Rep. Massie with the crew of the USS Liberty

X ^ | June 10 | Gen, Flynn

[RandFan]

@GenFlynn

This was no mistake.

The crew of the USS Liberty.

@RepThomasMassie thank you for keeping this story alive.

[fruser1]

How so? Or is this just a “get off my lawn” moment for you?

[Rockingham]

(1) For good reasons or bad, the governments of Israel and the US are lying about the attack on the Liberty.

(2) Some who know the SIGINT world far better than I do have made detailed allegations. Admiral Thomas H. Moorer served as Chief of Naval Operations and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff in that era. He publicly alleged that the attack by Israel was a deliberate act.

Moorer believed Israel attacked the ship to prevent the interception of communications regarding their planned seizure of the Golan Heights from Syria. Moorer accused President Lyndon Johnson and Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara of orchestrating a cover-up, including the recall of rescue aircraft, to maintain strategic ties with Israel.

[Danie_2023]

The facts absolutely don’t matter to these cretins. All they care about is spreading their hatred and BS against Israel and propagandizing. AHs like Massie have an agenda and it just illustrates how despicable they truly are. Funny how you won’t see Massie standing with any survivors of 9/11 and keeping “that” story alive. Much like resident trolls here at FR, Massie only cares about anti-Israel “”stories””.

“If the facts of the case don’t matter, why are these people obsessed with a friendly-fire incident that happened in 1967? Because they want to convince you—despite all evidence and lack of motive—to hate Israel and Jews. There is absolutely nothing else going on here, and the proof for that is how enthusiastically they lie about what actually happened that day.

They need to say Israel attacked deliberately, because that’s how they fool Americans into distrusting and hating Israel. And they need to say the US covered it up, because that’s how they explain the lack of evidence for their claims.”

https://x.com/davereaboi/status/2064041251549372495?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E2064041251549372495%7Ctwgr%5E2e9dc55eccf15959dd868d78fd0d456c1d4c106b%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.powerlineblog.com%2Farchives%2F2026%2F06%2Fmassies-parting-shot.php

[ChessExpert]

Hold the presses. What was the level of Saudi involvement in the 9/11 attacks? Or was it pay back by Saddam Hussein?

[old school]

Who are you?

What Israel did, in that instance, was an act of war against the United States of America.

And, while they may have been an “ally,” they certainly were not a friend of the United States.

You can’t rationalize that away!

[Grey182]

It’s not anti-semitism. It’s the attitude toward Israel that stinks, people treat Israel like they are royalty. Royalty.

I don’t want to see Israel destroyed, or it’s non-capitol crime people killed or injured in any way. People are allowed to criticize other countries. Covering up for their bad behavior only makes things worse.

Look at the current and previous antipope, saying you shouldn’t convert Jews, even though God commanded it! Royalty.

Israel doesn’t follow the rules, and aren’t expected to, and if anyone notices, they are the problem. Royalty.

[fruser1]

deliberate

You mean like how Hunter's laptop had all the hallmarks of a russian disinformation campaign?

"Deliberate" requires context.

Would that be deliberate as in:

-The policy of Israel was to kill Americans

-The pilots acted in spite of policy because they had a personal desire to kill Americans.

-Israel, even though allied, took exception to the intel operation because of info passed to their enemy so they ordered the attack (claimed story).

-The pilots believed they were attacking an enemy target but were wrong (official story).

"Deliberate" is grammatically applicable to all those scenarios.

There are plenty in the military that don't like cooperation with Israel, just like in the civilian world. So unless that General backs up his statement by releasing all the classified info associated with the event, he is likely just putting out conspiracy theories for his own purposes.

How can I claim that? Well, the "official" mistake-story contradicts the implied notion that it was not an error. The General may have said it publicly but, being that he'd know the "official" story, he'd know not to state anything classified. Note his claim is meant to justify not maintaining strategic ties with Israel. Another telling fact. And since I know THAT - it makes the General lose credibility in my mind.

And, again back to my first post on this topic, if it was indeed as he claimed (this is not the first I've heard of this stuff), that is irrelevant today. Sovereigns injure each other. It sucks but that's how it is.

[Robert DeLong]

In the fog of war many unfortunate mistakes often occur. There have been numerous examples where America attacked themselves, killing Americans in the process:

Friendly fire incidents, often attributed to the "fog of war" (combat confusion, misidentification, and communication failures), have resulted in significant U.S. casualties throughout military history.

2004 Afghanistan (Pat Tillman): Former NFL player Pat Tillman was killed by friendly fire after a nearby explosive device caused confusion between allied Ranger units; the military initially concealed the cause of death for five weeks.

2003 Iraq (Marines): Approximately 10 U.S. Marines were killed by A-10 airstrikes ordered by a forward air controller who mistook their vehicles for enemy forces during heavy Iraqi artillery fire.

2002 Afghanistan (Canadians): U.S. Air National Guard pilots dropped a 500-pound bomb on Canadian troops conducting live-fire exercises, killing 4 Canadians; the pilot cited the "fog of war" and lack of coordination.

1994 Iraq (Black Hawks): U.S. F-15 fighters shot down two U.S. Army Black Hawk helicopters supporting humanitarian missions, killing 26 people including 15 Americans, due to identification errors in a restricted zone.

1991 Gulf War: Friendly fire accounted for 24% of U.S. combat deaths (35 Americans); additionally, U.S. A-10s killed 9 British soldiers by mistaking their vehicles for Iraqi targets.

1945 WWII (Operation Cobra): U.S. Eighth Air Force bombers accidentally struck American troops during the Normandy breakout, killing 111 soldiers and wounding over 490 due to poor weather and coordination issues.

2008 Iraq (Samarra): Sergeant David Hart and two other soldiers died under circumstances involving U.S. helicopter fire during a firefight, with investigations later suggesting friendly fire was the likely cause.

Modern precision weapons and training have reduced but not eliminated fratricide, which remains an inherent risk of combat ambiguity and rapid decision-making under stress.

[Danie_2023]

“”That’s rare... Sadly, I think Massie spoke to a largely empty chamber on this.””

***

Sadly? Hardly. More like, appropriately. Massie is a grandstanding/flaming AH that likes to draw attention to himself by drawing negative attention to Israel. And you are a propagandizing troll who consistently posts articles like this one that bashes Israel and throws anti-Israel negative arrows based on lies and BS.

Massie is a typical lying leftist posing as a Republican (RINO)... who arrogantly pretends that he knows more than others that actually ARE qualified to speak on certain issues, which he is not. Admiral Kidd is just ‘one’ of those that Massie ignores and/or disputes via his heinous actions....

“Admiral Isaac Kidd, who actually led the Naval Court of Inquiry, said in 1991 that his investigation found zero evidence of a deliberate attack. When asked if they found a “smoking gun,” he said, “we didn’t even find a water pistol.””

https://x.com/davereaboi/status/2064041251549372495

---

“Leftists are spiraling after Thomas Massie’s loss and conservatives should take that as a good sign

Massie is a man who can be judged by the quality of his friends, unfortunately — uniformly a collection of lefties, anti-Semites, engagement-farming conspiracy theorists, and Israel-haters.”

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/leftists-are-spiraling-after-thomas-massie-s-loss-and-conservatives-should-take-that-as-a-good-sign/ar-AA23EpXL

[fruser1]

Saudi involvement

I don't "know" the level of involvement but have seen the press that some members of the royal family were funding the wahabi movement or what not. The ones flying the planes were mostly Saudis if I recollect correctly.

[fruser1]

Who are you?

I prefer anonymity. Feel free to publish your own details.

If you have classified info contradiction the official report that it was a mistake, let us know.

Barring that, you are choosing to believe what's reported in the press over what's officially documented. There - rationalized.

What makes you think an ally has to be a friend? If the dealings of the sovereigns among themselves disturb you, seek therapy.

[fruser1]

Royalty

Uh, yeah, right.

Recognizing that Israel is fighting common enemies of the US and wanting to cooperate with them is not treating them like royalty.

And it's not too hard to recognize that there's a different, nonsensical, standard applied to Israel by some folks, unlike as for other countries. Hence the anti-semitic charge.

[BenLurkin]

So we forgave the Japs for Pearl Harbor and we forgave the Krauts for invading Poland, but this Massie creep is still hating on Israel.

[Jan_Sobieski]

Virtue signaling piss ant

[JoSixChip]

They've worked hard for this recognition.

They worked hard to stand next to a traitor POS scumbag? I think not.

[FreeReign]

Wise post.

[woodpusher]

Israel to ALUSNA, Telegram 9 Jun 1967

ALUSNA stands for American Legation, United States Naval Attache.

https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1964-68v19/d233

233. Telegram From the Defense Attaché Office in Israel to the White House¹

Tel Aviv, June 9, 1967, 1520Z.

0845. At 09/1300Z the IDF Assistant Army Spokesman Lt Col Michael Bloch telephoned to ALUSNA following seven points as “Further information on yesterday’s incident with the American ship.”

1. Ship was sighted and recognized as a naval ship 13 miles from coast.

2. Presence in a fighting area is against international custom.

3. The area is not a common passage for ships.

4. Egypt had declared the area closed to neutrals.

5. Liberty resembles the Egyptian supply ship El Quseir.

6. Ship was not flying flag when sighted. She moved at “high speed” westward toward enemy coast.

7. IDF Navy had earlier reports of bombardment of El-Arish from sea.

Comment: 1. At first Col Bloch merely read off seven points. ALUSNA pressed him for a label for the statement asking if this were an official explanation of incident. Col Bloch could not supply a preamble on his own and ALUSNA requested he consult with some authority who could. Bloch called back in two minutes with the above quoted heading.

2. While El Quseir bears a highly superficial resemblance to Liberty, ALUSNA can not understand how trained professional naval officers could be so inept to carry out yesterday’s attack. Certainly IDF Navy must be well drilled in identification of Egyptian ships. El Quseir is less than half the size; is many years older, and lacks the elaborate antenna array and hull markings of Liberty.

3. ALUSNA evaluates yesterday’s erroneous attack resulted from trigger happy eagerness to glean some portion of the great victory being shared by IDF Army and Air Force and in which Navy was not sharing.

Source: Naval Security Group Files, Box 896, USS Liberty Pre-76 Inactive Files, Box 1, U.S.S. Liberty, 5750/4, Chronological Message File. Secret; Immediate; Priority. Sent also to OSD, CNO, DEPT STATE, COMSIXTHFLT, CINCSTRIKE, CINCNAVEUR, and JCS. Repeated to DIA, USUN, CINCEUR-USEUCOM, CTG SIX ZERO PT TWO, USAFE, CINCUSAREUR, and CTG SIX ZERO. Received at the Department of the Navy at 1925Z.

- - - - - - - - -

Liberty and El Quseir profiles to scale.

El Quesir was a 1920s horse transport ship. Liberty was almost four times the tonnage of the horse transport ship. Liberty was brimming with antennas and radar not seen on a 1920's horse transport.

- - - - - - - - -

El Quesir photos:

http://www.gtr5.com/evidence/img_0.jpg

[Uncle Miltie]

Digging back over 60! Years to find a way to indict Tha Jooooosssss!!!

Why stop there?

Go ahead. Blame today’s Jews for killing Christ too.

[Longdriver69]

It’s telling to see Firsters try to downplay Israel’s intentional attack on our military.

[Longdriver69]

We dropped 2 nukes on Japan & flattened & partitioned Berlin. We didn’t forgive them: we destroyed them because they were our enemies.