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OBAMA KNEW HE WASN’T ELIGIBLE FOR POTUS
Give Me Liberty ^ | 8/12/09 | Lynn Dartez

Posted on 08/12/2009 5:27:31 PM PDT by pissant

If one were to look at the activity on Capitol Hill during the campaign, there would be no question in their minds that both McCain and Obama were sweating the “natural born citizen” issue.

How do we arrive at that conclusion? We take McCain’s ingrained, glib advice and “Look at the record, my friends“.

Doing just that, we find that back on February 28, 2008, Sen. Claire McCaskill (D-MO) introduced a bill to the Senate for consideration. That bill was known as S. 2678: Children of Military Families Natural Born Citizen Act. The bill was co-sponsored by Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL), Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-NY), Sen. Robert Menendez (D-NJ), and Sen. Thomas Coburn (R-OK).

Bill S. 2678 attempted to change article II, section 1, clause 5 of the Constitution of the United States with reference to the requirements of being a “natural born citizen” and hence; the entitlement to run for President of the United States. This bill met the same fate that similar attempts to change the Constitution have in the past. Attempts such as The Natural Born Citizen Act were known to have failed and the text scrubbed from the internet, with only a shadow-cached copy left, that only the most curious public can find.

Sen. McCaskill, her co-sponsors, fellow colleagues and legal counsel, contend that the Constitution is ambiguous in article II, section 1 and requires clarification. But does it? According to the framers and such drafters as John Bingham, we find the definition to be quite clear:

I find no fault with the introductory clause [S 61 Bill], which is simply declaratory of what is written in the Constitution, that every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen… . . – John Bingham in the United States House on March 9, 1866

From the days of James Madison to the present, the courts have held that the amendment process be justiciable in accordance with its constitutionality and not self-serving or political. But is that what happened here? Again, we must go to the record.

Within only five short weeks after Senate Bill 2678 faded from the floor, we find Sen. Claire McCaskill back again, making another attempt with Senate Resolution 511. On April 10, 2008, she introduced a secondary proposal in the form of a non-binding resolution, recognizing John McCain as a “natural born citizen” in defiance of the Constitution. Curiously, it contained the same identical co-sponsors, Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton.

ABCNews.com reported:

“With questions – however serious – about whether Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., is eligible to run for president since he was born outside U.S. borders on an American Naval base, Sens. Patrick Leahy, D-Vermont, the chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, and Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo. today introduced a non-binding resolution expressing the sense of the U.S. Senate that McCain qualifies as a “natural born Citizen,” as specified in the Constitution and eligible for the highest office in the land.

Co-sponsors include Sens. Hillary Clinton, D-NY, and Barack Obama, D-Illinois; Leahy said he anticipates it will pass unanimously.”

One has to wonder — what dire urgency could there possibly have been in persisting with trying to legislate a candidate into being a “natural born citizen”? Certainly providing a birth certificate and reading the Constitution would be more than sufficient. Why did these candidates and their wishful nominees go to such lengths in the Senate when obviously, they had more pressing matters to attend to? And why were there two Senators co-sponsoring such an issue, twice, who were in direct competition with John McCain in the 2008 election?

One answer is that looking at John McCain’s long-form birth certificate reveals he was not a natural born citizen and Barack Obama hasn’t submitted his long-form at all. John McCain was born in an “unincorporated territory”, held by the courts to be not part of the United States for constitutional purposes. Barack Obama has submitted only a Certification of Live Birth, but Hawaii law will certify a live birth using that document for births that occurred even outside of the country. Furthermore, Barack Obama’s father was Kenyan and never an American citizen. Since the status of citizenship occurs at birth, this makes Barack Obama a citizen if born in Hawaii, but not a natural born citizen. One must have two citizen parents, at the time of birth, and be born on U.S. soil, to be deemed a natural born citizen and be declared eligible for the presidency. The Senate, for all their trouble, cannot legislate a person’s born status. It happens at birth, according to the law.

While Senate Bill 2678 fell to the wayside, Senate Resolution 511 was passed on April 30, 2008 as a non-binding resolution. However, S.R. 511 is not a law, but rather, a unanimous opinion. Technically, it means absolutely nothing what they’ve written as it’s not a law, nor did the matter reach the House for review. It’s a stepping-stone in the larger scheme of things that haven’t happened yet; the push to change our Constitution.

World Net Daily reported on November 13, 2008:

More than a half-dozen legal challenges have been filed in federal and state courts demanding President-elect Barack Obama’s decertification from ballots or seeking to halt elector meetings, claiming he has failed to prove his U.S. citizenship status.

An Obama campaign spokeswoman told WND the complaints are unfounded.

“All I can tell you is that it is just pure garbage,” she said. “There have been several lawsuits, but they have been dismissed.”

Perhaps someone should have informed Obama’s spokeswoman that many of these cases have not been dismissed at all, rather they are mounting, and her statements are in fact, pure “garbage”.

Then perhaps someone may prompt an answer from the Obama spokespeople as to why they were entertaining the thought of fiddling with the United States Constitution back in February and April of THIS YEAR? Perhaps because it was in the best interest of Sen. Obama.

Then what of Sen. Claire McCaskill? What possible interest could she have had in these proceedings and leading the charge with her proposals? Was it a bonafide Constitutional issue of judicial importance, or rather a political one?

Digging further into the record we find that according to Wikki and subsequent footnotes therein:

“In January 2008, Claire McCaskill decided to endorse Senator Barack Obama in his campaign for the Democratic nomination for the presidential elections of 2008, making her one of the first senators to do so. She has been one of the most visible faces for his campaign.[14] McCaskill’s support was crucial to Obama’s narrow victory in the Missouri primary in February, 2008. She had been frequently mentioned as a possible vice presidential choice of Senator Obama in the 2008 run for the White House…”

So what we see is a definite political motive being dragged into the Senate for the purposes of legitimizing the 2008 candidates. But if these candidates were legitimate already, there would obviously be no reason for these proceedings.

So political was the motive of McCaskill, even Missouri’s Governor, Matt Blunt revealed that Sen. McCaskill was involved in the “abusive use of Missouri Law Enforcement“. This was dubbed as the “Truth Squad” during the election campaign by the media. The Truth Squad was comprised of Missouri officials and attorneys who set up shop on the streets of Missouri and threatened the public with criminal penalties and lawsuits if they engaged in critical speech against Sen. Obama. The Obama campaign also issued cease and desist letters to media station managers who carried advertisers who were unfriendly towards Barack Obama, namely, the NRA. Citizen outrage prompted this response from Governor Blunt:

“Obama and the leader of his Missouri campaign Senator Claire McCaskill have attached the stench of police state tactics to the Obama-Biden campaign.

What Senator Obama and his helpers are doing is scandalous beyond words, the party that claims to be the party of Thomas Jefferson is abusing the justice system and offices of public trust to silence political criticism with threats of prosecution and criminal punishment.”

Considering these facts and the judicial record, there is every reason to believe that Sen. McCaskill had no interest in resolving Sen. McCain’s eligibility, but Sen. Obama’s long-term. She manipulated the Senate and then threatened the media and the public thereafter, politically motivated at the prospect of becoming Obama’s Vice-Presidential pick. But it didn’t stop there.

Chairman Patrick J. Leahy entered into the Senate record a legal analysis of two high-powered attorneys hired by Sen. McCain – Theodore Olson and Laurence Tribe - both of whom are extremely politically active and biased, and attached that opinion to S.R. 511.

So controversial was that legal opinion, that it prompted a rebuttal by Professor Gabriel J. Chin of The University of Arizona, James E. Rogers College of Law, in a discussion paper #08-14 entitled, Why Senator John McCain Cannot Be President. Professor Chin points out clearly where Tribe-Olson sought to draw out implied theories in the law, which in reality, are simply not there and in fact have been decided by the courts already, in opposition to the suggestions offered by Tribe-Olson. Simply put, the attorneys hired by Sen. McCain attempt to fit the law into their agenda with contrived implications. Professor Chin brings the law back into focus, requiring no implied theories.

Legalities aside, in anticipation of the feared “Fairness Doctrine”, the whole of the main stream media has since acquiesced to the intimidation tactics of the Obama campaign and paraded the non-binding resolution known as S.R. 511 to the public with unfactual foolishness. S.R. 511 is neither a constitutional amendment nor legally binding in any way. Yet the media caved to political pressure and reported it to the public as Chairman Leahy dictated, giving the illusion to the pubic that said resolution was binding to the 2008 election. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

The public responded, initially by way of lawsuits contesting the eligiblity of not only John McCain, but Barack Obama and Roger Calero as well, citing them all, with equal disqualifying merit, as being constitutionally ineligible to run for President of the United States. Later, netizens of the internet caught wind of the court actions and responded with their own explosion of blogs, forums, websites, chatrooms, emails, etc. In an attempt to quell the discord, the main stream media offered personalities such as Thomas Goldstein which only served to infuriate the public further. The public saw such maneuvers as deceitful and an attempt to embarrass the now educated public.

However, the greater proof is in the activity which originated in the Senate in early 2008 which was hidden from the public, that sought to change what our representatives knew to be unconstitutional from the start. The public really needs to look no further than this activity, for it speaks to the heart of the deals that went on beyond the Senate doors. Rather than trust the preservation model our founding forefathers wrote into our Constitution, these respresentatives, beholden of the public trust, saw fit to manipulate the clauses contained therein, for the sole benefit of their own political self-interests.

Perhaps our representatives, the United States Supreme Court and the main stream media would be interested in reflecting on these records and then start answering truthfully the questions which have so far been ignored. The public has been promised transparency, but to date has only been dealt scoffing, deceitful rhetoric, if they choose to address it at all.

While the public has been patient and eduring, the questions remain and refuse to be dismissed. We expect them to be answered, preferrably prior to January 20, 2009.

We the people, deserve an answer!


TOPICS: Books/Literature
KEYWORDS: birthcertificate; birthers; certifigate; larrysinclairslover; obama; wronghilltodieon
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To: DaveTesla

But you can write a law and ‘grandfather’ in a group of people under that new law.


81 posted on 08/12/2009 8:07:53 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Believing they cannot be deceived, they cannot be convinced when they are deceived.)
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To: DaveTesla
No, you can't.
Either McCain WAS a Natural Born Citizen, at birth, or he was not.
Either Obama Was a Natural Born Citizen, at birth, or he was not.
Congress can NOT, retroactively, grant “Natural Born Citizenship” -— that is MY point, exactly.
The Constitutional term bars Naturalization or any “retroactive” legislative action.
The law at the time of McCain's birth would support the fact that McCain was a citizen at birth.
My position is that:

Citizen at birth = Natural Born Citizen!

82 posted on 08/12/2009 8:08:06 PM PDT by Kansas58
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To: Kansas58

You are in error. With naturalization, a law can be passed to day that reaches back to a designated time when those in doubt are brought into compliance by the new law even if they were not under the new law before the designated date in the past. It has been done with immigration law even!


83 posted on 08/12/2009 8:10:13 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Believing they cannot be deceived, they cannot be convinced when they are deceived.)
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To: pissant; All

This is lengthy, but includes the pertinent passages from Blackstone, Vattel, and the British Nationality Act of 1948. Otherwise, you have to get it off the ‘Net yourselves ...

In order to understand the concept of “Natural Born” citizenship, it is necessary to understand NOT ONLY WHO is a “Natural Born” citizen, but ALSO WHAT the traits and characteristics of a “Natural Born” citizen are …

FIRST:

We look at the question of the applicability of English Common Law to the United States Constitution, vis-à-vis SCOTUS.

From Wheaton v. Peters (January Term 1834), Minor v. Happersett (March 29, 1875), Smith v. Alabama (January 30, 1886), and United States v. Wong Kim Ark (March 28, 1898):

Although SCOTUS has ruled that there IS NO Common Law in the United States, it has ALSO ruled that Common Law ought to be consulted in cases where original intent necessarily needs to be construed.

SECOND:

We now look at the question of a “Natural Born” subject in English Common Law vis-à-vis Blackstone.

From Commentaries on the Laws of England
Book I, Chapter X: Of the People, Whether Aliens, Denizens, or Natives

“… Natural allegiance is such as is due from all men born within the king’s dominions immediately upon their birth … Natural allegiance … cannot be forfeited, cancelled, or altered, by any change of time, place, or circumstance, … the natural-born subject of one prince cannot by any act of his own … put off or discharge his natural allegiance … and cannot be divested without the concurrent act of that prince to whom it was first due. Indeed the natural-born subject of one prince, to whom he owes allegiance, may be entangled by subjecting himself absolutely to another; but it is his own act that brings him into these straits and difficulties, of owing service to two masters; and it is unreasonable that, by such voluntary act of his own, he should be able at pleasure to unloose those bands, by which he is connected to his natural prince …

… Local allegiance is such as is due from an alien … for so long time as he continues within the king’s dominion and protection: and it ceases, the instant such stranger transfers himself from this kingdom to another. Natural allegiance is therefore perpetual, and local [allegiance] temporary only …

… An alien born may purchase lands, or other estates: but not for his own use; for the king is thereupon entitled to them. If an alien could acquire a permanent property in lands, he must own an allegiance, equally permanent with that property, to the king of England; which would probably be inconsistent with that, which he owes his own natural liege lord …

… And this maxim of the law proceeded upon a general principle, that every man owes natural allegiance where he is born, and cannot owe two such allegiances, or serve two masters, at once …

… The children of aliens, born here in England, are, generally speaking, natural-born subjects, and entitled to all the privileges of such …

… A Denizen is an alien born, but who has obtained ex donatione regis letters patent to make him an English subject … A denizen is in a kind of middle state between an alien, and natural-born subject, and partakes of both of them … And no denizen can be of the privy council, or either house of parliament, or have any office of trust, civil or military, or be capable of any grant from the crown.

… Naturalization cannot be performed but by act of parliament: for by this an alien is put in exactly the same state as if he had been born in the king’s ligeance; except only that he is incapable … of being a member of the privy council, or parliament, etc. …”.

THIRD:

We now look at the question of whether a person may sever ties with his Sovreign (more on this later in the “CONCLUSIONS” section).

From Law Of Nations
Chapter XIX: Of Our Native Country And Several Things That Relate To It

§ 220. Whether a person may quit his country.

“ … 1. The children are bound by natural ties to the society in which they were born; they are under an obligation to show themselves grateful for the protection it has afforded to their fathers … They ought, therefore, to love it, as we have already shown, to express a just gratitude to it, and requite its services as far as possible, by serving it in turn … But every man is born free; and the son of a citizen … may examine whether it be convenient for him to join the society for which he was destined by his birth. If he does not find it advantageous to remain in it, he is at liberty to quit it …”.

FOURTH:

We now look at the question of dual nationality vis-à-vis the British Nationality Act of 1948.

From Part II, Section V:

(1) Subject to the provisions of this section, a person born after the commencement of this Act shall be a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies by descent if his father is a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies at the time of the birth:

CONCLUSIONS:

What does this ALL mean ???

1. The Founding Fathers DID NOT consider English Common Law to be the controlling law in the Colonies. For if they DID, as “Natural Born” English subjects, they NEVER could have severed ties with England without the Sovreign’s consent (per Blackstone).

2. The Founding Fathers seem to have borrowed from Vattell as justification for the severance. This seems to verify that the Founding Fathers DID NOT ENTIRELY rely on English Common Law when founding the United States.

3. Blackstone states that the children of foreigners born on English soil are, GENERALLY SPEAKING, “Natural Born” subjects.

4. HOWEVER, Blackstone ALSO declares that a “Natural Born” subject CANNOT serve two masters.

5. Therefore, per Blackstone, a child of a foreigner appears to be a Denizen rather than a “Natural Born” subject – assuming that the foreign father’s country recognizes the child as one of its citizens (dual nationality).

6. Per Blackstone, a Denizen enjoys MOST of the rights of a “Natural Born” subject – except that he CANNOT hold high office.

7. The British Nationality Act of 1948 recognizes OBAMA as a British subject AND the 14th Amendment of the United States Constitution recognizes him as a United States citizen (dual nationality), IF he was born in Hawaii.

8. As a dual national, OBAMA DOES NOT have fit the definition of “Natural Born” as the Founding Fathers knew it.

QED ...


84 posted on 08/12/2009 8:10:48 PM PDT by Lmo56
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To: pissant


John Armor Bingham (January 21, 1815 – March 19, 1900) was
a Republican congressman from Ohio, America, judge advocate
in the trial of the Abraham Lincoln assassination and a
prosecutor in the impeachment trials of Andrew Johnson. He
is also the principal framer of the Fourteenth Amendment to
the United States Constitution.


85 posted on 08/12/2009 8:13:29 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: Non-Sequitur
There are two statements. The first distinguishes Citizen of the U.S. from natural born citizen.

P. 20.

The right of citizenship never descends in the legal sense, either by the common law or under the common naturalization acts. It is incident to birth in the country, or it is given personally by statute. The child of an alien, if born in the country, is as much a citizen as the natural born child of a citizen, and by operation of the same principle. [p666]

“...as much a citizen as the natural born child of a citizen”

The next statement quotes the 14th Amendment, and refers to Citizens of the U.S.

“all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside,”

This case is about citizenship of someone whose parents were not citizens, but who was born on our soil. Therefore someone whose parents were not citizen, though born on US soil, is not a natural born citizen.

The decision quotes all sorts of other precedence dealing with foreign born children of citizens, one parent citizen, Roman Law, subjects verses citizens. But no one questions the distinction between natural born and citizen of the U.S. Marshall, who is extensively quoted, established the definition as, according to one comment to which I don't necessarily subscribe, the only example of U.S. common law. I believe, and am not alone, that our Supreme Court has established our common law. We are not subjects. Subjects are quite distinct from citizens.

86 posted on 08/12/2009 8:15:09 PM PDT by Spaulding
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To: Lmo56

BUMP


87 posted on 08/12/2009 8:16:56 PM PDT by pissant (THE Conservative party: www.falconparty.com)
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To: MHGinTN
“But you can write a law and ‘grandfather’ in a group of people under that new law.”

Not so.

Only if you can show that the original law or clause was in violation of the constitution.

See: Guinn v. United States

88 posted on 08/12/2009 8:21:53 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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To: pissant

Thanks again, pissant.


89 posted on 08/12/2009 8:22:20 PM PDT by frog in a pot (It's a myth, folks. The frog will jump out and he will be pi$$ed. Ever had big warts?)
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To: shield
I agree he has Dunham's chin. You said he looks like Sr. Why was your post #53 deleted? PhotobucketPhotobucketPhotobucketPhotobucket
90 posted on 08/12/2009 8:25:48 PM PDT by mojitojoe (All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for the people to remain silent.)
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To: RegulatorCountry
Sorry, you are wrong. The law recognized by the U.S. State Department, which I linked to, above, CLEARLY shows that John McCain was a United States Citizen at the MOMENT OF BIRTH! I do understand the argument that some make here, that "Natural Born Citizen" is not the same as "Citizen at Birth" --- I simply do not agree with that argument. I believe that "Natural Born Citizen" means that you were a full United States Citizen at the very moment at birth. Though there is room for reasonable debate on the PRECISE meaning of "Natural Born Citizen" --- there is NO debate, none at all, on the fact that John McCain was a full United States Citizen from the very moment of birth. Again, look at the rules on an application for United States Passport. Are you saying that the United States Department of State does not know the rules for citizenship? Image and video hosting by TinyPic
91 posted on 08/12/2009 8:27:36 PM PDT by Kansas58
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To: mojitojoe
Look at the hands:


92 posted on 08/12/2009 8:28:06 PM PDT by shield (A wise man's heart is at his RIGHT hand;but a fool's heart at his LEFT. Ecc 10:2)
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To: Frantzie
If Frank Davis is his father can he be removed for fraud if it comes out?

Only by impeachment. Don't hold your breath waiting for the 'Rat Congress to do that.

93 posted on 08/12/2009 8:31:17 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: Lmo56
Interesting. There are many paths to allegiance as descended from parents, or from the father, who was, at least formerly, the one who established allegiance.

Whether the legal proof depends upon Blackstone or Marshall, John Jay, de Vattel, a child born of a foreign father has never been in the trusted category described by the term ‘natural born citizen,’ and I doubt that any thoughtful government will ever declare that such a citizen is in that class. The Brits, of course, were a colonial power, and always looking for able bodies. Their society was filled with blood lines and titles.

94 posted on 08/12/2009 8:31:43 PM PDT by Spaulding
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To: mojitojoe

There was a double post cause of the slowness at FR tonight...I hit the abuse button and asked them to delete it.


95 posted on 08/12/2009 8:33:38 PM PDT by shield (A wise man's heart is at his RIGHT hand;but a fool's heart at his LEFT. Ecc 10:2)
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To: mojitojoe

There’s another picture of Sr, I’ve been unable to find and I see some of Jr in the stand and build. I’ll keep looking.


96 posted on 08/12/2009 8:35:27 PM PDT by shield (A wise man's heart is at his RIGHT hand;but a fool's heart at his LEFT. Ecc 10:2)
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To: Wardenclyffe

The quote is in the article that’s the subject of this thread. I didn’t mean to attribute it to you. I apologize for the error.


97 posted on 08/12/2009 8:36:14 PM PDT by Pravious
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To: Spaulding; Non-Sequitur

If you read Wong Kim Ark carefully, you will find that the decision is extremely nuanced:

1. It states that SCOTUS has never defined “natural born citizen”.

2. It states (rather inacurately) that English Common Law states that children born to aliens in Great Britain are natural born subjects. See my post #84 for the rebuttal.

3. The decision (contained in the final paragraph of Ark) bypasses the question of natural born citizenship. Ark’s attorney had argued that he was one, yet the decision only declares that Ark is a “citizen”.

I assume the SCOTUS reasoning was that they only had to determine whether he was a citizen or not in order to decide the case. They did not have to determine if he was natural born ...


98 posted on 08/12/2009 8:36:37 PM PDT by Lmo56
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To: cvq3842
It’s only recent judicial decisions that focus so much on the location of birth.

All judicial decesions have conerned "citizenship", not "natural born citizenship. At least one lower court ruling mentions "natural born", but only because the child in question was born of two *naturalized* citizens in the US. That case was about retention of citizenship, but she was "natural born" by anyone's definition.

That there have been no cases about "natural born" should not be a surprise, the only time it could arise is in a question of eligibility to the office of President. Otherwise, natural born or native born have the same rights. Naturalized have the same rights as well, but have lower limits on how long they have been citizens in order to become Congressmen and/or Senators. (Although in theory any native born citizen, which includes natural born, will automatically meet the limits too, by virtue of the age limitations).

The Wong Kim Ark case was about place of birth, (in the US to two subjects of the Chinese Emperor) under the 14th amendment, but doesn't concern itself, nor mention, "natural born".

99 posted on 08/12/2009 8:43:08 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: pissant
Center column 3rd paragraph down:
http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage

100 posted on 08/12/2009 8:46:10 PM PDT by DaveTesla (You can fool some of the people some of the time......)
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