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To: BroJoeK

Someone not eager to enter the war would have ordered the fleet to sea upon receipt of those intercepted dispatches, but you go ahead and stick with the government story. It’s where you’re comfortable.


188 posted on 11/13/2023 5:47:19 AM PST by JonPreston ( ✌ ☮️ )
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To: JonPreston
JonPreston: "Someone not eager to enter the war would have ordered the fleet to sea upon receipt of those intercepted dispatches, but you go ahead and stick with the government story.
It’s where you’re comfortable."

My dad served in Hawaii during WWII and when I was a young boy he taught me a version of Pearl Harbor similar to Stinnett's and I believed him.
The problem is there's no real evidence that FDR or anybody else in Washington, DC, knew of the time or place of the coming Japanese attack.

Of course, everyone knew something was up, and that's why the CNO (Stark) sent out a "War Warning" on November 27, 1941, to CincPac (Kimmel) and CincAF (Hart) with CNO's best guesses as to where the Japanese might strike.
Washington did not think Hawaii was most likely.
Turns out, Stark was right to expect attacks at many other locations around the Pacific, but he missed seeing the very first attack.

By the way, the only reference I can find to your "Admiral Stinnett" says it's Robert Stinnett himself, even though his biographical information does not tell us his WWII Navy rank and he was only 18 in 1942, so impossible to have been an admiral during the war.
Possibly he rose to Admiral after WWII?

The US Navy admiral in charge at Pearl Harbor in 1941 was named Husband Kimmel.
Naturally, Kimmel believed he had been scapegoated for intelligence failures at much higher levels in Washington, DC and Stark was soon after relieved of his CNO job.

However, ironically, it turned out that the best place for the US fleet to be on Sunday morning, December 7, 1941, was anchored in the shallow waters of Pearl Harbor, with most of the men & officers ashore, where almost all of the damage could be rather quickly repaired and those old battle-wagons soon sent back into the fight.
And fortunately, our aircraft carriers were safe, hundreds or thousands of miles away.

As for FDR's eagerness for war, that's undoubtedly true, but what FDR wanted was war against Nazi Germany, to help out our friends in Britain and France.
Japan was a side show as far as FDR was concerned.
Nevertheless, there's no doubt FDR was, we could say, "crusin' for a bruisin'" with Japan.
What's never been proved is that FDR or anybody else in Washington knew in advance of the time and place of Japan's first big attack against us.

192 posted on 11/14/2023 3:01:42 AM PST by BroJoeK (future DDG 134 -- we remember)
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