Why has the Military not arrived?( Vanity )

Me | 09/01/2005 | Me

[devane617]

Looks like government enforcement of any kind has abandonded NO? What's up with that? I travel the area frequently and know several military installations in the area. Why have they not taken those personel with their weapons into NO and areas? Am I missing something? They should have had a military presence within 12 hours.

[aft_lizard]

You are wrong. Martial law is the prerogitive of the Governor of a state and falls upon the National Guard. If a national crisis happened the posse comitatus act would need to be suspended by congress to allow police action by the active duty military.

You are an idiot calling for impeachment.

[Aerohawk]

I replied to you above. The military cannot just jump and go in short notice. Supplies and equipment will have to organized and transported. Equipment will be in various stages of maintence, repair and reset from the normal operations that they conduct everday. The military needs time to deploy, even if it's just to the next state. Do you suggest we send the soldiers over there with no food, water, shelter or ammo?

[cripplecreek]

My mother is a truck driver who followed a string of military vehicles into Baton Rouge this morning.

[section9]

I am concerned that Northern Command might have underestimated the potential Security/Refugee situation. 28000 NG's are not enough to handle the situation. You have approximately 150,000 stay behinds in New Orleans alone, plus about two million refugees spread out across the Old Confederacy, from the Pecos River in the West to Savannah in the East.

They will require three, count them, three divisions on the road. I have been beating this drum for 48 hours. The 82nd Airborne in Fayetteville, the 101st Air Assault at Fort Campbell, and 2nd Marines at Camp LeJeune. Each unit is in CONUS and should be able to respond. The President should direct Northern Command to move these units at once. That's my humble freaking opinion.

This will require prepositioned refugee camps, spread out to manage population counts (no massive Jenin type camps, but small communities) with educational, hospital, and emergency facilities. This is an enormous undertaking that will require the kind of seat of the pants thinking that soldiers are good at. We have military bases dotted throughout the Old South-that's a start.

Thousands of these refugees will need employment. Time to resurrect the Works Progress Administration and place it under the supervision of the Corps of Engineers and Northern Command. Now I know that under FDR the WPA's unofficial seal was of a man in overalls leaning on a shovel. However, the Alphabet organization that DID work was the CCC, the Civilian Conservation Corps. It worked because FDR was persuaded to place it under the control of the U.S. Army, whose Chief of Staff at the time was George C. Marshall. If we follow that model, we may be able to gainfully employ tens of thousands of people whose only experience in life is "public assistance".

[theophilusscribe]

Members of the National Guard hand out ready-to-eat meals to some of the thousands of displaced residents from Hurricane Katrina at the Superdome, a last-resort shelter, in New Orleans about midnight, Sunday, Aug. 28, 2005.

This photo proivided by the US Navy Thursday Sept. 1, 2005 shows a National Guard multi-purpose utility truck bringing supplies to the SuperDome in downtown New Orleans.

Members of the Kentucky Air National Guard hustle to load two trucks and a variety of other supplies onto a C-130 transport for departure to New Orleans Wednesday, Aug. 31, 2005, in Louisville, Ky.

Georgia Army National Guard Staff Sgt. Joseph Barnard, right, prepares for flight in the tail of a helicopter Wednesday, Aug. 31, 2005

[Travis McGee]

the more I see our current President in action the more I lean toward voting Democratic next election.

Troll. How does it feel, to be a vulture gleefully picking at a dead body?

[billnaz]

You deserve all the flames you get. In your post you came across as a liberal who hates soldiers and anything military-connected. You hate them, that is, until your butt gets in a jam, and then they can't get there fast enough for you.

[devane617]

"...Do you suggest we send the soldiers over there with no food, water, shelter or ammo?..."

No I am not suggesting anything like what you explained. However, this is a disaster, along with earthquakes, and terrorists attacks that we should be ready to deploy within hours. We should have the equipment staged for just such an emergency that would place the NG in the area within hours. There are currently several threads here on FR and constant stories on the MSM that say the area of NO is completely out of hand and getting worse. It's been three days.

[Paloma_55]

I think that a government created by man is incapable of dealing with this problem.

GOD is the answer.

God can inspire the 250 MILLION people in this nation to reach out and help. That can, and will solve the problem.

Relying on the military, or any government agency is not going to really solve the problem.

Yes, we should get government action to address the immediate humanitarian and security needs, but the government is not going to solve the larger problem of hundreds of thousands of evacuees.

[RedBeaconNY]

...the beauty of sarcasm... lost to thine ears.

[Stentor]

This is not a movie, where the soldiers get on the trucks in one frame and dismount the trucks in the next frame.

The delusion that reality is a series of jump cuts is a spreading disease.

[DocRock]

"They should have had a military presence within 12 hours."

They did have military in there. This was Tuesday.



click the pic to watch the video

[section9]

Even what I advocate is a Corps level road movement. That is a massive undertaking requiring coordination of thousands of troops, fuel, and logistics to support those troops in the field. We can do this in Iraq, and we can do this in the Mississippi Delta. However, DON'T BE AN ASS CLOWN and assume that road movement is an easy thing. Even moving one battalion in coordination with another battalion (that's about 1600 men altogether) requires a couple of light colonels and their CSM's having their absolute acts together. Road movement of entire divisions, plus air assault assets such as those possessed by the 101st, usually require WEEKS of planning. This is being done on 72 hours notice.

Now after all that, Einstein, if you want to run out and vote for the freaking Donks, go right the f*%k ahead.

Be Seeing You,

Chris

[theophilusscribe]

National Guard trucks haul residents through flood waters to the Superdome, a shelter of last resort, after their neighborhoods were flooded after Hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans, Louisiana Tuesday, Aug. 30, 2005.

National Guard members from the 233 Battalion Engine travel southbound on Interstate 55 near, Jackson, Miss., Tuesday, Aug. 30, 2005, as they make their way toward Gulfport, Miss., to assist with the Hurricane Katrina relief.

In this handout photo provided by the U.S. Navy, the amphibious assault ship USS Iwo Jima pulls away from her berth at Naval Station Norfolk, Wednesday, Aug. 31, 2005, in Norfolk, Va., enroute to New Orleans. From Navy ships and Army helicopters to the USNS Comfort hospital ship, the Pentagon is mobilizing possibly an unprecedented U.S. rescue-and-relief mission for areas devastated by Hurricane Katrina.

An army truck evacuates stranded New Orleans residents from the Superdome sports stadium in the hurricane-ravaged city of New Orleans August 31, 2005.

[aft_lizard]

Read les_miserables post again. It wasnt sarcasm, therefore not lost to my own ears, or eyes in this case.

[aft_lizard]

Read the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878(which was made after reconstruction so that no standing us army would police its own citizens after the Civil War)And also notice the Acts of Congress parts, which are repeatedly mentioned.

SEC. 15. From and after the passage of this act it shall not be lawful to employ any part of the Army of the United States, as a posse comitatus, or otherwise, for the purpose of executing the laws, except in such cases and under such circumstances as such employment of said force may be expressly authorized by the Constitution or by act of Congress; and no money appropriated by this act shall be used to pay any of the expenses incurred in the employment of any troops in violation of this section And any person willfully violating the provisions of this section shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor and on conviction thereof shall be punished by fine not exceeding ten thousand dollars or imprisonment not exceeding two years or by both such fine and imprisonment.

10 U.S.C. (United States Code) 375

Sec. 375. Restriction on direct participation by military personnel:

The Secretary of Defense shall prescribe such regulations as may be necessary to ensure that any activity (including the provision of any equipment or facility or the assignment or detail of any personnel) under this chapter does not include or permit direct participation by a member of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps in a search, seizure, arrest, or other similar activity unless participation in such activity by such member is otherwise authorized by law.

18 U.S.C. 1385

Sec. 1385. Use of Army and Air Force as posse comitatus

Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of
Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to
execute the laws shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

[cowboyway]

We should have the equipment staged for just such an emergency that would place the NG in the area within hours.

Every community has equipment and manpower ready for emergencies. KATRINA WIPED IT OUT, IDIOT!

Now it has to be brought in from other places. That takes a little thing called time. Are you familiar with the time concept?

There are currently several threads here on FR and constant stories on the MSM that say the area of NO is completely out of hand and getting worse. It's been three days.

Spoken like a true liberal. In any situation, people, individuals, have an obligation to act in a civilized manner.

Your (the liberal) solution is to have round the clock government guardians, so that if a disaster should arise, immediate control can be initiated.

Bye bye freedom.

[devane617]

Why all the defensiveness over a legitimate question? I feel like I have stirred the ghost of that nutcase SMEDLEYBUTLER.

[Les_Miserables]

Well, I may be an idiot but before you go calling names you might look in the mirror (after you read this. Dip.)

[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 32, Volume 3, Parts 400 to 629]
[Revised as of July 1, 1998]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 32CFR501.4]

TITLE 32--NATIONAL DEFENSE
CHAPTER V--DEPARTMENT OF THE ARMY
PART 501--EMPLOYMENT OF TROOPS IN AID OF CIVIL AUTHORITIES
--Table of Contents
Sec. 501.4 Martial law.
It is unlikely that situations requiring the commitment of Federal Armed Forces will necessitate the declaration of martial law. When Federal Armed Forces are committed in the event of civil disturbances, their proper role is to support, not supplant, civil authority. Martial law depends for its justification upon public necessity. Necessity gives rise to its creation; necessity justifies its exercise; and necessity limits its duration. The extent of the military force used and the actual measures taken, consequently, will depend upon the actual threat to order and public safety which exists at the time. In most instances the decision to impose martial law is made by the President, who normally announces his decision by a proclamation, which usually contains his instructions concerning its exercise and any limitations thereon. However, the decision to impose martial law may be made by the local commander on the spot, if the circumstances demand immediate action, and time and available communications facilities do not permit obtaining prior approval from higher authority (Sec. 501.2). Whether or not a proclamation exists, it is incumbent upon ommanders concerned to weigh every proposed action against the threat to public order and safety it is designed to meet, in order that the necessity therefor may be ascertained. When Federal Armed Forces have been committed in an objective area in a martial law situation, the population of the affected area will be informed of the rules of conduct and other restrictive measures the military is authorized to enforce. These will normally be announced by proclamation or order and will be given the widest possible publicity by all available media. Federal Armed Forces ordinarily will exercise police powers previously inoperative in the affected area, restore and maintain order, insure the essential mechanics of distribution, transportation, and communication, and initiate necessary relief measures.

[theophilusscribe]

Petty Officer 1st Class Steven Huerta prepares to hoist two children into a Coast Guard rescue helicopter in New Orleans, Louisiana on August 29, 2005
Stranded New Orleans residents are evacuated from the hurricane-ravaged city on an Army truck August 31, 2005.

U.S. Army Lt. Gen. Russel Honore, cdr. Joint Task Force Katrina, salutes as he walks on the flight deck aboard the amphibious assault ship USS Bataan, Wednesday, Aug. 31, 2005, in Norfolk, Va. From Navy ships and Army helicopters to the USNS Comfort hospital ship, the Pentagon is mobilizing possibly an unprecedented U.S. rescue-and-relief mission for areas devastated by Hurricane Katrina.

This photo released by the Department of Defense shows the Landing Craft Utility 1656 as it departs for New Orleans, from the well deck of the amphibious assault ship USS Bataan on Wednesday, Aug. 31, 2005, in the Gulf of Mexico loaded with sand bags, water, a small flat-bottom boat lifejackets, a High Mobility Multi-Purpose Wheeled Vehicle, and supplies to last 10 days. Department of Defense units are mobilizing to support the Federal Emergency Management Agency's disaster relief efforts in the Gulf Coast areas devastated by Hurricane Katrina.

Coast Guard Petty Officer 2nd Class Justin R. Feussner, 33, writes down the locations of stranded individuals in need of assistance in the wake of Hurricane Katrina on Monday at Coast Guard Aviation Training Center Mobile, Alabama, August 29, 2005

A resident is rescued by the U.S. Coast Guard from a home surrounded by floodwaters from Hurricane Katrina Tuesday, Aug. 30, 2005 in New Orleans.

A rescue worker guides a flood victim toward a U.S. Coast Guard helicopter during rescue operations in New Orleans, Louisiana in this still video image taken on August 30, 2005.

Arkansas Air National Guard Sgts. Perry Hopman, left, Steve Otis, center, and Jason Barfield ready a helicopter for flight Tuesday, Aug. 30, 2005, at Camp Robinson in North Little Rock, Ark. The crew is scheduled to assist with rescue efforts on the Gulf Coast in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.