Which two witnesses did you have in mind, for example, that would swear to have personal knowledge of the authenticity of Lucas Smith's document? Who in the US can swear under oath to the authenticity of an image of a 1961 Kenyan document?
Smith can only attest to how he obtained it, not whether it is authentic. I don't believe that any such witnesses can be found in the US. They would have to be smuggled out of Kenya in fear for their lives, I suspect.
Under the FRE, only Kenyan officials can authenticate a certified Kenya BC to be placed in evidence in federal court. I don't believe that partisans on either side would accept any such authentication or rejection from Kenyan officials given the corruption in Kenya.
In fact, Federal Judge Carter in CA said that even if Kenyan official did certify Lucas Smith's CPGH BC, he would likely rule in favor of a certified HI COLB, if submitted into evidence.
Only if Obama's original vital records are released and they show an amendment or evidence of a Kenya birth would any certification by Kenyan authorities overcome the "self-authentication" of Obama's HI COLB (assuming it is real).
This could well explain why Obama and the Obots are fighting so hard to discourage and mock birthers stonewall release of Obama's original HI vital records.
Look at how fast Charlie Rangel and Gov. Patterson were taken down once they lost their standing in the "court of public opinion" and became useless to the power elites. The same thing could happen to Obama overnight, and he knows it, I suspect.
If the GOP takes the House in November, they will have subpoena power to investigate Obama's original HI vital records.
i want the person that gave him the doc. from the hospital, and the person who notarized it and smith to testify— if these they will testify in open court that this is a true doc. then thats all that will matter— obama will have to prove otherwise— and he cant
“court of public opinion”
AND John Edwards was taken down by WHOM? (wink)
It would be most interesting to see if the weight and length were the same.
I found this statement by you:
The Factcheck COLB has also not been authenticated under the FRE, nor have the “best evidence” HI vital records underlying the representations of HI officials, nor has the claim by HI officials that Obama is NBC.
Both Judge Carter and Judge Land with their FRCP Rule 12(b)(6) dismissals for “failure to state a claim” denied standing to the plaintiffs thus precluding the discovery process in which all BC related documents can be authenticated to the extent possible, and witnesses, like Fukino, Obuko, the HI AB and Smith, can be deposed.
Judge Carter said that even if the Smith BC was fully authenticated by Kenya officials, Carter would be unlikely to give greater weight to a Kenya BC over an equally authenticated HI BC.
Judge Carter assumed, without having the HI vital records released, that discovery of those records would not raise questions and issues that might lead to greater weight being given to the Kenyan BC.
For example, the HI vital records may have been amended from showing a Kenya birth location to showing an HI birth location. Subsequent to such an amendment, “properly” filed, HI officials would be legally required to attest to an HI birth for Obama and precluded from making reference to the pre-amendment Kenya birth, such as is shown on the Blaine BC, for example.
Judge Robertson in the Hollister case also granted an FRCP 12(b)(6) dismissal by stating that Obama’s birth location had been Factchecked, blogged and twittered, none of which meets FRE requirements. Robertson, like Carter, precluded any discovery involving actual authentication of HI vital records in the context of HI Territorial Law 57 and statements of HI officials regarding amendments or Obama’s NBC status.
Theoretically (but not realistically), both Carter and Robertson might be overturned for failure to give adequate weight to the possibility that with discovery under the FRE, plaintiffs could prove-up their documents.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2427610/posts
In reference to your statement:
In fact, Federal Judge Carter in CA said that even if Kenyan official did certify Lucas Smith’s CPGH BC, he would likely rule in favor of a certified HI COLB, if submitted into evidence.
As you can see, it makes it much clearer, don’t you agree.
Also interesting is a previous statement(Not by you, I believe) but, I will add it here. It is Judge Carters assessment of Lucas Smiths past, as it relates to evidentiary evidence:
Carter was fully aware that Smith had also placed before the court the Kenya BC. Carter did not consider Smith’s well-publicized background and claims about the BC to have impeached him as a witness.
Yep I would love to hear Smiths story in this regard once again.
They will never do it. Their spines will turn to jelly because they will be afraid of looking foolish for allowing Obama to occupy the WH and destroy the economy of this country. I have lost faith in the GOP doing anything to stand up for what is right regarding a President, or ex-President. Look how they held the Clintons accountable for trashing the WH and stealing the furniture!
Sorry. I'm in a bad mood this AM. :(
Whatever Hawaii birth certificate Obama comes up with, if it doesn’t explain what we’ve already experienced with the Hawaii government it better not be accepted as the real deal. The crimes that have been committed cannot go away even if Obama is able to age a document so it passes as authentic.
This is why I really believe that the criminal justice system needs to be brought into this.
And I think you’re right about the “court of public opinion” - which is why the dems are willing to try to go for broke by using this as a wedge issue between conservatives. They can’t win the case on its merits. If we had a factual conversation in the public sphere about this Obama would lose big-time. So they’re trying to make it into a big political game.
Law enforcement should never be subject to political games. We saw it with the Duke lacrosse case. We saw it with Scooter Libby. We’ve seen it with William Jefferson. Heck, we saw it with Bill Clinton and his “Magnificent Seven” DC Circuit Court judges who bypassed the random assignment of cases to get the Clinton buddies’ cases for themselves.
I think we REALLY need to push hard on the law enforcement aspect of this because whether it is considered “conspiracy” or not, we have ample proof that law enforcement at every level has refused to investigate valid concerns and evidence brought forth by the public. And only a moron would say it’s “extreme” to expect law enforcement to put politics aside.
If it was not so sad for the future of our country, this is the most fascinating and intriguing subject, a Constitutional crisis, this usurper and DNC have put our nation trough in less than two years. It is been in a fight on many fronts now!
Chrysler (Donofrio) is in the mix. Dr. James Manning is suing Columbus University. People are bombarding Hawaii to open the chest (vault). Congressmen are asking questions and State laws requirements are being proposed!!
Previous several cases where standing has been used to by-pass the Constitution is something I can’t remember we ever seen. However, somehow if enough mud is being sling on the wall, some finally will stick and make all the paid “AFTER-BIRTHERS” looking pale instead of their original bloody dead looks in the pan!!!
Here is a new Joe Luis a “Black Bomber” fighting in Harlem, N.Y.:
http://atlah.org/atlahworldwide/?p=6494