Posted on 09/19/2004 8:38:35 PM PDT by grace522
The UCMJ applies to reservists only while undergoing reserve training: UCMJ Applicability 802.2(a)(3) "Members of a reserve component while on inactive-duty training."
I've been down the road researching many of the issues raised in this thread (and in Post #1).
There are a ton of innacuracies here which could easily have been vetted with a few hours of research.
No problem. I really screwed up when I looked at that pdf file. I don't know why I was thinking it was one document with two pages, but obviously I hadn't read the detail very carefully before last night. You error is nothing in comparison. :) I don't know how I managed to post that because the intention was no to. Sheesh!
His website has changed since people have looked at the details posted and the media has also produced some glaring differences.
Agree, there have been some changes once the facts were out, which contradicted his assertions. That said, we still have access to the source documents thru Kerry's site and Findlaw.
> The UCMJ applies to reservists only while
> undergoing reserve training:
What's your take on the Holzer's article?
John Kerry, Criminal
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=15127
I'm still not seeing the basic "2001" premise in this thread.
Agreed. See my #139.
There at least 5 factual errors in Post #1, all easily verifiable by examining the Kerry docs on Findlaw. And when I say "at least" I mean that there several more that I noticed but simply didn't have time to debunk.
This thread is completely out of control. The Kerry docs are all out there, all folks need to do is to read them.
sKerry has been talking about his Vietnam service 4 times longer than he actually was in Vietnam.
It's a little late in the day. Maybe under Nixon but don't count on Ashcroft to do such a thing.
I believe it was hillary on some talk show....I don't think she was refering to the President...
When pigs fly...
No. I was referring to one DD214 that was issued when he went to Officer Training. Ignore that post, where ever it is, because it is wrong. It was not supposed to be posted.
BTW, Kerry has been talking about his Vietnam service ever since he was in Vietnam! I sure would like to be one of the people in those deates asking the questions! :)
You can absolutely get an Other Than Honorable discharge as a result of Non-Judicial Punishment given by a Commanding Officer. You have the right to demand a courts martial in lieu of NJP but could face much more serious consequences as a result of the courts martial process. If I was involved in seditious activity, I would take the OTH and be on my way.
> It's a little late in the day. Maybe under Nixon
> but don't count on Ashcroft to do such a thing.
Agreed. How about the jury coming in on 02 Nov?
If there were prosecutable offenses then (and perhaps yet),
the electorate needs to know.
A lot of voters are too young to be aware of Kerry's
post-war treachery. If, in addition to demoralizing the
troops, encouraging the enemy, and getting millions
killed in Asia, it was also solidly illegal, I see no
problem in adding that charge to the pile.
Yep. And not only that, the (socialist) media's double standard of not even challenging Kerry's (unreleased) military records says volumes.
We need to wait and see on this one. It is the old saying, "Where there is a lot of smoke, there could be a fire".
By the way, when Carter pardoned all the draft dodgers and deserters, the ones who were living in Canada were promised civil service jobs if they would come home. These were mundane positions simular to what we had at the old CCC camps, but they were jobs. This took place during the Carter resession. However at the same time he changed the rules for veterans preference in getting a civil service postion. If you had more than two years of college you could not use your veterans' preference for entry in civil service. However if you fled to Canada and came back, you were given a job. I went through this after I got off active duty and was unemployed for about eight months.
If you don't believe this happened, bet me some money and we will check it out. I am still pissed off about the way Vietnam veterans got treated.
If he has an Honorable Discharge wouldn't he post it on his website along with his other released records? If he does have an HD, and it's not posted, then perhaps this story is true? By not posting he must be hiding something, like the date of his Discharge???...rto
btw, I was on active duty from 1960 - 1965 and was kept on (inactive) standby reserve until 1972, at which time, with no action of my part, I received my Honorable Discharge.
There is only one way to find out. A signed form 180. He will not do that. Why???
I don't SEE a date on the document, of the document.
(of when the document was typed)
If you see such, please respond with the
block number.
...
What bothers me is that the lower part contains
mention of the Silver Star 'V' device, which I don't see
on the two (of the three that exist) Silver Star citations on Kerry's website.
In order to lessen the furor over the cBS forgeries...
WATCH FOR the liberal scum to generate some type of
anti-Kerry MEMOS (that can be quickly discredited) and they
will seed the intenet with those, hoping we bite.
Kerry was a commissioned officer and therefore eligible for 3 types of discharges.
Honorable
General under conditions other than honorable.
Dishonorable.
Enlisted personnel are eligible for 5 types:
Honorable
General under honorable conditions
General under conditions other than honorable.
Bad Conduct Discharge
Dishonorable.
Since Kerry was eligible for the three above - let's take a look at what it take. Kerry would have received 3 dishcharges. One from the USNR to accept a commission. One when when he went off active duty and the final one from the reserves.
The vast majority of officers and enlisted men receive honorable discharges. You almost have to try and get something lower. The "Other than Honorable Discharge" for an officer has to be predicated on the action of a board of officers and something akin to an investigation. The Dishonorable can only come as a result of a General Court Martial. We would have definitely heard of that one and Kerry could have never run for public office.
This leaves the possibility of the "Other than Honorable". I have serious doubts this could have happened. The Navy would have had to convene a special board and Kerry would have had the right to appear. Given Kerry's notoriety at the time, I doubt this would not appeared in the print or broadcast media at the time.
I really think pursuing the status of M. Kerry's discharge is basically a dry hole. This is from someone who thinks he is basically the scum of the earth.
What I do think an SF 180 would reveal is that the After Action reports that predicated his Bronze & Silver stars were indeed "puffed" as well as the Purple Heart citations.
The swifties do an excellent analysis of John Kerry's Fitreps. These are the fitreps he has authorized for release. Most people that would be familiar with Officer evaluations and promotion boards could reasonably conclude that Lt. j.g. Kerry would never reach 04 on active duty and possibly not 03. Kerry's combat fitreps are the most damaging to his prospects of having a long Navy career. The fitreps also show there is probably a lot more info out there.
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