Romney's Rational

NY Sun ^ | 7/15/2008 | Seth Gitell

[sandbox]

The coming weeks will answer one very important question about John McCain: does he want to be the Republican Party's presidential nominee or does he want to be president?

[nmh]

“Why in the world do you think evangelicals should violate
their consciences to vote for a cultist?? For what purpose?
Has it occurred to you that their reasons for casting their
own votes are theirs alone and not yours?”

I know of other “cults” and these same “Evangelicals” had NO problem voting them in office. Has it ever occurred to YOU, that we need a man with a brain - McPain lacks that. We need a man that can turn this country around - because McPain will destroy it. Has it EVER occurred to YOU,to start ACTING like a “Christian”? EVER? Or is that only reserved for Sunday?

“It seems that there is bigotry among Mitt supporters like
you, that insist their way is the only right way and
condemn the religious convictions of everyone else as wrong.”

I am not a Mormon. I would NEVER, EVER take out a full page add in a paper, as the Evangelicals did and spew HATE and Bigotry all over as the Evangelicals did. The very thought of Mitt as a VP caused the Evangelicals to show their TRUE COLORS! They HATE others. They selecively “pray” for others yet on Sunday, one can only hope that there might be a few kin words to pray for the unsaved - like Miit. Guess that's not Biblical to Evangelicals. Their modus operandus is HATE and REJECTION of the unsaved. Notice the hypocrisy? Notice how your actions don't follow that of Christ? Notice how you are just a “sinner” too? Who knows if YOU are saved ... only YOU know that but I ask you, does a “saved sinner” have such a haughty attitude and one of you're not good enough and bigotry? My Bible doesn't tell me that. Guess we don't have the same religion - I;m Bible based not HATE based.

“Pure Mittgotry.”

No, pure bigotry and hypocrisy on your part. Your actions and words tell me what kind of a “Christian” Evangelicals are.

Don't you know, that when or maybe I should say IF you are a Christian, when “one member of the body offends” it affects the whole body? It does. People look at your bigotry and hypocrisy and want no parts of Christianity, even if it is FALSE. You spoil it for the rest of us that don't have that affliction - hatred and bigotry and announce it no less and call themselves “Christians” and Evangelicals. If I were unsaved, I'd want no part of THAT KIND OF CHRISTIANITY. Mitt is an excellent prayer target -if you knew your Bible, you'd know that. You'd also not proudly display your hypocrisy. Yeah sure, pray for others but not someone like MITT - no hate him. Despise him. Run ads and let people know you HATE him. Disgusting. This is not what Christ taught.

[johnnycap]

I agree...Romney’s the one unless the female factor becomes an big issue.

[SZonian]

You know, I appreciate your post for a couple of reasons. I am married to a really great Mormon. She’s the mother of our child and she’s my companion. Sure we’ve had our ups and downs, but you know, we’ve stuck it out. Out of curiosity, I’ve been following many “Mormon” or Mormon themed threads. My background does not include a strong belief in religion, I’ve been doing much soul searching and reading, but nothing has really “struck” me yet.

I’ve been learning alot about the religion that I didn’t otherwise know and it’s been enlightening from both perspectives. However, I must agree with your sentiments. The lack of decorum in those threads turns me off completely. My grandfather is a Southern Baptist and when he found out I married a Mormon, his “gift” to us was a book called “The Godmakers”.

Now any Mormon will tell you how insulting and incorrect the book is and a non Mormon will tell you how truthful the book is. The point is, there was never a chance for my wife to have any type of “normal” relationship with my grandfather and it hurt us both, me because she was hurt and her because he did what he did. My grandmother on the other hand embraced my wife and my grandfather played it close to the vest which made it a bit easier in the passing years.

She treated my wife like a grandaughter and it made a world of difference to us. What she said or did in private, I don’t know or care. All I know is she at least did the right thing and did not declare her personal religious objections to my wife. My wife and I made it a point to never discuss religion with them. We are family after all. No point in widening the rifts.

However, once my grandmother passed this past year, my grandfather has decided to show his hand. He actually encouraged me to leave my wife because she was a Mormon and he was scared for me. What does one do or say to that? (rhetorically speaking) I am not going to leave my wife over religion, it didn’t matter to me when I met her, it doesn’t matter to me now and I suspect it won’t matter to me for the rest of our lives.

Why do I spill my heart out? To show you and all the others that the words “spoken” do have an effect on those of us who may be interested in learning the truth but will not compromise basic human decency or disregard the basic Christian tenet to “Love one another” in the name of religion.

I will not ever investigate the Southern Baptist or Baptist church because of what my grandfather did. I believe he did what he did out of the bidding, training, education, or whatever of the Baptist church. I don’t believe that is Christ’s message. As you state, Christ said to love one another (paraphrased). Not just on Sunday.

Sure there is alot wrong with the Mormons, their own scriptures say some pretty damning things against others which causes much angst and animosity. Every person is imperfect, every church is imperfect. I believe the whole point is for each individual to earnestly strive to learn and follow the principles Christ taught.

I’m sure the folks who are constantly “battling” (I use the term loosely) regarding Mormonism will have some really helpful and insightful remarks or comments about what I’ve posted, some have in the past and it only served to prove what I already suspected. No compassion, no love.

Thanks for your post, well said.

FRegards,
SZ

[Grunthor]

“McPain desperately needs Mitt as a VP.”

I agree. McFraud is widely disliked by the Republican base for a multitude of knives in the back. Mitt really is not. This is not to say that Mitt is conservative, just that he is not widely hated, like McFraud. If McFraud picks a fellow Democrat in Republican clothing for Veep....he is signaling that he is not interested in the job.

[ejonesie22]

His only problem is bigotry from the Evangelicals.

If you are looking strictly as a Republican in today's world, then perhaps, but for Conservatives, the list is a little longer...

[greyfoxx39]

“His only problem is bigotry from the Evangelicals.”

Pure Mittgotry.

Hammer, meet nail! Starting the

POOR, PICKED-ON MORMONS....victimology early in the thread.

[svcw]

Bigotry from evangelicals...how does that work again?
Was it like the 90% who voted for MR in Utah, naaaa. ldsers bigots against Baptists perish the thought.

[yellowroses]

Thanks for your honest remarks. Being a Mormon married to a Catholic, I appreciate your position. I couldn’t ask for a better husband. He’s my better half, I always say.

I feel we should not “judge, lest we be judged” as to the religious doctrine of others. We’re all supplicants at his feet, aren’t we?

I want a VP with competent ideas, personal moral strength, ability to understand all sides, and a willingness to pray to providence for guidance. Since Duncan Hunter is not considered at this point for VP, I’ll take Mitt. He certainly seems more qualified to me.

Regards,
Yellow Roses

[MHGinTN]

Get real, McCain’s ego is too large to do that. And that’s probably part of the reason he would not pick a Romney to share his stage. Lindsey Graham is more along McCain’s speed: a brainy guy, leaning toward moderate politically, and not given to egotistical spittlage.

[MHGinTN]

“Yo, Evangelicals, make Mitt your prayer target instead of showing how hypocritical and unloving you truly are!” I am very disappointed in you for such a blatant demogoguery. Do you get nose bleeds from your high and mighty perch?

[svcw]

Ok, as someone who is tagged with evangelical and I am not self tagged that way.....I did not support MR because he is a liberal.

Now I am constantly amazed and amused that some if not most ldsers are to thick to get it - MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal and that is why I do not support him.

[svcw]

So you are saying if part of the “body” offends cut it out and you are claiming to be part of the body...and I find your tirade pretty offensive does that mean..........

[greyfoxx39]

This just in...an AP story, so I can't post or link to it, breaking the news that the MA Senate has now OKed same-sex marriages for non-residents....

If Mitt hadn't OK'd the law for MA residents as gov. this would not be a factor today...Thanks, "conservative" gov. Romney...this should really excite McCain in picking you for the VP slot.

[nmh]

“Ok, as someone who is tagged with evangelical and I am not self tagged that way.....I did not support MR because he is a liberal.
Now I am constantly amazed and amused that some if not most ldsers are to thick to get it - MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal and that is why I do not support him.”

With this childish chant:

” ... MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal ... I know I’m not a liberal is neither is Mitt. McPain is. Obama is. Perhaps that is another reason you are attracted to one of the two? Don’t tell me, Mike, the shyster was your man. He’s WORSE than Obama when it comes to liberalism.

[nmh]

“So you are saying if part of the “body” offends cut it out and you are claiming to be part of the body...and I find your tirade pretty offensive does that mean..........”

Let's put it this way, I'm NOT part of whatever “body”you are. I find the Evangelicals that put out a full page ad spewing HATRED about Mitt, not Christian, according to my Bible. So maybe YOU are part of some “body” but it's not the same as mine since it violates Christian teachings ... you know ... the teachings of Christ. Teachings of Christ, require restraint not advertised hatred. Christian pray for anyone and everything. They even pray for their enemies - THESE are the teachings of the Christi if the Bible. Get to know Him ... while there is still time.

[SZonian]

I appreciate your position.

As liberal as Mitt and McCain may be, I don’t believe the comparisons come remotely close to NObamaniacs positions.

Since DH dropped out, I’m in a conundrum. No candidate stands out and I’m in a funk about it. I will probably pull the lever for McCain only as a “lesser of two evils” thing. There is just no way I could I live with myself if NObamaniac is elected knowing I sat by and did nothing.

It seems all conservative pleas are falling on deaf ears.

Best to you and yours,

SZ

[svcw]

Sure its childish just making a point.
MR based on his policies as governor is a liberal, at the very least liberal leaning.
I am not sure who you mean “Mike”. If you are speaking of Huckabee, oh h@ll no.
Where you get that I may be a JM or Barry supporter is waaaay beyond me but oh well.

[svcw]

Let me repeat for you I do not claim or subscribe to the title “evangelical”, can not even say I know what it means except that it gives me the shivers when I am referred to as such.
This ad you keep talking about I can assure I never placed such an ad or have any knowledge of it.
I do not hate MR or ldsers, I find the theology flawed. I find MR to be a liberal, I do not hate liberals.
Again I am amused that the accusers on FR use the word hate allot, I mean really allot.
There is only one thing I hate and that is egg custard. I would start to death before I ate the stuff. And I do not care if you call it flan or cream brulea(sp, ok I know its spelled wrong), its still egg custard.

[SkyPilot]

With this childish chant: MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal, MR is a liberal

The only one I see posting that "childish rant" is you.

The sober fact is that Romney was universally considered a Liberal Republican up until 24 months ago, even by his own party.

We have been going over this since last November. Romney's "Conservative" record is very thin - on homosexuals, on guns, and on judges.

Mitt Romney: A Massachusetts Liberal for President

It would be a mistake of epic proportions for McCain to select Mitt Romney. The Conservative base already is trying again and again to swallow its own spit in order to attempt to vote for McCain.

And yes - the selection of Romney would alienate Evangelical Christians - who are a HUGE portion of the GOP base.

There were 26.9 million Evanglical Christian votes up for grabs in 2004. Bush won 79% of them.

Do you think McCain will match that?

He better hope he even exceeds it if he expects to be in the White House in 2009.

But, I expect McCain to pick Romney.

He isn't even answering Obama's attacks. It appears he wants to lose this race.

If he picks Romney, he will definitely get his wish.

[SkyPilot]

Ignore Romney's past abdication to Democrats - check Ignore Romney's appointment of corrupt, liberal pro-criminal judges, overlooking GOP candidates - check Ignore Romney's ignoring Mass Constitution - check Ignore Romney's wussiness to criticism using tears and fabricated 'religious persecution' - check

Thank you.

His record was, and is, not Conservative - period.

I have stated that evangelicals won't be enthusiastic about Romney, and that is true.

I am a Conservative, and also and Evangelical.

The charge is that is born that Christians will not support Romney out of "bigotry" has a long and sordid history on this board.

Today, I believe that many, many Evangelicals are so turned off with McCain's Liberalism and the Mormon church's arrogant push and enormous effort to obfuscate Romney's record that they will either sit home or write in on election day.

The sad truth is, too many LDS members went over board trying to make Romney a justification for their faith, and a standard bearer for their blind political ambitions.

As to the "bigotry" charge, would I vote for the Catholic Alan Keyes?

You bet!

I am hoping Jewish Joe Lieberman finally joins the GOP, or Michael Medved runs for office?

Absolutely!

Romney? He is a Liberal, and his LDS crowd went over the top in an "Identity Politics" orgy of Jesse Jackson proportions.

I reject him. For that, I get called a "bigot." I also get called a "bigot" for opposing the Mormon faith on the Religion Forum on theological and biblical grounds.

Par for the course for the Mormons here.

I can think of no group that has done more to alienate others, and with such out of control rhetoric, as the LDS believers here on FR.