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Chromosomal Disharmony Leads to the Formation of a New Species
furball4paws

Posted on 02/26/2005 3:20:33 PM PST by furball4paws

In 1927, Karpechenko made a hybrid of the common radish, Raphanus sativus, and cabbage, Brassica oleracea. Each parent has a diploid chromosome number of 2N=18. The hybrid also had 18 chromosomes, but because normal sperm and eggs could not be formed, the hybrid was sterile, as is common in such cases.

However, some of the "sterile" hybrids produced a few viable seeds. These seeds were produced when the chromosome number spontaneously doubled. The doubling permitted the pairing of partner chromosomes and the formation of gametes with 1N=18.

Karpechenko witnessed the birth of a new species in the passage of only 3 plant generations. He named the new species Raphanobrassica. It was fully fertile and could not cross with either parent. Unfortunately, the new species had the root of a cabbage and the leaf of a radish, and therefore had no commercial value.

This process of autopolyploidy is responsible for many commercial crop plants (tobacco, for one). It is estimated by botanists that 25-50% of existing plant species arose through a mechanism of autopolyploidy.

References. 1. Niklas, KJ. 1997, The Evolutionary Biology of Plants. University of Chicago Press 2. Karpechenko, GD. 1927. Polyploid hybrids of Raphanus sativus X Brassica oleracea. Zeit. Ind. Abst. Vererbungslehre 48:1-58.


TOPICS: Science
KEYWORDS: chromosomes; crevo; crevolist; evolution; hybrids; plants; speciation
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To: VadeRetro; Junior; longshadow; RadioAstronomer; Doctor Stochastic; js1138; Shryke; RightWhale; ...
Evolution Ping

The List-O-Links
A conservative, pro-evolution science list, now with over 350 names.
See the list's explanation, then FReepmail to be added or dropped.
To assist beginners: But it's "just a theory", Evo-Troll's Toolkit,
and How to argue against a scientific theory.

41 posted on 02/25/2006 2:40:17 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: furball4paws; All
I'm an idiot. I didn't realize this thread was an old one. You just linked to it here.

And I figured ... well ... sorry folks! False ping.

42 posted on 02/25/2006 2:52:31 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: furball4paws
Another "For Dummies" resource on polyploidy.

Speciation by Polyploidy.

Filed under Speciation: Can New Species Arise?

43 posted on 02/25/2006 2:56:03 PM PST by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: BipolarBob
Let's see now. As a creationoid, I would be more impressed by (1) The re-animation of a DEAD person/animal or (2) The creation of life from some soup (primordial or otherwise). Just because you don't believe in God doesn't mean He doesn't exist. One day one of us will be proven wrong.

Neither of the things you would be more impressed by have much to do with whether common descent is true.

44 posted on 02/25/2006 2:57:51 PM PST by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: furball4paws
I'm waiting for the viable mule of Heinlein's creation from "Time Enough for Love"
45 posted on 02/25/2006 3:34:29 PM PST by Vaquero (time again for the Crusades.)
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To: furball4paws
“God shmod! I want my monkey-man!”
46 posted on 02/25/2006 3:38:54 PM PST by Vaquero (time again for the Crusades.)
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To: furball4paws

But corn still produces corn!!! HAHAHAHA!!! </YEC lunatic mode>


47 posted on 02/25/2006 4:06:01 PM PST by ml1954 (NOT the disruptive troll seen frequently on CREVO threads)
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To: furball4paws
Unfortunately, the new species had the root of a cabbage and the leaf of a radish, and therefore had no commercial value.

If that's all evolution can do then the hell with it. We should have a committee formed to arrive at a consensus about what type of species we want.

48 posted on 02/25/2006 4:11:14 PM PST by Rudder
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To: PatrickHenry
And I figured ... well ... sorry folks! False ping.

1-year-anniversary-but-it's-still-just-a-plant PING.

49 posted on 02/25/2006 4:44:45 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: The Chicago Manual of Style, 14th ed.)
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To: jennyp
Re: your tag line:

Next do the APA style manual.

You know...just for laughs.

50 posted on 02/25/2006 4:59:41 PM PST by Rudder
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To: BipolarBob
". I have not heard of them bringing a dead person back to life that has been in the grave for three days though."

Are you suggesting evolution prove itself to be God? (I refer back to your original 'abiogenesis' post)

51 posted on 02/25/2006 5:06:58 PM PST by b_sharp (Science adjusts theories to fit evidence, creationism distorts evidence to fit the Bible.)
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To: BipolarBob

" I have not heard of them bringing a dead person back to life that has been in the grave for three days though."

Jesus wasn't dead for three whole days before the resurrection. He died Friday afternoon, and was resurrected by Sunday morning. That's about a day and a half.


52 posted on 02/25/2006 5:20:59 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: PatrickHenry

I link to this thread periodically when the 'oids complain we can't make a new species in the lab. How you found and thought it was a ping is beyond me.


53 posted on 02/25/2006 5:47:31 PM PST by furball4paws (Awful Offal)
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To: furball4paws

It was a wardrobe malfunction.


54 posted on 02/25/2006 6:00:54 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: furball4paws; longshadow
It's interesting -- to me anyway -- to compare the evolution of the ping list logo. Post #12 has the ping I made in this thread almost exactly one year ago, which is reproduced here:

EvolutionPing
A pro-evolution science list with over 240 names. See list's description at my homepage. FReepmail to be added/dropped.

We then had somewhat over 240 names, which I thought was a lot. The latest (erroneously posted) version of the logo is at post #41, but reproduced here:

Evolution Ping

The List-O-Links
A conservative, pro-evolution science list, now with over 350 names.
See the list's explanation, then FReepmail to be added or dropped.
To assist beginners: But it's "just a theory", Evo-Troll's Toolkit,
and How to argue against a scientific theory.

We now have over 350 names, so we've gained 110 in a year. Verily, evolution is on its last legs.

55 posted on 02/25/2006 6:15:37 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: PatrickHenry

"It's interesting -- to me anyway -- to compare the evolution of the ping list logo."

It's still a ping list. I'll be impressed when it grows wings and becomes a bird.


56 posted on 02/25/2006 6:18:28 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: Rudder

Next do the APA style manual.

You know...just for laughs.

I dunno, I think it'd be a big comedown. :-)
57 posted on 02/25/2006 6:18:50 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: The Chicago Manual of Style, 14th ed.)
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To: CarolinaGuitarman
I'll be impressed when it grows wings and becomes a bird.

I'm working on it.

58 posted on 02/25/2006 6:27:05 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: PatrickHenry
We now have over 350 names, so we've gained 110 in a year.

Do you realize, that's a growth rate of over 45% per year?

Clearly, this means the pro-evo side on FR is dwindling badly, and could disappear completely in the next few months.

< /Luddite Logic mode>

59 posted on 02/25/2006 6:40:46 PM PST by longshadow (FReeper #405, entering his ninth year of ignoring nitwits, nutcases, and recycled newbies)
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To: PatrickHenry
BTW, when the ping list "shrinks" up to 400, does the GrandMaster plan to hold the usual DarwinCentral™-sponsored Human Sacrifice and Three-Day Debauchery, or will he really let his hair down and celebrate this time?
60 posted on 02/25/2006 6:45:49 PM PST by longshadow (FReeper #405, entering his ninth year of ignoring nitwits, nutcases, and recycled newbies)
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