WPP Executive Resigns Over Remarks on Women [Or: Another media jerk's DEATH BY BLOG]

JULIE BOSMAN

[summer]

A well-known ... worldwide creative director at WPP Group resigned his position ...over remarks he made at an industry event about female creative executives. The comments, by Neil French, 61, drew attention to the absence of women at the highest levels of the creative side of advertising....

Mr. French told an audience... women "don't make it to the top because they don't deserve to"...

His comments infuriated... Nancy Vonk... of Ogilvy Toronto, [wrote] a column for a Web site denouncing his comments.

...Ms. Vonk said[:}..."It's undeniable that women aren't getting far enough in the creative part of agencies,..."
.. When Mr. French was asked ...why there weren't more high-ranking women in creative agency positions, he said it was because they were not good enough.

... In 1998, [French] was named to the position of worldwide creative director at WPP... the world's second-largest ad agency ...

...Mr. French defended his remarks:... "[Women] don't work hard enough..."b>

Mr. French said he believed that the event was private...
...Though statistics are hard to come by, industry executives said the scarcity of women in top creative positions is generally recognized. Creative directors are responsible for devising advertising campaigns.

The One Club... will induct a woman into its Hall of Fame next week for the first time since 1974....

...such imbalances in agencies were typically starkest in the creative department.

"Senior female creatives are virtually nonexistent," she said. "It's an incontrovertible fact,..." ...Mr. French's comments [are] "Neanderthal-like," [and]...an industrywide attitude."...

"There's still rampant sexism in our business," ....

Mr. French said he did not regret his remarks...Mr. French [was] widely pilloried on the Internet. "Death by blog is not really the way to go."

[summer]

posty = post -- and you can figure out my other typos. I get too angry thinking about this subject of ignoring talented women. But I am still glad this particular JERK RESIGNED and suffered a DEATH BY BLOG. VERY GLAD.

[summer]

RE my post #80 -- That movie review is in today's NYT:

HERE.

If it doesn't open, here's the URL:

http://movies2.nytimes.com/2005/10/21/movies/21nort.html

[trisham]

Now, tell me this: Who's gonna teach girls to have that mindset? Teachers? Courtney Love druggie types? Mommies who never had a job? Here's who can and does teach girls that mindset: Fathers. Unfortunately, we lose our dads too soon in this country.

****************

We do? Who is "we"?

How many "mommies" do you know who don't work outside the home? I don't see too many of them around these days. However, why someone who cared enough to stay home to raise her children would be assumed to be unable to act as a suitable role model to them is baffling to me.

Let's see. You don't like white males, stay at home moms, or corporate America. Anything else?

[summer]

RE your post #83 - Insult away, if it makes you happy. Believe me, I have suffered MUCH worse than your off base, untrue comments.

[summer]

And, no doubt the real woman whose life story is the subject of "North Country" suffered much worse than you can imagine, as well. Believe it or not, hard work, good work, qualifications, kindness, goodness, etc. can still all add up to a big nothing in this country, no matter who is in power, because there is so much corruption, greed, power plays, you name it, just as there has always been, throughout history, in every era.

[Ruth C]

That may be true. But, unless another blog which thinks this is just more pc bs, wants to run with it and get the figures and expose it for what it is, the guy is just out of luck for stating the facts.

[trisham]

RE your post #83 - Insult away, if it makes you happy. Believe me, I have suffered MUCH worse than your off base, untrue comments.

*************

I'm not surprised.

[trisham]

And, no doubt the real woman whose life story is the subject of "North Country" suffered much worse than you can imagine, as well. Believe it or not, hard work, good work, qualifications, kindness, goodness, etc. can still all add up to a big nothing in this country, no matter who is in power, because there is so much corruption, greed, power plays, you name it, just as there has always been, throughout history, in every era.

***************

Yes, it's a shame we live in such a terrible country.

Good grief.

[Do not dub me shapka broham]

Again, I don't see the need for the tumult.

Perhaps my ignorance in this field leads me to a more blase attitude, but I don't see how the news that ad agencies aren't staffed by people of matchless intellect and superb qualifications-and that most of these professional mediocrities happen to be men who are interested in promoting other hapless individuals who are also men-is an earth-shattering revelation.

This is akin to saying that the carting industry is dominated by the Mob, or that construction firms rely on a system of nepotism that denies minorities a fair shot on contract bidding.

My reaction is precisely the same.

Yes, and this is news how exactly?

[summer]

No, our country is good. The principles of our founding fathers were good then, and good today. And, my previous public support on this forum dureing an election was still support well placed, in my view, even now.

But, individuals can be bad. And, this is still a shock to me, even now. Yes, Nazi Germany happened. Yes, teachers union leaders can be corrupt, and at times, amazingly to Dem voters, unions have roughed up people pretty badly, as there is actually such a thing as union violence. And, yes, even the UN can have a scandal and harm the poorest of people. Sometimes, all this, and more, is depressing.

But, Neil French's DEATH BY BLOG was a GOOD THING, in my view. And, who knows, maybe his resignation OPENS a door, and paves the way for a talented woman to FINALLY break through...

[summer]

Re your post #89 - see my post #61.

[summer]

dureing = during

[summer]

PS And if you still think it's OK that America hurts from all this, and you still don't understand that's why we have federal laws against gender discrimination -- well, then, never mind...

[DGray]

No one demanded that the guy quit. Did you not read the woman's commentary?

[Do not dub me shapka broham]

Perhaps you're right, but I just don't see these decisions exerting that much of an impact upon the broader economy.

Granted, advertising comprises a significant chunk of the U.S. economy, but I don't think it makes much of a difference whether or not these firms are filled with underwhelming male scriveners or their marginally more competent female counterparts.

Based upon the anecdotes in the memoir "Dry" I came to the conclusion that there wasn't much disparity in talent between the men and women who worked for these sorts of ad agencies.

The fact that someone who is an alcoholic-and spends most of the week in a semi-catatonic stupor-can manage to retain his job as an ad writer at what was presumably a moderately prestigious ad agency doesn't exactly lead me to believe this field is the equivalent of microbiology.

[DGray]

It's not a "conspiracy" as in a bunch of guys smoking stogies and playing poker and discussing how to keep da broads in their place. It's just how it is. There's a difference.

I spent ten years in the creative field, and I eventually quit because for me, it was too much to deal with. I'm not the type to want to be a top executive in any field, and certainly not one that involves that level of stress. So, while I have no personal complaints about my own treatment in the industry, I did see males get promoted over females time and again, and in situations where the females were working longer and harder hours and coming up with the better ideas. It's a good-old-boy industry from the lowest levels on up. A woman trying to claw her way to the top will generally have to work three times as hard as a man, and be three times as ruthless to boot. I know, I've been there, I've seen it in action. I'm sorry if saying this makes me a hysterical female in your eyes, but do note that I am not advocating government intervention or anything like that. These things do have a way of working themselves out in time - which is why I applaud the action of this one woman who stood up and spoke out.

[ClearCase_guy]

A woman trying to claw her way to the top will generally have to work three times as hard as a man, and be three times as ruthless to boot.

I didn't just fall off the turnip truck. I've been working in industries dominated by women (libraries, public education) and industries dominated by men (newspapers, engineering). I've been around.

IMO, women are their own worst enemies. As I have said before, and it may seem trite, but "The Apprentice" is a very good show. Not all jobs follow this pattern, but mine does, and I rather suspect advertising does:

Bring a group together, find a vision of where you need to go, motivate the team, coordinate the efforts, achieve some final results, present the results to the customer.

They do that once a week on the Apprentice. I do it constantly. On the show, and in my work experience, the most harmful person in the group is (generally) the person who is most obviously trying to "claw her way to the top", the person is who flagrantly "three times as ruthless" as anyone else on the team, the person who is completely self-absorbed and absolutely convinced that they work "three times as hard" as anyone else, in short, the one person who is totally disruptive to the team effort, is a woman 90% of the time.

As I said in post #12, my first post on this thread, I have worked with outstanding women -- women who got to the top, and deserved to get to the top. But I have seem many, many women who were their own worst enemeies. And those women usually shout the loudest about how they are treated unfairly when they don't rise to the top.

[guitfiddlist]

>>It's possible in this case that the man was telling the truth, but the PC outrage in the blogs makes it impossible to tell the truth and survive.<<

Their "Do what I say - not what I do" hypocrisy was exposed. F'em - regardless of whether or not it is true.

[DGray]

If you haven't worked in the creative field, you flat-out don't know what you're talking about. Really. It's a whole different culture, with a whole different set of expectations. In other fields, I would agree with you 100% about some women being their own worst enemies. In creative, life's different.

in short, the one person who is totally disruptive to the team effort, is a woman 90% of the time.

Sheesh. You're that guy who promotes the hungover fratboy every time over the woman who comes in early, stays late and actually gets the work done. That's because the hungover fratboy doesn't give a sh!t about outcomes, and therefore never rocks the boat.

[summer]

The fact that someone who is an alcoholic-and spends most of the week in a semi-catatonic stupor-can manage to retain his job as an ad writer at what was presumably a moderately prestigious ad agency doesn't exactly lead me to believe this field is the equivalent of microbiology.

You are making some very astute and wise observations. Nevertheless, it IS a very, VERY HIGH-PAYING field. And, one that does -- or shall I say CAN -- exert an important influence on business, and, for that matter, on America's image abroad. The fact that MORE talented people -- qualified beyond belief -- are not in the field, is a shame. It is a shame for all of us. Because we are not where we could be.

In addition, it is a field NOT known for "training" or "mentoring." And, in my view, it is like teaching in that respect. Whenever you have professions like this -- where there is no established mentor system in place -- other forces take over. For this reason and many other reasons, I was overjoyed when a friend of mine recently told me her son was now an appretice plumber and electrician. That kid will actually learn something, and have the time to become highly skilled at what he does in his field, and -- perhaps someday have his own business. Good for him. VERY good for him.