Posted on 12/17/2008 2:39:23 AM PST by OL Hickory
The most detailed and fascinating explication of Barack Obama's faith came in a 2004 interview he gave Chicago Sun Times columnist Cathleen Falsani when he was running for U.S. Senate in Illinois. The column she wrote about the interview has been quoted and misquoted many times over, but she'd never before published the full transcript in a major publication.
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(Excerpt) Read more at blog.beliefnet.com ...
OBAMA:
Yep. Every week. 11 oclock service.
-snip-
FALSANI:
Who's Jesus to you?
(He laughs nervously)
OBAMA:
Right.
Jesus is an historical figure for me, and he's also a bridge between God and man, in the Christian faith, and one that I think is powerful precisely because he serves as that means of us reaching something higher.
FALSANI:
-snip-
Do you have people in your life that you look to for guidance?
OBAMA:
Well, my pastor [Jeremiah Wright] is certainly someone who I have an enormous amount of respect for.
I have a number of friends who are ministers. Reverend Meeks is a close friend and colleague of mine in the state Senate. Father Michael Pfleger is a dear friend, and somebody I interact with closely.
ping
OBAMA:
I am a Christian.
So, I have a deep faith. So I draw from the Christian faith.
On the other hand, I was born in Hawaii where obviously there are a lot of Eastern influences.
I lived in Indonesia, the largest Muslim country in the world, between the ages of six and 10.
My father was from Kenya, and although he was probably most accurately labeled an agnostic, his father was Muslim.
And I’d say, probably, intellectually I’ve drawn as much from Judaism as any other faith.
Ping for this thread and to make a few comments.
Does anyone with a brain in their head actually believe this sack of garbage is a Christian?
I mean, look at these answers. They are right out of the “Oprah, many paths lead to God, baloney”.
I am so disgusted by this man on so many levels, I can’t even begin to count them.
I would hate for young people to read this tripe and believe he is speaking as a true Christian.
I pray for God to not let this man sway the masses away from Him.
I question his very honor when he makes an oath on the bible, especially if he requests it to be edited.
This would be like Lincoln taking the oath but with his fingers crossed.
I'd give this the Clinton treatment and parse it carefully:
First part: "Jesus is an historical figure for me". So, that's his own personal feeling about Jesus. He's a guy who lived 2000 years ago, Nothing more than that.
Second part: "he's also a bridge between God and man, in the Christian faith". So, as an mere bit of trivia about the Christian faith (a faith which Obama has heard about), Jesus is supposed to be some sort of bridge. Apparently -- so Obama has heard -- this is an important function within the Christian faith.
Third part: "one that I think is powerful precisely because he serves as that means of us reaching something higher." Here, Obama points out that the quaint notion of Jesus has been influential to a lot of people, because people aspire to something higher. Mind you, Obama can also serve this powerful function himself.
No way is this guy a Christian. He doesn't feel it. He's way too careful in his approach to this topic.
As with Clinton, he's always seemed like one of those "I'm not religious, I'm spiritual" types who are so popular among the Oprah crowd.
This is bull - embarassingly so.
I lived on Oahu as a child - at the same time as Mr. Obama. Being raised in a devote Christian household, going to church every Sunday and Holy Day, observing Christian traditions and customs at home, with a crucifix and a font of Holy Water (adorned with palm fronds, after Palm Sunday) affixed to the foyer wall, attending lots of optional church functions, Sunday morning parish breakfasts, etc. THAT molds a child.
Being driven down the street and seeing an occasional Shinto shrine or Buddhist temple (but not really understanding or caring what they were - typical for a child) would have absolutely no impact upon a young child's Weltanschauung. So Mr. Obama is obviously really "reaching" to ascribe some sort of Eastern mojo to his years in Hawaii - instead of to his years attending a Muslim school in a foreign country (Indonesia,) where that attribtution of influence rightfully belongs.
Regards,
Exactly !
[...] he's also a bridge between God and man, in the Christian faith [...]
So he's obviously simply stating what Jesus is considered to be in the Christian faith. In other words, he's qualifying Jesus' role, and simultaneously distancing himself, like if I said "Lenin was a great leader, in Soviet thinking" or "Joseph Smith was an important prophet, according to Mormon doctrine."
The use of the indefinite article "a" in "a bridge" rather than the definite article "the" as in "the [only] bridge" is a further weakening of Jesus' significance. He was, after all, merely "a" bridge (among many possible bridges?)
Regards,
She forgot to ask him if he believed he had a soul.
She asked him a lot of questions & in someways hinted at that but never asked him directly.I think that is a important sort of question.
FALSANI:
Do you believe in sin?
OBAMA:
Yes.
FALSANI:
What is sin?
OBAMA:
Being out of alignment with my values.
________________________________________
just damn !
Obama: “So, I’m rooted in the Christian tradition. I believe that there are many paths to the same place...”
Jesus (John 14:6): “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.”
Unless by “the same place” Obama is referring to Hell, his “roots in the Christian tradition” are NOT compatible with Christianity.
I wonder whether his problematic assertions on Christianity are the result of genuine misunderstanding or a concerted effort to deceive. Only God knows the correct answer here but I have strong suspicions about Obama’s faith.
I think you have to cut Obama some slack here. These things may not have had much impact upon you, but it is possible that Obama was curious about them. My own experience was as a Jewish child. During the Christmas season I was exposed to all sorts of things Christian (including real Christmas Carols in my elementary school music classes). I was curious about these things and asked my mother about them.
ML/NJ
This man is no more a Christian than my dog is a Christian. He worships himself.
This is a profoundly scary interview. He really does see himself as a savior, as a Messiah.
“OBAMA:
Yeah, although I don’t, I retain from my childhood and my experiences growing up a suspicion of dogma. And I’m not somebody who is always comfortable with language that implies I’ve got a monopoly on the truth, or that my faith is automatically transferable to others.
I’m a big believer in tolerance. I think that religion at it’s best comes with a big dose of doubt.”
Yeah, pretty strong faith there, Bambi. Comes with a big dose of doubt? What does that even mean? Isn’t the whole point of having faith being SURE?
“FALSANI:
Do you pray often?
OBAMA:
Uh, yeah, I guess I do.
Its’ not formal, me getting on my knees. I think I have an ongoing conversation with God. I think throughout the day, I’m constantly asking myself questions about what I’m doing, why am I doing it.
One of the interesting things about being in public life is there are constantly these pressures being placed on you from different sides. To be effective, you have to be able to listen to a variety of points of view, synthesize viewpoints. You also have to know when to be just a strong advocate, and push back against certain people or views that you think aren’t right or don’t serve your constituents.
And so, the biggest challenge, I think, is always maintaining your moral compass. Those are the conversations I’m having internally. I’m measuring my actions against that inner voice that for me at least is audible, is active, it tells me where I think I’m on track and where I think I’m off track.
It’s interesting particularly now after this election, comes with it a lot of celebrity. And I always think of politics as having two sides. There’s a vanity aspect to politics, and then there’s a substantive part of politics. Now you need some sizzle with the steak to be effective, but I think it’s easy to get swept up in the vanity side of it, the desire to be liked and recognized and important. It’s important for me throughout the day to measure and to take stock and to say, now, am I doing this because I think it’s advantageous to me politically, or because I think it’s the right thing to do? Am I doing this to get my name in the papers or am I doing this because it’s necessary to accomplish my motives.”
He really does have a Messianic complex. I mean, what is he talking about when he says that he is having an ongoing conversation with God but at the same time he is asking HIMSELF what he is doing and why is he doing it? Shouldn’t he have said, “I am constantly asking and praying for guidance and wisdom from the Lord to guide my life and fulfill His will in everything I am doing.”? His comments on political motives are very enlightening in looking at who he is and his thought process as well. I think he gave up a lot more there than he meant to. It appears that he truly does weigh each and every move in a political way and then determine how he should act or what he should say.
“FALSANI:
Checking for altruism?
OBAMA:
Yeah. I mean, something like it.
Looking for, ... It’s interesting, the most powerful political moments for me come when I feel like my actions are aligned with a certain truth. I can feel it. When I’m talking to a group and I’m saying something truthful, I can feel a power that comes out of those statements that is different than when I’m just being glib or clever.
FALSANI:
What’s that power? Is it the holy spirit? God?
OBAMA:
Well, I think it’s the power of the recognition of God, or the recognition of a larger truth that is being shared between me and an audience.
That’s something you learn watching ministers, quite a bit. What they call the Holy Spirit. They want the Holy Spirit to come down before they’re preaching, right? Not to try to intellectualize it but what I see is there are moments that happen within a sermon where the minister gets out of his ego and is speaking from a deeper source. And it’s powerful.
There are also times when you can see the ego getting in the way. Where the minister is performing and clearly straining for applause or an Amen. And those are distinct moments. I think those former moments are sacred.”
A POWER that comes out of his statements? What ministers CALL the Holy Spirit?
“FALSANI:
Do you try to take some time for whatever, meditation prayer reading?
OBAMA:
I’ll be honest with you, I used to all the time, in a fairly disciplined way. But during the course of this campaign, I don’t. And I probably need to and would like to, but that’s where that internal monologue, or dialogue I think supplants my opportunity to read and reflect in a structured way these days.
It’s much more sort of as I’m going through the day trying to take stock and take a moment here and a moment there to take stock, why am I here, how does this connect with a larger sense of purpose.”
So instead of taking ANY time to read the Bible or pray, he continues on with this “internal MONOLOGUE,” gibbering on about his sense of purpose? What - is he praying to HIMSELF? Is he asking HIMSELF for guidance?
“OBAMA:
Where do you move forward with that?
This is something that I’m sure I’d have serious debates with my fellow Christians about. I think that the difficult thing about any religion, including Christianity, is that at some level there is a call to evangelize and prostelytize. There’s the belief, certainly in some quarters, that people haven’t embraced Jesus Christ as their personal savior that they’re going to hell.
FALSANI:
You don’t believe that?
OBAMA:
I find it hard to believe that my God would consign four-fifths of the world to hell.”
Well, I’ve got news for you Obama, Jesus said, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you know me, you will know my Father also.” (John 14:6-7)
He goes on to say after asked if he believes in heaven, “Do I believe in harps and clouds and wings?” His answer is this: “OBAMA:
What I believe in is that if I live my life as well as I can, that I will be rewarded. I don’t presume to have knowledge of what happens after I die. But I feel very strongly that whether the reward is in the here and now or in the hereafter, the aligning myself to my faith and my values is a good thing.”
OK, it boils down to these points:
-He does not necessarily believe in heaven or hell
-He does not pray or read the Bible
-He cannot go into any kind of detail about the day he says he accepted Christ (which is something most people remember and will never forget)
-He calls sin “being out of alignment with” HIS values and if we have sin in our lives: “I think it’s the same thing as the question about heaven. In the same way that if I’m true to myself and my faith that that is its own reward, when I’m not true to it, it’s its own punishment.” Must have never heard the verse, “The wages of sin is death.” (Rom 6:23).
-He says that nothing is more powerful than the black church experience and that the Civil Rights movement is a place in time where heaven and earth meet.
Again, NOT a Christian. Not in ANY sense of the word, not in any way shape or fashion. How does someone say that sin is being out of alignment with their own values?
He has a SERIOUS God complex. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_complex
And in 35 days, he is going to be the President of the United States.
Does anyone real believe that he has read the Bible? His answers to the questions regarding heaven/hell and sins leads me to believe that he has never read about them in the Bible.
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