)

Events on Monday February 21, 2011 (All times local)

Indiana
Rally
Time: 9 A.M.
Location: Indiana State Capitol
Address: 302 W Washington St – Indianapolis, IN

Montana
Rally
Time: 2 P.M.
Location: Montana State Capitol
Address: 1301 East 6th Avenue – Helena, Montana

Nevada
Rally
Time: 12 P.M.
Location: Nevada State Capitol
Address: 101 North Carson Street – Carson City, NV 89701

North Carolina
Rally
Time: 12 P.M. Location:
Address: 1 East Edenton Street – Raleigh, NC 27601

Oregon
Rally
Time: 12 P.M.
Location: State Capitol
Address: 900 Court St. NE – Salem, OR 97301

Texas
Candlelight March and Vigil
Time: 6:45 P.M.
Location: Meet at TX AFL-CIO
Address: 1106 Lavaca St. – Austin, TX. 78701

Washington
Rally
Time: 12:00 PM
Location: State Capitol Rotunda
Address: 416 Sid Snyder Avenue SW – Olympia, WA 98504

Wisconsin
Rally
Time: All Day
Location: State Capitol
Address: 2 East Main Street – Madison, WI. 53702

Events on Tuesday February 22, 2011 (All times local)

California
Vigil
Time: 5:30 P.M.
Location: State Capitol West Steps
Address: 1315 10th Street – Sacramento, CA 95814

California
Vigil
Time: 5:30 PM
Location: Poncitlan Square
Address: 38315 9th Street East – Palmdale, CA. 93550

Colorado
Rally
Time: 12:00 P.M.
Location: Colorado State Capitol
Address: 200 East Colfax Avenue (West Steps) – Denver, CO. 80203

Iowa
Rally
Time: 1:00 PM
Location: Iowa State Capitol
Address: 1007 East Grand Avenue – Des Moines, IA

Maryland
Rally
Time: 12:00 PM
Location: Lawyers’ Mall, Maryland State House
Address: 100 State Circle – Annapolis, MD. 21401

Massachusetts
Rally
Time: 4:00 PM
Location: State House
Address: 1 Ashburton Pl – Boston, MA 02108

Massachusetts
Rally
Time: 4:00 PM
Location: City Hall Steps
Address: 36 Court Street – Springfield, MA 01103

Minnesota
Rally
Time: 4:00 PM
Location: Minnesota State Capitol
Address: 75 Constitution Ave – St. Paul, MN 55101

Ohio
Rally
Time: 1:00 PM
Location: Capitol Building
Address: 1395 Dublin Rd – Columbus, OH 43215

New Mexico
Rally
Time: 12:15 PM
Location: East Side of the State House
Address: 490 Old Santa Fe Trl # 219 – Santa Fe, NM 87501

Rhode Island
Rally
Time: 4:30 PM
Location: Rhode Island State House
Address: 90 Smith St – Providence, RI 02903

Vermont
Rally
Time: 12:00 PM
Location: Vermont State Capitol Building
Address: 115 State Street – Montpelier, VT. 05602

Wisconsin
Rally
Time: All Day
Location: State Capitol
Address: 2 East Main Street – Madison, WI. 53702

Events on Wednesday February 23, 2011 (All times local)

Arkansas
Rally
Time: 11:30 AM
Location: State Capitol Building
Address: 425 W Capitol Ave, Little Rock, AR 72201

Connecticut
Rally
Time: 12:00 PM
Location: State Capitol Building, West Steps
Address: 210 Capitol Avenue – Hartford, CT. 06106

Georgia
Rally
Time: 4:00 PM
Location: State Capitol Building
Address: 206 Washington St – Atlanta, GA, 30334

Pennsylvania
Rally
Time: 12:00 PM
Location: Lackawana Court House
Address: 200 Adams Avenue – Scranton, PA 18503

Events on Thursday February 24, 2011 (All times local)

Ohio
Protest against Governor Kasich
Time: 4:00 PM
Location: Canton Civic Center
Address: 1101 Market Ave N. – Canton, Oh 44702

[Little Bill]

Those guys with the Backhoe back to the hall.

If you have a good Super and take no poop, you get no bench rats. When you have a show up for new guys toss the trash, the people you do hire know you are a stand up guy and have standards, they will work for you.

[Lucky9teen]

Hmmm...I wonder why not in AZ? ;)

[SVTCobra03]

[cripplecreek]

Here in Michigan the AFL-CIO was holding some kind of rally today.

[Little Bill]

The House, General Court, passed a “Right to Work “ bill in NH if the leadership can beat a few Reps into submission we might be rid of this troublesome pest.

[kearnyirish2]

They certainly did have a purpose in the past (I like the bumper sticker “If you enjoy your weekends thatnk a union member”), but what they fought for is now law. It is illegal for any company to send someone into an unsafe work environment, and those that do at the least can expect workers comp claims out the wazoo on top of fines, lwasuits, etc. They have done nothing to save jobs in the recent past, and in fact had sped up the process of shipping them overseas. They don’t just make business less profitable (which I guess is their stated aim - to allocate a larger share of earnings to workers), but they also make them incredibly inefficient via work rules and inflexibility in terms of automation.

At this point the companies have the edge because they can be very selective about where they set up shop (much to the dismay of California & New York); if potential employees think they’ll slowly strangle the business it can simply set up somewhere else. The migration of auto manufacturing from Detroit to the south is very telling (and very beneficial to those states that now have non-UAW taxpayers versus UAW members on the dole, on top of companies contributing to their local tax bases).

[massgopguy]

Think they’ll leave the Mexican flags home this time?

[Alberta's Child]

I wouldn't flame you at all. I understand the common sentiment on this thread that "unions were needed a long time ago but not anymore," but I don't necessarily agree with that. As you have pointed out, there are a lot of cases where union representation is important in protecting workers. I would even suggest that this is the case in public sector jobs as well (though that whole thing is rife with abuse).

In my opinion, a union has outlived its usefulness under two conditions: (1) if its demands for wages, benefits and working conditions make good employers unprofitable; and (2) if it sees its primary role as a political action group rather than a collective bargaining tool.

[Future Snake Eater]

(2) if it sees its primary role as a political action group rather than a collective bargaining tool.

The two would seem to be inextricably linked since any bureaucracy is going to attempt to self-sustain and expand.