Posted on 11/15/2008 6:48:02 PM PST by palmer
It's apparent that a combination of fervent believers and a small number of psychopaths and/or infiltrators have dominated the birth certificate discussion. The early evidence was in their favor and everyone should have been skeptical of the low res images on Kos, smears and politifact. The new evidence is not and is not being addressed objectively.
But photo #5 (and some of the others) is a genuine photograph of an artifact. It was not created in photoshop. That doesn't mean photoshop was not involved. A plausible set of steps is
1. Scan a real COLB including the border
2. Import into photoshop and change the text to Obama's text
3. Print the result onto the cross hatched paper (could be forged separately)
4. Obtain a embossing seal and apply it to the printout 5. Fold it as if it came from an envelope and display it to the factcheck photographer.
Another plausible scenario is someone in the Hawaii office did all the forging but on the official equipment and using the official seal. Another possibility is someone stole a seal and sold it to a forger. It is certainly possible for a forger to make a seal using the right equipment (probably a laser etcher).
The Kenya trip meme seemed to turn into an established fact in early July when proposed by null and void and properly ridiculed. Even into November null and void can only repeat her hypothesis (a honeymoon) apparently unwilling or unable to embellish it further.
Polarik surrounds himself with a number of true believers and useful idiots. The useful idiots are the ones who validate or praise his analysis while obviously not knowing anything about it. The true believers have convinced themselves that Obama was not born in Honolulu and are unable to evaluate the evidence objectively.
In their favor, the true believers have established that Obama has potential Indonesian citizenship (courtesy of Soetoro) as well as potential Kenyan citizenship (courtesy of Obama Sr). These are true regardless of where Obama was born. For the former the Kenyan citizenship would have to be activated by Obama. For the latter, Soetoro would have had to apply to make Obama an Indonesian citizen, it does not happen automatically via adoption.
The bottom line for Polarik is he has yet to address the certificate linked above. He has promised to do this for weeks now and is instead disseminating and repeating his various diatribes against Obama. My guess based on his past behavior is that he will release a rehash of the evidence against the old scan (Kos, smears, politifact) with a bit of new verbiage against the factcheck photos. He will properly point out some oddities in some of the photos while ignoring the obvious salient features in the decent photos such as number 5.
He and I have already argued about the seal (embossing) in number 5 and he claims it is a perfect circle (therefore forged). I showed that it wasn't http://i433.photobucket.com/albums/qq51/palmer2/circle.jpg and he replied with a very similar result except he used some edge detection first. He obviously just fools with some tools, but doesn't obtain any useful results. When it comes to image analysis he is a dabbler, not an expert.
With cover from his defenders he establishes a "sensitive" personality claiming that he is being ruthlessly attacked. He says that as a result he will stop posting on the certificate issue when he is done with his final writeup. I don't know if that's a real sensitivity or faked, but even if it is faked there are thousands more that will step into his shoes if he disappears.
That thread and others contain useful nuggets about other Obama problems. There are alternative threads that speak to real evidence although some of those get beaten down by the Polarik army. Polarik's followers also use Freepmail to spread gossip about posters like myself and allegedly (according to them) posted about me on another forum.
That is all good. The more publicity I get on this particular issue, the better. But I remain concerned that FreeRepublic will have the appearance of a conspiracy site because only a rather intensive conspiracy could produce the evidence photographed by Factcheck.
I am also concerned that Factcheck and others might be deliberately planting poor quality evidence in an attempt to hook in the Polariks of the world and their followers. That would not necessarily require a conspiracy although I admit it has the flavor of one. It is to the liberal opposition's benefit to keep as many people on false trails as possible not just to waste their time but to portray them as unhinged. That result was detrimental in the last election and will be detrimental in 2010 and 2012.
IMO of course.
If I were applying for any job in this area, I would be required to provide identification derived from my birth certificate, SSN (gotta see the card!), or other proof I am here legally, and depending on the job, college transcripts. It is likely that I would undergo some sort of background check as well, and have to provide references.
I'm only steering a horizontal oil well while we are drilling it.
For someone in the Oval Office, one of the job requirements is that they be a natural born US Citizen. WE are the employers, and we are entitled to see the proof. Period.
I do not view calling for the bona fides of the leader of the free world and Commander in Chief of the world's most powerful military force excessive, but would think the president-elect would have provided this data long ago willingly as part of proving he is in fact qualified for the job.
That does not appear to be the case. Furthermore, evasiveness appears to be the order of the day, rather than compliance. While the election is over, there is no way I would hire anyone under those circumstances, nor reasonably expect to get the job were I to act that way.
Keep in mind that a fortune in attorney's fees could have been saved by the mere expedient of producing the records mentioned above at a nominal cost. Instead, the new hire is evading the issue.
Free Republic does not need salvaging, but maybe the candidate vetting process at the DNC does.
My point is that there are many inconsistencies in the “documents” that people are using as evidence and that anything can be faked quite well today. Until several impartial parties verify the original I’ll remain skeptical.
Sheesh,,,I have already typed out for you the relevant section of Debbie’s page. Is this one of the those mind games operatives play.
If you can’t figure out that link is what the retired agent is referencing as proof there was no Feb 1 1980 form...then I am not going to bother.
Hawaii stepped up to plate and sealed his Birth Certificate and stated he was born in Hawaii close to the election, it was on the news. The officials in Hawaii defended the birth certificate from Hawaii, and this issue is dead. The governor of Hawaii is Republican and friend of Sarah Palin, so if this was truly issue of being born somewhere else...she would have stood up and defended it. They need to give this issue up, it’s a non starter.
“The intensity seems to be more imagined than real.”
Is that code for “Palmer loves Obama?”
I don't, but I have some certainty on how it was created (the seal was not photoshopped).
Also, why would someone running for President post their "proof" on Factcheck?
Don't know. Any MSM would be as suspect. If he brought the paper out for a news conference, that would be a much better check on the artifact itself, although would not clear any questions over how it was created. To me, the photo at factcheck is as good as watching a bunch of reporters feel and stare at (a possibly forged) COLB.
They never stated he was born in Hawaii, just that they had a b.c. for him and it would be sealed and not available. How does that put this issue to rest?
I suggested that is possible. It is a fact that he adopted him and changed his name. What evidence do we have about the citizenship?
Do you need SS registration to sit for the Illinois State Bar?
If so, the Feb. 1990 date correlates with O needing a possibly forged SS form to sit for the Bar Exam.
“At worst I am an attention-seeker.”
You just gave yourself away.
Sincerity never suggests it might be frivolity in disguise.
(yaaaaaawn)...;0)
No it means palmer is being objective. Barry (or whatever his name is) is not intensely fighting this.
Then why is BO sending a slew of attorneys to all the court cases to fight having to show his birth certificate?
Obama just has to cough up the birth certificate, the real one and we will all GO AWAY.
The CIA and espionage people are very good at forging things like birth certificates, btw, so time is not on our side with these cases.
“if this was truly issue of being born somewhere else...she would have stood up and defended it.”
There are so many ways this could be wrong, you need to just dump this premise.
hmmm, good question. However, Debbie is indicating that:
“standard Bates-stamped DLN, in this case “0897080632” ...would indicate a 2008 creation. “
I am not familiar with govt coding but the retired federal agent who went after this information VIA the FOIA would be familiar with it.
The filing date is the critical piece of missing information.
Again, that "nasty" thing called the Constitution. Ex post facto laws are explicitly prohibited!
“Barry (or whatever his name is) is not intensely fighting this.”
How could you possibly know that?
Thanks for the information (about the registration date). The problem with any forum is that good lines of research can get buried in noise. If there was an analysis that focused on forging that date (onto photos of the rest of the COLB) that would be productive. A lot more productive than asserting that the seal in the photo that I linked was photoshopped.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
