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'Passion' Needs Postscript
ADL ^ | Feb 3rd 2004 | By Abraham H. Foxman and Rabbi Granatoor

Posted on 02/03/2004 9:04:52 AM PST by missyme

In a recent interview for a Christian television network about his film "The Passion of the Christ," director Mel Gibson, complaining about his critics, repeated the following phrase four times: "He is an anti-Semite" - suggesting this was the accusation repeatedly being made against him.

We have never accused Gibson of being an anti-Semite. But judging from the E-mails and letters we have received since we spoke out after seeing the film last month - some blatantly anti-Semitic, many more suggesting our criticism was somehow dishonest - there is a need to clear the air.

First, let us repeat that we do not believe that Gibson intended his film to be a passion of hate. Our concerns stem from history. For nearly 2,000 years, Jews have been the victims of persecution and pogroms fueled by the age-old canard that Jews bear responsibility for the death of Jesus for all time.

The charge of "deicide" or of Jews as being "Christ killers" has persisted through the presentation of Passion plays despite the Catholic Church's historic Vatican II pronouncement in the early 1960s. It denounced anti-Semitism and stated clearly that the Jews of the past, as well as the Jews of today, bear no responsibility for Jesus' death.

Gibson's film rejects the modern church reforms. We were saddened and pained to find that "The Passion of the Christ" unambiguously portrays Jews as being responsible for the death of Jesus.

We are shocked that Gibson has not fulfilled his promise to remove the most troublesome aspects of this film. We are especially concerned with a scene in which a mob of Jews who are present when Pontius Pilate condemns Jesus to death calls down a blood curse (Matthew 27:25). This scene so far remains intact, even though Gibson indicated that he was removing it.

Even if that particular scene were removed, there would still be ample material in the film to reinforce the image of Jewish responsibility.

We are troubled that Gibson continues to spurn our requests for an audience and that he feels the criticism of his film is part of a campaign to label him an anti-Semite. Gibson's only response to our numerous requests for a meeting was a brief letter, sent last week, in which he failed to address any of the concerns we have raised.

Our concern is that the images could be used by those who are disposed toward hatred to harden their hearts.

Jewish and Christian leaders have not given up hope. We have urged Gibson to consider adding to the movie a postscript with him coming on screen at the end to implore his viewers not to let the film turn some toward a passion of hate.


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To: missyme
Isn't it amazing. If you read Isaiah 53, say to a large congregation of 15,000 people like Chuck Smith might have done, they don't feel like getting a gun and killing Jews. Movies are different than the books. They imply a reality that is undefined with respect to inspiration, apochryphal if you will.
101 posted on 02/03/2004 1:02:11 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: missyme
That riot was based on a problem that exsisted between Orthodox Jews and Blacks...When BLACKS fight agaisnt white racism it always includes Christians and Jews because there is no difference in skin color...

That riot was based on antisemitism.

102 posted on 02/03/2004 1:03:20 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: missyme
Gibson's film rejects the modern church reforms. We were saddened and pained to find that "The Passion of the Christ" unambiguously portrays Jews as being responsible for the death of Jesus.

We are shocked that Gibson has not fulfilled his promise to remove the most troublesome aspects of this film. We are especially concerned with a scene in which a mob of Jews who are present when Pontius Pilate condemns Jesus to death calls down a blood curse (Matthew 27:25). This scene so far remains intact, even though Gibson indicated that he was removing it.

The ADL is correct in stating that the Vatican II Ecumenical Council in the early 1960s clarified that the Catholic Church rejects collective responsibility of Jews for all generations for the death of Jesus. If Gibson's film merely presents the Gospel account, however, then it is in no way contrary to that teaching of Vatican II. Some Jews, as well as Romans, are directly responsible for Jesus' being condemned to die, as there were some Jews and Romans at the time who were not responsible. We cannot blame any Jew of the present day for that. And just because the Jewish crowd in the Gospel says responsibility will be upon future generations, that is not a statement of God, but just the opinion of those individuals, and as we know from the Church's teaching, it is a wrongful opinion.

103 posted on 02/03/2004 1:05:00 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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To: Frank_Discussion
There is a never-ending assault on truth. Reconstructionists are changing history as each year goes by. Throughout history there are more than enough examples where Christians were very much in the wrong and where just about every other kind of people, group. race, etc. you name it, committed atrocious acts. What happened, happened! That's what history is supposed to be, what happened! Unfortunately, truth has been eliminated and replaced by the wonderful world of grey. You're never accountable for what you say or do, it's always someone else's, somethinmg else's fault.
104 posted on 02/03/2004 1:06:04 PM PST by elephantlips
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To: missyme
The Blacks have been subject to white racism

I don't perceive it as white racism, but simply racism and injustice. The laws have done enough to remedy past discrimination. They simply need to treat people fairly now. The problem remains within people depending on their level of spirituality, civilization, and to a lesser extent education.

105 posted on 02/03/2004 1:07:08 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: Unam Sanctam
Some Jews, as well as Romans, are directly responsible for Jesus' being condemned to die, as there were some Jews and Romans at the time who were not responsible.

Some of the criticism is that the movie portrays the Romans favorably the Jews unfavorably. The movie is not the book. The book is not the movie. You will of course see the movie and form your own opinion.

106 posted on 02/03/2004 1:09:02 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: af_vet_1981
Exactly....
That is why it is very important that a move like "The Passion of Christ" be shown to many that we are "ALL" guilty of sin, but through the sacrafice on "one" There is "HOPE" (That so many people have lost)There is "LOVE" (That so many people have forgotten to do for there neighbor) There is "FORGIVENESS" (That we all need a lesson in)and there is a "WAY" that hopeless sinners like myself have a place with the Almighty living G-d in his Kingdom....
107 posted on 02/03/2004 1:16:58 PM PST by missyme
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To: missyme
That is why it is very important that a move like "The Passion of Christ" be shown

I think it is more important that they simply read the books. From the comments I've already seen on FR I simply don't trust the emotions this movie has uncloaked.

108 posted on 02/03/2004 1:20:20 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: af_vet_1981
The movie is not the book. The book is not the movie.

The movie is being criticized for elements that are present in the Gospels as well. We all recognize the problems with anti-Semitism among Christians in the past. Collective responsibility was explicitly condemned by the Church at Vatican II, and the Pope tried to "purify memory" with an apology at the millennium. Foxman might justly criticize that this teaching is not more loudly mentioned, and I personally would not even object to having a quotation from "Nostra Aetate" in either the opening or closing credits of the movie. But for Foxman to say that mere presentation of the Gospel story, in which members of the Jewish Establishment were instrumental in Jesus' death, as in and of itself anti-Semitic, is simply ridiculous and an attempt to make a politically-correct falsification of history. Of course the Pharisees, the Sadducees and the Sanhedrin thought Jesus was a false teacher and a heretic, since he claimed to be the Messiah and differed in his interpretation of the Mosaic law. The Talmuds, which stem from the Pharisaical Rabbinical tradition, denounce Jesus as a false teacher and a black magician. These are just facts. Yes, they can be misused to support the notion of collective punishment, but the facts themselves do not support such a notion, and the Church has condemned such a notion. I think Foxman is actually making the situation much worse than it is by facile accusation of anti-Semitism when there has not been any such thing.

109 posted on 02/03/2004 1:34:05 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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To: Unam Sanctam
collective punishment = collective responsibility
110 posted on 02/03/2004 1:35:25 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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To: af_vet_1981
The emotion you see on these posts are "EMOTIONAL" and "PASSIONATE" because we see the world falling apart we see moral decay daily we see the lefist liberal throwing
G-d out of everything we have on earth that is a gift from G-d...
We now have a superstar ACTOR and PRODUCER who has defied HOLLYWOOD in there way as the worst situation possible. Making G-d the point of everyone's attention.

The secular world is watching in AWE an unmesaurable amount of people anxiously waiting to see "The Passion of Christ" in 21 days, no longer is Lord of the Rings the talk of the town or Ben and Jen or the other Hollywood crap..

This movie is an OPENING for all people. For beleivers to enhance there faith in Jesus and try to be more faitful to his message.
And for un-beleivers that will give them a glimpse of the sacrafice Jesus had for them, and Maybe just Maybe they will want to explore this "Jesus" more closely and follow his word..Who knows Maybe YOU?

FOXMAN is far from showing himself to be a Man of G-d and that is why there is so much emotion stirred up when we read his latest antics agaisnt the film...
111 posted on 02/03/2004 1:36:25 PM PST by missyme
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To: missyme
We are shocked that Gibson has not fulfilled his promise to remove the most troublesome aspects of this film.

Maybe we should remove the most troublesome aspects of the Bible, too, while we're at it. Would that make you happy? < /sarcasm >

112 posted on 02/03/2004 1:39:27 PM PST by BlessedBeGod
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To: BlessedBeGod
What there after is "Just Remove the Film" but in 21 days they will see: A Miraculous Event Happen....
113 posted on 02/03/2004 1:41:23 PM PST by missyme
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To: missyme
The Jews captured Jesus, the Jews took Jesus to Pilate, the Jews when given a choice still called for his death.... while I believe Christs death was preordained by God himself.... you cannot acurrately portray the crucifiction of Christ without showing the Jews turning him over to the Romans forcably and calling for his death... you don't have to like it, but THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED!

It is clear that the Jews carry a 2000 year old guilt trip over this.... and continue to try to pretend it did not happen. (or at least Some jews anyway).
114 posted on 02/03/2004 1:43:49 PM PST by HamiltonJay
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To: HamiltonJay
The point is WE ARE ALL GUILTY IN THE DEATH OF JESUS CHRIST" All, Every Gentile Every Jew Every Muslim everyone that is a human being is responsible...The only ones that are not responsible are ANIMALS and if they EXSIST ALIENS in OUTER SPACE. The focus of the crucifixcion is not on any group of people. Salvation comes through the JEWS and that is the Root of Christianity..
115 posted on 02/03/2004 1:51:41 PM PST by missyme
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To: missyme
The emotion I see on these threads is one of hatred for Jews (but oddly not so much the Catholics) who have dared to criticize the movie. It feels like a mob to me. I don't perceive any love in it whatsoever. It is more like a soccer game with violence about to break out should the score or calls not go the way the crowd wants. Intimidation, threats, railings, ... I don't see any good in it whatsoever.

I have no problem with anyone reading and following the book. In fact, I encourage it. Please do it.

As for the LOTR movies, they were fantasy with themes that apply to this generation. I don't recall any strife like this on those threads. I imagine if anyone had the nerve to make a movie about Muhammed these days people would die because of the strife. I hope that does not happen with this movie like it did with the Passion plays in Europe.

You say the world is getting rid of her demons
I say "Baby what have you been smoking?"

116 posted on 02/03/2004 1:52:09 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: af_vet_1981
The emotion I see on these threads is one of hatred for Jews (but oddly not so much the Catholics) who have dared to criticize the movie.

I don't hate Jews and am not anti-Semitic. I fully blame the Palestinians for the lack of progress in Middle East peace. However, Christians are likely to become upset when they are falsely accused of anti-Semitism, which is what Foxman appears to be doing, and of accusing the Gospels of anti-Semitism for merely stating the fact that the Jewish establishment of Jesus' time did not like him and lobbied the Romans to put him to death. It is the injustice of Foxman's accusations excites the anger, not anti-Semitism.

117 posted on 02/03/2004 1:56:27 PM PST by Unam Sanctam
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To: Unam Sanctam
However, Christians are likely to become upset when they are falsely accused of anti-Semitism, which is what Foxman appears to be doing, and of accusing the Gospels of anti-Semitism for merely stating the fact that the Jewish establishment of Jesus' time did not like him and lobbied the Romans to put him to death. It is the injustice of Foxman's accusations excites the anger, not anti-Semitism.

We have never accused Gibson of being an anti-Semite. But judging from the E-mails and letters we have received since we spoke out after seeing the film last month - some blatantly anti-Semitic, many more suggesting our criticism was somehow dishonest - there is a need to clear the air.

First, let us repeat that we do not believe that Gibson intended his film to be a passion of hate. Our concerns stem from history. For nearly 2,000 years, Jews have been the victims of persecution and pogroms fueled by the age-old canard that Jews bear responsibility for the death of Jesus for all time. >

The charge of "deicide" or of Jews as being "Christ killers" has persisted through the presentation of Passion plays despite the Catholic Church's historic Vatican II pronouncement in the early 1960s. It denounced anti-Semitism and stated clearly that the Jews of the past, as well as the Jews of today, bear no responsibility for Jesus' death.

118 posted on 02/03/2004 2:03:47 PM PST by af_vet_1981
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To: missyme
In a recent interview for a Christian television network about his film "The Passion of the Christ," director Mel Gibson, complaining about his critics, repeated the following phrase four times: "He is an anti-Semite" - suggesting this was the accusation repeatedly being made against him. We have never accused Gibson of being an anti-Semite... We are troubled that Gibson continues to spurn our requests for an audience and that he feels the criticism of his film is part of a campaign to label him an anti-Semite.

Now, where would Mel get a wacky idea like that?

"I think [Gibson]'s infected, seriously infected, with some very, very serious anti-Semitic views." -- Abe Foxman

"[Gibson]'s got classical anti-Semitic views." -- Abe Foxman

"When [Gibson] can say that he now understands how Jesus felt now - not before he made the film, not because the gospel inspired him, but now - because he has been criticized and attacked. That's anti-Semitism." -- Abe Foxman

"...does [Gibson] have attitudes that are anti-Semitic? Yes." -- Abe Foxman

Oh.


119 posted on 02/03/2004 2:05:03 PM PST by Sloth (It doesn't take 60 seats to control the Senate; it only takes 102 testicles.)
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To: af_vet_1981
THE DEFINITIONS OF HATE AND EMOTION..

1.HATE-A dislike so strong it demands immediate action'"Which is "Sucide Bombers"

2.EMOTION: A Strong feeling...

What you see on these posts are #2


120 posted on 02/03/2004 2:16:44 PM PST by missyme
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