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Posted on 11/10/2005 12:40:04 PM PST by Yo-Yo
Offers fly as air giants vie to win over Qantas Geoffrey Thomas 11nov05
IT is the clash of the titans but the winner is bound to be Qantas.
Not in its 85-year history has Qantas had offers on the table like the ones in front of the board right now. For Airbus and Boeing, the stakes are sky high. Qantas is a blue chip customer that both manufacturers want on their order books.
Qantas wants up to 100 fuel-efficient jets to beat the fuel crisis and overfly airport hubs such as Singapore and Los Angeles.
On the Qantas shopping list are 45 mid-sized 250-280 seat jets to replace its ageing 767s, 25 larger 300-350 seat jets to overfly hubs and open new routes, and apparently up to 20 450-500 seaters for key routes such as London and Los Angeles.
Qantas wants maximum flexibility to take on Emirates and Singapore Airlines by overflying their hubs and opening up new point-to-point non-stop routes such as Adelaide-Los Angeles, Sydney-New York and even Perth-Los Angeles.
At the same time, Qantas is also looking to exercise options on the giant A380 or may buy the latest model of the 747 - the 747 Advanced - which has had a radical makeover.
Boeing is offering its 787, 777 and new 747 Advanced while Airbus has its A350 and A340, as well as the A380, which touches down in Australia this weekend.
Intense sales pitches aside, Boeing is having a stellar year after being beaten by Airbus in orders taken over the past three years.
According to Airbus chief operating officer, commercial, John Leahy, so far this year "Boeing has picked up 58 per cent of the orders (674) to Airbus's 42 per cent (494), but I hope to even that up by Christmas".
Earlier this year Boeing had some notable wins, signing up Air Canada and Northwest Airlines, both large Airbus customers.
Air Canada ordered up to 96 787s and 777s to replace its A330s and A340 fleet.
But since then Airbus has reworked its A350 to better match the 787, which is the fastest selling twin-aisle jet in history, with 294 announced sales to 23 airlines.
According to insiders at Qantas, Boeing has also been enhancing its 787 to have a higher take-off weight for additional range to give the airline even more non-stop options.
That increase in take-off weight would allow additional lengthening of the fuselage to carry 300 passengers in an international three-class configuration.
Also on Qantas's shopping list is what it calls a hub-buster. The latest variant of the 777, the 200LR, is considered the front-runner.
Boeing is pitching this aircraft to meet a Qantas requirement for a London-Sydney non-stop service.
While that mission is not a problem, the Sydney-London non-stop against winter headwinds is a challenge.
Most intriguing of Qantas's decisions is whether to order more A380s or buy the 747 Advanced.
The 747 Advanced is virtually a new aircraft in the same way that Airbus is claiming its A350 is all new. Providing the impetus for both the 747 Advanced and the A350 are the extremely fuel-efficient engines developed specially for the 787.
In fact, at the launch of the 787, Cathay Pacific chief operating officer Tony Tyler said that the airline was "delighted with the 787's launch because of what it means for the 747 Advanced".
Boeing's pitch is: "Why invest in an A380 (with what Boeing claims are 25 per cent higher trip costs) when the 747 Advanced will deliver 3 per cent lower seat-mile costs?"
Boeing vice-president, marketing, Randy Baseler also claims the 747 Advanced will burn 13 per cent less fuel per seat than a 416-seat 747-400 and 12 per cent less than a 542-seat A380.
However, Baseler concedes that the A380 has an advantage with its all-new wing, but he argues that Boeing is closing the gap with input from the 777 and 787 programs.
Airbus hotly disputes the Boeing figures but the reality lies in the guarantees that each manufacturer offers Qantas.
Claim and counterclaim aside, the 747 Advanced is a significant step forward over the 747-400, which itself has had a new lease on life with 27 sales this year.
According to Boeing regional director, product marketing, Anita Polt, the passenger version will carry 8 per cent more passengers and 21 per cent more cargo than the 747-400 and fly an extra 850 nautical miles, to 8000 nautical miles. This gives it Paris-Perth non-stop capability. However, all the economics in the world are meaningless if the opposition - the A380 - is stealing passengers with the glitz of lounges, grand entry stairs and showers.
Polt admits that "boarding the passengers through the kitchen (galleys) has not been a good look for the 747".
The company has devoted considerable effort to giving the interior a radical makeover to match the A380 publicity.
The 747 Advanced will have an entry more like that of a cruise ship, with the staircase offset to the far side of the main-deck cabin.
In the ceiling above the staircase are three windows, enhancing the feeling of being on a spaceship.
The entry area also features a domed ceiling and a concierge station that doubles as a mini-lounge during the flight.
From the 777 comes the sculptured interior that gives passengers a great deal more storage space, while the aircraft borrows the 787's space-age toilets.
The currently vacant crown space in the 747 has come in for special attention, with Boeing proposing to use the area for Sky Suites and a business centre.
The Sky Suites would accommodate 14 first class, 24 business class or 40 economy bunks.
Boeing expects the 747 Advanced to fly in mid to late 2008 and to be delivered six months later.
Qantas chief executive Geoff Dixon has said that the airline's board will make its decision on fleet types at its December 7 meeting.
How many airlines will keep those options? The 747 had an upstairs piano bar when it first came out. Is it still there? (I've never been upstairs on the 747) Or was it replaced with seats for paying passengers.
I think Airbust is scrambling to catch up.
Why is there no ''U'' following the ''Q''????
Good question and I don't know. Let's ask Google.
From the Qantas website:
Qantas was founded in the Queensland outback in 1920. Registered originally as the Queensland and Northern Territory Aerial Services Limited (QANTAS), we have built a reputation for excellence in safety, operational reliability, engineering and maintenance, and customer service.
There you go, we both learned something today!
Aerospace Ping
QANTAS is an acronym
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The 380 is going to do low passes over Sydney Harbour, with chase planes filming it, should be quite a site!
There are now 3 380's that are flying, and a couple more that are almost ready to fly.
I work right next to Boeing Field and I have never seen that plane with those colors. Is that just a 747-400 ??
That is a China Airlines 747-400 that was delivered last year. It has the new Boeing livery developed for the 787.
http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2004/q4/nr_041207h.html
China Airlines out of Taiwan, not PRC.
The bloom on the vertical stab is their signature emblem.
1. How much overweight was the airplane at roll-out? (Was it MORE than 5 tons?)
2. Did you solve the weight issue completely? (Don't tell us that we would be better off with fewer seats. Don't tell us that the problem will be solved in production units.)
3. Precisely, where was the weight removed from? Anything like landing gear, carry-through? Any safety or service life-affecting areas?
4. Others?
.
Last time I flew a 747, the upstairs was a "lounge" with nothing but seats. But the seats were not for sale, nor did they want passengers to fly the entire trip up there. I talked the stew into letting me do so on an overnight Pacific crossing to escape my closest fellow passengers who were obnoxious drunk loudmouth rock musicians. As I recall, the lounge was only accessible from first class. Very spacious.
Qantas has already ordered some A380s, but they know that the only way to acheve the per seat savings Airbus promises is to fill the plane on every trip. With such a huge plane, they will lose money fast if they have to fly half empty.
They have to buy smaller, more fuel efficient planes for many of the other runs that don't sell out, and they want longer range planes to open up new direct flights.
That means either the Dreamliner or the A350 for the former, and either the 777-200LR or (?) for the latter. It may also mean more 747 Advanced and fewer exercised options for the A380, since the 747 Advanced can use airports that haven't upgraded to handle the A380.
Thank you!! It's been a qandry that's bothered me since I flew the line from Hong Kong to Sydney in 1970. I really enjoy learning something new each day.
A computer designed and constructed airplane is great until an NCO-type field fix is required and we discover that it can't be done.
An ugly sight! The 380 is a good technological achievement, but looks wise, it's a major bow-wow....
Wow look at the Dip in those Wings,never seen that angle before,Nice Pic!
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