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To: BroJoeK
Friend, you're a typical Democrat, projecting your own feelings onto your political opponents, regardless of what they themselves had to say about it.

I don't care what they had to say about it. Show me the money. People lie. Money always tells the truth.

If you want to get to the truth, follow the money. It is exactly what DOGE is doing right now.

The *LIBERALS* (Republicans in 1860, Democrats today) have *ALWAYS* used government power to make themselves wealthy, and usually at the expense of others.

Modern Liberals pretend to care about illegals in the same way 1860 Liberals pretended to care about slaves.

What they really care about is having government power so it can impose laws that put money into their pockets.

It is what Washington DC has always done since the 1820s, and it is how the original secession crises of 1828 occurred.

During the Civil War the Union suffered roughly 75% inflation, meaning the 1860 GDP of $4.3 billion would be $7.6 billion in 1865. The Union's actual 1865 GDP was $10 billion meaning its actual GDP grew at 8% per year, more than inflation, during the war.

I wouldn't just accept what historians claim on the issue. You can't trust anyone to tell you the truth because they are all trying to "help" their side look virtuous. The same way liberals manipulate economic numbers today was the same way they manipulated them in the 1860s and 1870s.

During the Civil War, Confederates suffered some 9,200% inflation, meaning that by the war's end, their money was virtually worthless.

A meaningless point. They lost the war, so of course their currency is worthless. This speaks not at all to what it would have been worth if the Union had simply stayed on it's side of the border instead of invading people trying to get away from it.

120 posted on 04/24/2025 11:11:26 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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To: DiogenesLamp; x; Homer_J_Simpson
DiogenesLamp: "I don't care what they had to say about it.
Show me the money.
People lie.
oney always tells the truth.
If you want to get to the truth, follow the money.
It is exactly what DOGE is doing right now."

I get it.
That's your Marxist indoctrination at work, convincing you that only economics and class warfare matter, everything else is just "words".

In reality, human beings are often driven by motives only tangentially, if at all, related to Marxist economic class warfare.
Those motives can include religious and political ideals, as well as grievances over such issues as safety, health & justice.
Sure, sometimes those align with financial interests, but not always.

DiogenesLamp: "The *LIBERALS* (Republicans in 1860, Democrats today) have *ALWAYS* used government power to make themselves wealthy, and usually at the expense of others."

Because you are, at heart, a Democrat, you can't understand Republicans.
Federalists-Whigs-Republicans have always been the party of good government, meaning constitutional government.

Democrats have always been the party of rule-or-ruin big government -- government powerful enough to support their interests (i.e., fugitive slave laws) and suppress their opponents (i.e., Kansas' Lecompton Constitution).
By 1860, Southern Democrats and their Doughfaced Northern allies were so corrupted and out of control, they had doubled the national debt in just four years, while running up a record of corruptions, bribery, voter suppressions and other political chicanery that let Republicans run & win on a "good government" platform.

And being "rule or ruin" Democrats, in 1860 just as today, when they lose elections, they declare nullification (i.e., sanctuary cities), lawfare, secession, insurrection, rebellion and war against the United States.
It's their nature, it's what Democrats do, though these days they seem to lack anything remotely resembling the courage & tenacity of their slaveholder forefathers.

DiogenesLamp: "Modern Liberals pretend to care about illegals in the same way 1860 Liberals pretended to care about slaves.
What they really care about is having government power so it can impose laws that put money into their pockets.
It is what Washington DC has always done since the 1820s, and it is how the original secession crises of 1828 occurred."

So,

  1. First, yet again, you have it backwards -- in fact, Democrat slaveholders before 1860 wanted slavery for the same reason Democrat politicians want illegal immigrants today.
    Slaves and illegal immigrants were/are voter "force multipliers" who give Democrat voters greater representation in Congress (~20 seats in 1860!), and in electoral college votes for president.
    By that same calculation, US legal and unauthorized non-citizen residents (25 million in total) provide Democrats with ~30 additional congressional seats today (761,000 per district)!
    If you don't understand how that works, then you need to go back to your high school civics courses to find out.

  2. Second, what you're talking about did not begin in the 1820s, it's as old as mankind itself -- there have always been people who want to make their own livings by forcing others to work for them.
    In American politics, the worst of these have always been Democrats -- slaveholders, racists & bureaucrats -- not "liberals" or Republicans.

  3. Indeed, the 1830 Nullification & secession crisis was caused less by Northerners -- New Englanders voted against the "Tariff of Abominations", for obvious reasons -- than by Protectionist Southerns and Democrats like Andrew Jackson, Henry Clay and even flip-flopping John C. Calhoun.
    It resulted in South Carolina's threats of secession and Tennessee Democrat Andrew Jackson's famous response -- after sending a US Navy war fleet with troops to Charleston Harbor:

      "Please give my compliments to my friends in your State and say to them, that if a single drop of blood shall be shed there in opposition to the laws of the United States, I will hang the first man I can lay my hand on engaged in such treasonable conduct, upon the first tree I can reach."
      Pres. Andrew Jackson to South Carolina, 1830
Pres. Jackson's strong response to threatened secession ended such threats for another 30 years.
121 posted on 04/26/2025 6:50:39 AM PDT by BroJoeK (future DDG 134 -- we remember)
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