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Elizabeth Smart Thread, 9/26/02 to ???
Posted on 09/26/2002 12:34:48 AM PDT by stlnative
NEW THREAD - PING WHOM EVER YOU LIKE - I DON'T PING ANYMORE - SORRY
TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: elizabethsmart
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To: Jolly Green
if the "jeep" went "1,000" miles, why would it be brought back for repairs?
601
posted on
09/30/2002 2:30:40 AM PDT
by
jandji
To: scaredkat
Glad to read your views on this, Scaredkat.
I have another question to add to your list:
The article says one of the things missing after the 2001 sneak thefts at the Smarts' was a $1000 bracelet of Lois'.
The article also says police determined that Ricci pawned this bracelet.
Pawn shops are required to keep detailed records.
Why, the minute police determined Ricci pawned that bracelet, which was clearly stolen goods, was Ricci not charged with Receiving Stolen Property? When exactly was it found out by police that Ricci pawned that bracelet?
For Receiving Stolen Property, they'd have had to prove that he held control over goods which he knew, or which he should have known, were stolen. Seems a pawn shop video and/or its receipts showing the driver's license #, etc., of the person pawning, would provide proof that Ricci had control over the bracelet. As for whether he knew/should have known it had been stolen, that would probably follow--you can bet he pawned it for much less than its value. That tends to show he didn't "pay" much to get the bracelet. (IMO, he paid nothing for it of course, he got it on a "5-finger discount.")
When did they find out he pawned it, and why was he not charged right after they found out?
To: Jolly Green
actually, dinse still stands by his statement that nieghbors were in the home before police arrived.
603
posted on
09/30/2002 2:43:13 AM PDT
by
jandji
To: Jolly Green
About the "gunman's" taking Elizabeth hostage, and maybe dropping her off nearby at a convenience store, etc., and Freedox's wondering about that--
Good thought, re: maybe the intruder just wanted to get her away from the people she'd have raised an alarm to, so he could get out of the area b/f she got word to her parents that he'd been in the house.
Also, I think some of the neighbors were thinking "runaway." I think they might have thought this regardless of what the Smarts told/didn't tell them. Chances are they didn't even talk directly to the Smarts, just got word Elizabeth was missing, and just, frankly, started looking at convenience stores etc., b/c "the light's better there." (As in the old joke, "you lost it over here in the dark, why look over there under the lamp"--answer: "because the light's better.")
To: Palladin
look at the court documents concerning ricci. ricci was referred to adams before april, 2001, by ed smart.
605
posted on
09/30/2002 2:59:26 AM PDT
by
jandji
To: jo6pac; sandude
What if he did pay them in cash? Does it necessarily follow that he kept no books?
The part about their not having good ID's rings true according to my experience. Guys that do that sort of work often don't have good enough ID's to cash checks. Plus if you pay them after banking hours (at the end of their work day) they can't stand to wait till the next day and have to go to the bank and stand in line and cash the check. They need money NOW. These guys need everything NOW. Example: They need a beer NOW--and they're chronically short of cash, and they're getting off work and want to relax.
Haven't you ever been near a convenience store on a Friday afternoon and seen sub-contractor-looking guys with trucks full of more guys being taken home, with equipment in the back? They're all in line getting 12-packs of beer. They crack a beer as soon as they get in the truck, and pass the stuff around. Or is your neigborhood too ritzy for that sort of people to be in it?
MY PAINTER INSISTED ON CASH WHEN I WOULD GIVE HIM SMALL ADVANCES. He did this, I found out, b/c his driver's license was expired and he had a warrant open, so he was afraid to go renew his driver's license for fear of being picked up on the (misdemeanor) warrant. Expired ID=bank won't cash checks for you.
WHEN I'D GIVE HIM CASH, I ALWAYS MADE HIM SIGN A RECEIPT. I have a written record of every cent I paid him, even the cash part. This is called "keeping records."
Ed was clearly doing the bit of fixing up a house while living in it (to avoid capital gains questions when it was sold), and he'd want to keep records of his expenses so he could figure out after he sold the house, what his real money from the sale was. If he makes income(speaking of it as the tax collectors would) on the sale of the house, he's going to want to reduce it on paper at least, as much as possible, by deducting out what he put into the house.
To: Jolly Green
Nice try, but that doesn't prove he kept no books. You're darn right it doesn't!! There are ways to keep records whether you pay someone in cash or not. IT IS NOT AGAINST THE LAW TO PAY SOMEONE IN CASH FOR THEIR WORK.
To: jo6pac
Of course he kept books...so did the Enron management team. It's easy to stand in judgment of someone else, isn't it?
To: Devil_Anse
right, ed being an experienced renovator, a mortage banker, real estate person. hire and pay legitament professionals, always better for tax write-offs, and always legally certified.
609
posted on
09/30/2002 3:10:39 AM PDT
by
jandji
To: Palladin
It's so amusing...etc. Having a little trouble keeping your hatred in check, are you, Pal?
And what was that I saw about a "Mo?" I thought derogatory epithets for groups/races/etc. were not within the rules of Freerepublic.
To: Yellowcat
Your scenario sounds plausible and reasonable. Thank you, that sort of thing is sorely needed here.
To: home educate
Nowhere in the article does it mention Ed took possession of the jeep and drove it back to his home. Excellent point. Also, nowhere in the article does it say whether or not Ed had someone with him. I would assume he did take someone. I know I would, if I were going to be dealing with scum like Rick Ricci.
To: home educate
Here's the answer to the above question (your own words): And, yes, I know LE said they didn't find computer links to the alleged kidnapping. Ten points, Home Educate!!
How many people here, I wonder, could even halfway stand up to the scrutiny they are all too willing to give to the family of this missing girl?
To: freedox
ed as a business man making his living renovating houses would be very much responsible for keeping books.
614
posted on
09/30/2002 3:23:30 AM PDT
by
jandji
To: freedox
This says that Ed went to Ricci's apartment to repossess...the jeep...nothing is said about him negotiating with Ricci to fulfill his part of the 30 hr./week bargain. I'd say taking back the jeep, or threatening to take it back, was part of "negotiating." In order to negotiate with someone, you have to let them know you have some power.
So maybe Ed took back the jeep that day, maybe he didn't after hearing Rick's (no doubt lame) excuse for never showing back up to work. I think it's a sure bet Ed took someone with him that day, so why are we agonizing over this?
To: home educate
Amen, of course Ed knew or could easily find out Ricci's address. It was probably filled in by Ricci when they drew up their "contract."
Some people are just not in touch with reality.
To: jandji
Jandji, no action lies for defamation of a dead person.
http://austlii.edu.au/media/MLWS%20Commentary/Defamation%20commenary%20-%20Kayser,%20P/134.htm
And remember, anyone who has the filing fee can sue someone, but winning is another matter.
To: freedox
Ms. Adams stated that this officer gave her and her husband permission to enter the house......do you think they used the "one bark for yes/two barks for no" method of communication? I appreciate your efforts at deflection, Jolly, but this one is beyond the pale. I'm almost afraid to ask this, but......just what enormous impact does this have on the case? You might want to make at least a lame attempt at answering the premise i.e. why was the officer in the car?
To: jandji
I know the article consisted mostly of a scenario, based on interviews with persons who had investigated the case.
In other words, they made an educated guess.
They are "educated" on this case more than we are.
The man was not a criminal genius, although his ability to get out of the Adams house even after waking someone up certainly shows that he had "talent."
If he had been addicted to heroin, to me that means he had a lifelong problem that he had to deal with. I think at times a person who is addicted to a substance might feel desperate if he craved the substance, and didn't have any available.
To: jandji
Re: the "kidnapper's note" in the Ramsey case.
I agree with you about the note. And you can guess who I thought wrote it.
I think she died from the fractured skull. I just don't know about the garotte; it looked to me like it was made of a shoelace, and it didn't look tight. But it's been a long time since I saw that photo.
Someone pointed out to me that John Ramsey was a Navy man. Then he'd know all sorts of knots. I believe he would have tried to help out his wife, too, if she'd done something awful.
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