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To: dayglored
I'm not saying folks should drop acid. I'm just saying that the chemical itself is NOT the cause of the problems that the media like to associate with it. It's people's actions, and the circumstances in which the people act and react. It's no different with a six-pack of beer. You can sit at home and drink a couple of beers, talk with a few friends, have a good time, and toddle off to bed. Or you can have those beers at a wild party and decide to do something stupid like shoot firearms and drag-race your car. The beer is not the cause of your injuries and arrest, your actions are. Millions of people dropped acid over the years with no adverse reactions, because they did so in safe surroundings with friends who helped keep them from doing stupid things. What you say about the ER is certainly true. But it's not the chemical compound at fault, it's the people. Blaming personal irresponsibility and stupid actions on a drug (whatever the drug) is a cop-out. If one is so weak that one can't take responsibility for oneself, and one doesn't have friends to help out, then one should not do drugs, any drugs. Unfortunately, as you correctly point out, a lot of people do, who shouldn't.

You are hilarious.

Everything you say is contradictory. You say the acid, and beer also, is not the cause of "bad reactions" but the surroundings are, when in reality if they had not taken the acid or drank the beer(or other drugs)they wouldn't have to worry about their reactions to it, would they? To say the drugs are not the root cause of their "bad trips" and sometimes physical damage caused by both the acid and the beer is just slightly hypocritical.

I can't believe you can type the sh** you have with a straight face. How self deluded you are.

85 posted on 08/20/2009 5:42:21 AM PDT by calex59
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To: calex59
> You say the acid, and beer also, is not the cause of "bad reactions" but the surroundings are, when in reality if they had not taken the acid or drank the beer(or other drugs)they wouldn't have to worry about their reactions to it, would they? To say the drugs are not the root cause of their "bad trips" and sometimes physical damage caused by both the acid and the beer is just slightly hypocritical.

I'll try to clear up the confusion.

Acid is an incredibly powerful psychoactive drug. In my opinion it surpasses all other drugs in the regard that it is not for everyone, indeed most people probably should avoid it, because it will likely change their point of view about their lives, and most people can't handle questions like that.

That said, a huge number of people have taken it, with relatively few adverse reactions, percentage-wise. So here's an attempt to reconcile our positions, which actually are not far apart.

  1. The vast majority of people who drink beer, or drop acid, do not get into bar fights or suffer bad trips every time they do so. Unlike, say, drinking bleach, which will sicken or kill everyone who does so, every time.

  2. A person is responsible for their own voluntary actions, including drinking beer, dropping acid, standing in a strobe light, etc. It's a personal responsibility to avoid doing actions that cause trouble. And as you pointed out above, if the person didn't take the drug, they wouldn't have had the adverse reaction to it.

  3. Most people can drink beer without getting into a fight, most people can watch a strobe light without a seizure, most people can drop acid without a bad trip.

  4. There will always be some people who react badly to any given drug, or food, or drink, or light. In the case of acid, that number of people is very small, percentage-wise.

  5. The "cause" of an adverse reaction is that -- as you correctly pointed out above -- THE PERSON TOOK THE DRUG. The drug itself, which most people can take without that ill effect, did not cause the reaction while it was just sitting on the table.

Consider: Most people can drink red wine without a problem. But red wine gives me bad headaches. I learned this by noticing my reaction pattern whenever I drank red wine. So I stopped drinking red wine.

Now, if I drink red wine, and get a headache, what is the "cause" of my headache? MY ACTION OF DRINKING THE WINE. The wine, sitting in the bottle, didn't give me a headache. And it didn't suddenly jump out of the bottle and force itself down my throat. If I drink the wine, it's my own damn fault when I get a headache.

You can, if you wish, believe that "it's the drug's fault", but to me, that's shifting responsibility for a person's actions away from the person and onto an inanimate object.

Other than that distinction, it appears to me that we agree.

91 posted on 08/20/2009 8:20:28 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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