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Russians Outlaw Criticism of Govt on Internet
neekas backlog ^ | 1/27/05 | neeka

Posted on 01/28/2005 6:45:05 AM PST by blackminorcapullets

I heard about it from Mishah first, and then it was on yesterday's NTV evening news: a Russian-language web portal called the Russian National Literary Network has issued a "Directive on Limiting the Themes of Literary Works."

The Directive mainly concerns two of the Network's writing sites, Proza.ru (prose) and Stihi.ru (poetry). At a glance, the sites resemble a cross between Zoetrope.com and LiveJournal.com, inviting aspiring authors to post their work for review by other members. As of 9 pm today, Proza.ru has 22,313 members, 188,457 stories and 277,077 reviews; Stihi.ru lists 67,115 members, 1,609,066 poems and 2,132,558 reviews.

Even though today Dmitriy Kravchuk, the Network's coordinator and the author of the Directive, has postponed the implementation of the Directive "due to the negative reaction of the literary community and the discovery of a number of shortcomings," its text still appears online.

Here's its translation:

The Directive on limiting the themes of literary works published on the Internet resources of the Russian National Literary Network

1. On the Internet resources of the RNLN it is forbidden to publish literary works and forum messages covering the following themes:

- The special operation of the Russian troops in the Chechen Republic during 1991-2004 [actually, the so-called "special operation" officially began on Dec. 11, 1994, not in 1991...]

- Terrorist acts against citizens of the Russian Federation

- Opposition of certain citizen groups to implementation of the Laws of the RF and the Decrees of the President of the RF (in particular, the Law on Monetization of the Benefits [which has caused the Babushka Revolution]

2. On the Internet resources of of the RNLN it is forbidden to publish literary works and forum messages, which include personal mentions (with the first or last name) of individuals belonging to one of the categories of the Class A public officials (in accordance with Appendix 1). At the same time, it is allowed to mention the individual's title, as long as this mention is connected with the execution of state functions and not with his personal qualities [sic].

3. On the Internet resources of of the RNLN it is forbidden to publish literary works and forum messages, which include mentions in a negative context of the Class B public officials (in accordance with Appendix 2). A negative context is the identification of the mentioned individual as a negative literary hero by literary experts affiliated with the RNLN.

4. On the Internet resources of of the RNLN it is forbidden to publish literary works and forum messages, which include mentions in a positive context of the Class C individuals (in accordance with Appendix 3). A positive context is the identification of the mentioned individual as a positive literary hero by literary experts affiliated with the RNLN.

Literary works with content prohibited by this Directive will have to be deleted by their authors before Feb. 1, 2005. If the works containing the prohibited content are discovered after Feb. 1, 2005, the site's moderators are obliged to block the pages and all works of these authors without the possibilty of renewing [membership] later.

Organizational Committee of the Russian National Literary Network

Appendix 1. Categories of the Class A public officials.

It is forbidden to publish literary works, which include personal mentions (first or last name) of individuals belonging to the following categories:

- President of the RF and members of his family - Head of the government and ministers of the RF - Members of the Federation Councils [sic] of the Federal Assembly of the RF - Deputies of the State Duma of the RF who are members of the United Russia faction [the pro-Putin majority in the Russian Parliament] - Governors of the federal centers of the RF - Mayors of the cities of the RF

Appendix 2. Categories of the Class B public officials.

It is forbidden to publish literary works and forum messages, which include mentions in a negative context of individuals belonging to the following categories:

- Heroes of Russia - Heroes of the Soviet Union, who received this title during the Great Patriotic War - Serving officers of the Russian Army, Ministry of Internal Affairs, Federal Security Service, Federal Guards Service, Intelligence Service in the rank higher than the Colonel and First-Rank Captain (inclusive) - Representatives of the RF state on duty - Members of the United Russia Party and the Walking Together public movement [a pro-Putin youth organization]

Appendix 2. Categories of the Class C individuals.

It is forbidden to publish literary works and forum messages, which include mentions in a positive context of individuals belonging to the following categories:

- Individuals wanted by the federal authorities on charges of plotting terrorist acts against RF citizens - Individuals killed as the result of special operations of the Russian troops in the Chechen Republic, those who resisted or were accused of plotting terrorist acts against citizens of the RF - Individuals charged with involvement in international terrorist organizations - State authorities and soldiers of the Fascist Germany of the Great Patriotic War period, as well as individuals who collaborated with the Fascist Germany

After wasting an hour translating this, I'm more or less speechless. The only thing I can say is that this once again confirms my view that Stalin was ourselves, in a way, and Putin is ourselves, too.

***

And here's a translation of a wonderful poem one of the members of Stihi.ru has recently posted on the site:

PRESIDENT by Thinkerbell

PutinPutinPutinPoo! PutinPutinPutinPoo! Poopoopoo! Poopoopoo! PutinPutinPutinPoo!

© Copyright: Thinkerbell, 2005 Code: 1501261784


TOPICS: Politics
KEYWORDS: censor; internet; russia
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To: Lion in Winter; GarySpFc
Orthodoxy was introduced in America by Russians in Alaska and California and the Orthodox Church in America was part of the Russian Orthodox Church. After the communist revolution in Russia, the Church outside of Russia broke off with the Church at home and established the so-called Russian Orthodox Church Outside of Russia (ROCOR). The two are now in the process of reconciliation. The American branch did not break with ROC. Eventually, Moscow granted Americans independence which became OCA but this independence is not recognized by most of the Orthodox Churches in the world. In fact only Russia and I believe Bulgaria do.

Patriarch is not installed by the size of the Church but by its maturity. The problem with ROC, as Gar says, is that they do some things Orthodoxy doesn't -- and Orthodoxy is a very traditionalist Church, about as traditionalist as it gets.

Trying to "fit in" with the rest, many Greek Orthodox have adopted what can be termed "Protestant" or "Anglican" outwardly look -- clean-shaven priests and pews in the churches (uniformed choir, even electric organs!). All this was done so as to become more "American" and to be accepted.

The Greeks are now pulling back to traditional ways, and I understand some OCA. The OCA has a lot of Protestant converts who brought with them some of the Protestant mindset and who are not keenly in tune with the fact that Orthodoxy is a way of life and that worship is not something that is subject to radical change. Consequently, this mindset is what is preventing the communion of Orthodox Churches from recognizing OCA as a true and fully developed Church, but rather one is the stage of development and growth.

Typically, this takes time -- for all Churches. At which time they elect a Patriarch and become autocephalous (self-headed) rather than just being independent. So, the OCA is now headed by an Archbishop. It's pretty uch akin to a state that is a principality (i.e. Monaco) rather than a kindgom.

141 posted on 01/31/2005 1:52:24 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: koba37

It is also important to note that the CDA is not about child pornography, obscenity, or using the Internet to stalk children. These are already illegal under current law. Instead, the CDA prohibits posting "indecent" "or "patently offensive" materials in a public forum on the Internet -- including web pages, newsgroups, chat rooms, or online discussion lists. This would include the texts of classic fiction such as the "Catcher in the Rye" and "Ulysees", the "7 dirty words", and other materials which, although offensive to some, enjoy the full protection of the First Amendment if published in a newspaper, magazine, or a book, or in the public square. "

You dare to compare restrictions on obscenity and porn access for kids to censureship of criticism of the govt?

HAHAHAHAHHAHA


142 posted on 01/31/2005 1:55:26 PM PST by blackminorcapullets
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To: kosta50

"BTW Yushchenko is not Ukrainian Orthodox -- he belongs to that self-styled "church" by that name. There is a genuine Ukrainian Orthodox Church"

It is clear you mean the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of Kiev which sucks up to the church in Mockba - the Orthodox church that is fully immersed in Soviet style politics and the Orthodox church that had the nerve to preach whom to vote for in the last Uke election.

The Autocephalous Ukrainian Orthodox Church is the one you despise - and its the one that Stalin tried to crush, too.

You are showing your stripes. Get off our website.


143 posted on 01/31/2005 2:01:21 PM PST by blackminorcapullets
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To: Lion in Winter

"I just read on a web site for a Church called the Orthodox Church in America "

You must be joking - for all you two know about Russia, you do not know that the Orthodox Church of America was formed as an alternate to the Russian Orthodox Church which was taken over by the KGB and the Communists?


144 posted on 01/31/2005 2:04:32 PM PST by blackminorcapullets
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To: kosta50

"I NEVER read one WORD from the new Ukrainian President about how ashamed he was that some of his Roman Catholic countrymen supported the nazis by being guards at many nazi concentration camps. One has to wonder why? "

Do you read books or do you eat them?

Yushchenko's father is an Aushwitz survivor unlike million of other Ukes that perished there.


145 posted on 01/31/2005 2:06:20 PM PST by blackminorcapullets
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To: blackminorcapullets
Have you checked the hilarious responses from your fellow veteran buddis about the M14?

To be honest I think you are asking this question to divert from your lack of service. I suspect most of us believe the nearest you ever came to a military base was when you drove by one with your cub scout uniform on.

Another reason the men questioned likely did not respond to you is because they never trained on the M-14, which was replaced by the M-16 in 1964. However, I used it for a short time. To answer your STUPID question the M-14 did NOT have an open sight.
146 posted on 01/31/2005 2:11:16 PM PST by GarySpFc (Sneakypete, De Oppresso Liber)
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To: GarySpFc; jb6; Admin Moderator
My son was in Viet Nam and used the infamous M16... oh, gosh he hated that thing. Jammed on a few times and his buddy Jack had to save his hide once. THANK GOD! He said to me... "Dad I would give 10 grand for that old M1".

As I was telling another Freeper my best friend was West Point class of 1939. We met while I was in the Army together in the early 1950's... and we became close friends for life. He passed away a few years ago. He knew Patton from his youth since his own Army officer Father was an old friend of George Patton.

Anyway, he was a gun collector of some re-known when he retired in the late 1960s due to health concerns. He had a couple of M1 s in various states of repair and said they really were HIS favorite weapon... he and I BOTH agree they were RELIABLE and thanked God Almighty they were so.

My friend often quoted General Patton and we used to laugh because he didn't say... GREATEST DAMNED BATTLE IMPLEMENT EVER DEVISED.... when descring the M1. And, yes.. according to my friend George Patton could and would cuss a blue strak at the drop of a hat... even when he wasn't a General. But he was a gentleman and a scholar.... really was a Renaissance man and Warrior.

147 posted on 01/31/2005 4:48:12 PM PST by Lion in Winter (grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr... LION IS HERE... I DESPISE BIGOTS AND TROUBLE MAKERS!!)
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To: Lion in Winter; All

Your antagonist is gone


148 posted on 01/31/2005 4:55:13 PM PST by Admin Moderator
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To: Admin Moderator; All

Thank you. I Salute you, Sir or Madame .


149 posted on 01/31/2005 5:02:39 PM PST by Lion in Winter (grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr... LION IS HERE... I DESPISE BIGOTS AND TROUBLE MAKERS!!)
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To: blackminorcapullets

No dinkle, I answered your question. I'm not old enough to use the M14. Try the M16. Problem is, you don't read so well.


150 posted on 01/31/2005 8:04:18 PM PST by jb6 (Truth = Christ)
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To: kosta50

Well, there were also a lot of Greeks in New Orleans who founded the church there.


151 posted on 01/31/2005 8:05:32 PM PST by jb6 (Truth = Christ)
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To: jb6
Well, there were also a lot of Greeks in New Orleans who founded the church there

Of course, but they catered mostly to Greeks. Russians converted Alaskan natives and appealed to a broader base of home-grown Americans. Also, because of the same liturgical (Slavonic) language, it was easy to incorporate other lavic Orthodox. If I had to choose between Slavonic and Greek, I would choose Slavonic because that's the languge I understand. And Greek is a linguistic monad.

152 posted on 02/02/2005 1:42:35 AM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: Lion in Winter
YOU... on the other hand... ACT LIKE A PERSON WHO JUST IS NOT NICE. You are rabid hater. People like you WORK VERY HARD TO cause distrust among nations.

Great Scott ! Does that mean you'll refrain from doing it,too ?
153 posted on 02/02/2005 3:34:57 PM PST by Atlantic Friend
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To: TapTheSource

Putin = KGB = Communist

Ultra nationalists = KGB = Communist

Communists = Communist

...as for the oligarches, please supply the names of the Oligarches you have in mind and I bet every one of them comes from the KGB and/or the Communist elite (which = Communist)."

Putin= low level KGB Lt. Col. assigned to a fellow communist country and not in the capital city. Hired by the true reformer Anatoly Sobchak, picked by Yeltsin because of this. He's a patriot, not a nationalist, and definitely not a communist. He's been more successful at hammering the last nail in the communist party coffin than anyone else over there (and way better at than you. Seriously, you remind me of the Stalinists I have to interview).

Ultranationalist = Neonazis, hatemongerers, repressed by the FSB

Communists = dead and dying generation

Oligarchs= Abramovich (not KGB), Potanin (not KGB), Bryantsalov (not KGB), Khodorkovsky (not KGB), Gusinsky (not KGB), Berezovsky (Jay Epstein's puppet master, NOT KGB), Lebedev (not KGB), Pichugin (not KGB). Now, please prove how these guys came from the communist elite.

You know ZERO about Russia. Zippo, nothing, and with each and every post you prove you are nothing but a xenophobic fearmongering bozo. You really want the Cold War back, maybe you want to see it turn hot - but I think you and I both know you'd be the first one hiding under your bed.


154 posted on 02/02/2005 4:09:49 PM PST by koba37
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To: kosta50

Yukoshenko's wife is actually a former American citizen and worked in Reagan's Administration. This was actually a campaign liability. (Although, I thought it was a plus!)


155 posted on 02/02/2005 4:13:35 PM PST by koba37
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To: koba37; dennisw; Cachelot; Yehuda; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Optimist; weikel; ...
Koba37 wrote:

"Oligarchs= Abramovich (not KGB), Potanin (not KGB), Bryantsalov (not KGB), Khodorkovsky (not KGB), Gusinsky (not KGB), Berezovsky (Jay Epstein's puppet master, NOT KGB), Lebedev (not KGB), Pichugin (not KGB). Now, please prove how these guys came from the communist elite....You know ZERO about Russia. Zippo, nothing, and with each and every post you prove you are nothing but a xenophobic fearmongering bozo."

I see you have resorted to the same ad hominym as the other Putin/KGB apologists. It's interesting and perhaps very telling that KGB defector Anatoliy Golitsyn forewarned conservatives that when the phony "collapse" of Communism finally arrived, conservatives, moderates and (genuine) liberals who dared challenge this notion would be "...attacked as reactionaries, bureaucrats with outworn ideas, political or religious Cold War warriors, spoilers or just fascists...The attack will aim to neutralize them by ridicule and to turn them into an endangered species."

As I stated before...

Putin: KGB and former director of the FSB

Anatoly Sobchak (who you brought up): Served in the People's Congress of Deputies between 1989 and 1991 under dedicated Marxist-Leninist, Mikhail Gorbachev.

Vladimir Zironovsky ("ultra nationalist"): KGB

But the real Communist elite, beyond the obvious names like Putin and Primakov, consists of names like Igor Mintusov, Aleksandr Kazakov, Vyacheslav Nikonov, Georgii Satarov, Aleksandr Abramov, Aleksei Koshmarov, Aleksei Sitnikov, Dmitrii Levchik…Just to name a few. These are the people who run the “political campaigns” of those running for office. These high-level Communist operatives do not advertise their activities. If you are an “elected” official, you do what these people tell you or you’re gone and/or dead.

As for the oligarchs, it is irresponsible for you to interject the them into the debate, as I never included them in the “Communist elite” (some of them may indeed be members of the Communist elite, but I don’t know enough about them to tell the difference). As I have said many times before, the oligarchs will be put in gulags or liquidated once the KGB strategists decide revive War Communism. The Communists are using them to interact with the Western capitalists. These people are expendables who were chosen to interact with the Western business elite and are viewed as tainted/corrupted by same contact. Notice how many Jews they groom to become oligarchs. When the time comes, these people will be rounded up and brought before show trials and jailed, sent to gulags and/or liquidated. And practically no one will care in Europe because they “fit the stereotype” presented at their future trials.

If you really wish to understand Soviet long-range strategy and “The Final Phase”, I suggest you read two books by KGB defector Anatoliy Golitsyn. (“New Lies For Old”, 1984 and “The Perestroika Deception”, 1995). Hopefully, the following excerpts will prompt you to purchase and read these books carefully:

‘PERESTROIKA’, THE FINAL PHASE: ITS MAIN OBJECTIVES
(Taken from Anatoliy Golitsyn’s “The Perestroika Deception,” Edward Harle: London, 1995, pp. 17-19)

‘The new method sees ‘perestroika’, not as a surprising and spontaneous change, but as the logical result of thirty years of preparation and as the next and final phase of the strategy: it sees it in a broader context than Soviet ‘openness’ has revealed.’

‘It sees it, not only as a renewal of Soviet society, but as a global strategic design for ‘restructuring’ the entire capitalist world.’

‘The following strategic objectives of ‘perestroika’ may be distinguished:

For the USSR

(a) ‘Restructuring’ and revitalization of the Soviet socialist economy through the incorporation of some elements of the market economy.

(b) ‘Restructuring’ of the Stalinist regime into a form of ‘Communist democracy’ with an appearance of political pluralism [= ‘democratism’, or false democracy].

(c) ‘Reconsructing’ a repressive regime with a brutal face into an attractive socialist model with a human façade and seeming similarity to the Swedish social democratic system.’

For Eastern Europe

‘Economic and political ‘restructuring’ of the existing regimes into pseudo-social democratic models while preserving specific national historical features such as the strong Catholic Socialist tradition in Poland and the pre-war democratic tradition in Czechoslovakia.’

For Western Europe

(a) ‘Bringing about a new political alliance between the pseudo-social democratic regimes in the USSR and Eastern Europe and the Euro-Communist parties and genuine social democratic parties in Western Europe.

(b) ‘Restructuring’ political and military blocs—NATO and the Warsaw Pact—and the creation of a singe ‘Europe from the Atlantic to the Urals’ incorporating a reunited, neutral Germany.’

For the main US alliances

(a) ‘Splitting the United States, Western Europe and Japan.

(b) Dissolution of NATO and the US-Japan security pact, and the withdrawal of US troops from Western Europe and Japan.’

For Third World countries

‘The introduction and promotion of a new Soviet model with a mixed economy and a human face in Latin America, Africa and Asia through a joint campaign by the pseudo-social democratic regimes of the USSR and Eastern Europe and the genuine social democrats of Western Europe led by the Socialist International.’

For the United States

(a) ‘To neutralize the influence of the anti-Communist political right in the American political parties and to create favourable conditions for a victory of the radical left in the 1992 US presidential elections (In this context, Clinton’s stay with top Communists in Czechoslovakia and the Soviet Union during the latter part of the Vietnam war has profound and disturbing implications—TTS).

(b) To ‘restructure’ the American military, political, economic and social status quo to accommodate greater convergence between the Soviet and American systems and the eventual creation of a single World Government.’

The paramount global objective

‘The paramount global objective of the strategy of ‘perestroika’ is to weaken and neutralize anti-Communist ideology and the influence of anti-Communists in political life in the United States, Western Europe and elsewhere—presenting them as anachronistic survivors of the Cold War, reactionaries and obstacles to ‘restructuring’ and peace. Anyone who warns about Moscow’s true objectives is automatically branded a ‘Cold Warrior’, even by people who have doubts about Moscow’s motives.’

THE ESSENCE OF ‘PERESTROIKA’: AN APPLICATION OF 1920s’ LENINISM

‘The new method penetrates the façade, tears the verbal mask off ‘perestroika’ and reveals its true meaning—which Gorbachev and ‘glasnost’ have failed to do. Lenin’s teaching and the experience of the New Economic Policy [NEP] are keys to understanding the essence of ‘persestroika’ and the reasons for Gorbachev’s downgrading and renunciation of elements of ideological orthodoxy like the class struggle and his emphasis on common interests and the benefits of close cooperation.’

‘Lenin advised the Communists that they must be prepared to ‘resort to all sorts of stratagems, manoeuvres, illegal methods, evasions and subterfuge’ to achieve their objectives. This advice was given on the eve of his reintroduction of limited capitalism in Russia in his work ‘Left Wing Communism, an Infantile Disorder’.

‘The new method sees ‘perestroika’ as an application of Lenin’s advice in new conditions. Another speech of Lenin’s in the NEP period at the Comintern Congress in July 1921 is again highly relevant to understanding ‘perestroika’. ‘Our only strategy at present’, wrote Lenin, ‘is to become stronger and, therefore, wiser, more reasonable, more opportunistic. The more opportunistic, the sooner will you again assemble the masses around you. When we have won over the masses by our reasonable approach, we shall then apply offensive tactics in the strictest sense of the word.’

THE WORLDWIDE COMMUNIST FEDERATION (should they succeed…taken from Anatoliy Golitsyn’s book “New Lies For Old,” Dodd-Mead, 1984, pp. 346-347)

‘Integration of the Communist Bloc would follow the lines envisaged by Lenin when the Third Communist International was founded. That is to say, the Soviet Union and China would not absorb one another or other Communist states. All the countries of the European and Asiatic Communist zones, together with new Communist states in Europe and the Third World, would join a supranational economic and political Communist federation (this is precisely what the Soviets have in mind for the impending EU collective—TTS). Soviet-Albanian, Soviet-Yugoslav, and Soviet-Romanian disputes and ‘differences’ would be resolved in the wake, or possibly in advance of, Sino-Soviet reconciliation (Golitsyn goes to great lengths in previous chapters to show how the split between the Soviets and the Chinese was completely healed immediately after Stalin’s death…however, they continued the illusion of a split to dupe the West into backing alternating sides, depending on circumstances—TTS). The political, economic, military, diplomatic, and ideological cooperation between all the Communist states, at present partially concealed, would become clearly visible. There might even be public acknowledgment that the splits and disputes were long-term disinformation operations that had successfully deceived the “imperialist” powers. The effect on Western morale can be imagined’ (the Soviets have employed this tactic on numerous occasions—TTS).

‘In the new worldwide Communist federation the present different brands of Communism would disappear, to be replaced by a uniform, rigorous brand of Leninism. The process would be painful. Concessions made in the name of economic and political reform would be withdrawn. Religious and intellectual dissent would be suppressed. Nationalism and all other forms of genuine oppositions would be crushed. Those who had taken advantage of détente to establish friendly Western contacts would be rebuked or persecuted like those Soviet officers who worked with the Allies during the Second World War. In new Communist states—for example, in France, Italy, and the Third World—the “alienated classes” would be reeducated. Show trials of “imperialist agents” would be staged. Action would be taken against nationalist and social democratic leaders, party activists, former civil servants, officers, and priests. The last vestiges of private enterprise and ownership would be obliterated. Nationalization of industry, finance, and agriculture would be completed. In fact, all the totalitarian features familiar from the early stages of the Soviet revolution and the postwar Stalinist years in Eastern Europe might be expected to reappear, especially in those countries newly won for Communism. Unchallenged and unchallengeable, a true Communist monolith would dominate the world.’

156 posted on 02/02/2005 6:53:15 PM PST by TapTheSource
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To: koba37
I stand corrected. I was under the impression that she was born Canadian. It is my understanding that she kept her American citizenship into the election. One would certainly be suspicious of a major American presidential candidate whose spouse was not only a Russian citizen, but a former employee of the Soviet Foreign Ministry. Maybe you can explain how could that be a "plus" and why was it a "plus" in the recent Ukrainian elections?
157 posted on 02/02/2005 7:25:10 PM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: koba37

Koba37, what exactly did you say were doing in Russia/Soviet Union??? I seem to recall you mentioning that you worked in a government capacity and that you write articles. Pray tell, inquiring minds want to know--TTS


158 posted on 02/02/2005 7:26:28 PM PST by TapTheSource
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To: Atlantic Friend

Do you miss your pal? Good.


159 posted on 02/02/2005 7:57:38 PM PST by Lion in Winter (grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr... LION IS HERE... I DESPISE BIGOTS AND TROUBLE MAKERS!!)
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To: koba37; TapTheSource
koba37 wrote in reply to TapTheSource:
"...with each and every post you prove you are nothing but a xenophobic fearmongering bozo. You really want the Cold War back, maybe you want to see it turn hot - but I think you and I both know you'd be the first one hiding under your bed."

Thank you for that excellent example of sentiment behind your arguments, koba37. It is an honor to learn more about the tactical genius that stands against us. And we "cold warriors" haven't had so much laughter since our younger days of viewing training films of Russian infantry training.
160 posted on 02/02/2005 8:49:24 PM PST by familyop ("Let us try" sounds better, don't you think? "Essayons" is so...Latin.)
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