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The Weird Logic of Far-Leftists Who Support Putin in Ukraine - How Stop The War became Blame The Victim.
Medium ^ | May 10, 2022 | Bernard O'Leary

Posted on 03/13/2022 8:42:12 PM PDT by DoodleBob

When Russian tanks rolled into Ukraine on February 24th, it caused a lot of problems for voices on the right and the left.

Putin has a lot of fans in both corners, and these fans had spent years portraying him as a tactical genius, bamboozling us all with his four-dimensional chess moves. Right up until February 23rd, these Putin stans had been assuring us that Putin would never do something as dumb as launch a full-scale invasion of a sovereign democracy.

Ever since then, the right have been able to change gears on Putin fairly seamlessly. This is WAR, and right-wingers absolutely love a good war. Trump is already thinking of ways to escalate the situation ad absurdium.

But what about the left?

Putin has actually cultivated an army of left-wing sympathisers over the years, largely thanks to his support for the RT news network which often broadcasts counter-narratives against the West’s mainstream media. The leftists that appeared on RT (before it recently stopped broadcasting) are not necessarily pro-Putin. But they are anti-West in a way that serves Putin’s propaganda goals, which is why they get a platform.

Many of these left-wingers are fighting a battle that started in 2003 with the invasion of Iraq. They are staunchly anti-imperialism, anti-colonialism, and anti-war.

Which are all respectable positions. But now they’re in a bind. They can’t support a war, but they also can’t say Putin is bad. What’s a tankie to do? Simple. Just blame the Ukrainians for fighting back:

The ex-RT position is that Ukraine should just surrender

The three tweets above are all from former RT contributors who now find themselves unemployed and stuck in an ideological wasteland.

Their logic basically goes like this:

Russia is much stronger than Ukraine

Lots of people will die in the resistance

It’s sad when people die

Ukraine should stop resisting

Which… kind of seems like saying imperialism is okay? And victims should just roll with it?

Plus, it also assumes that a unilateral surrender would result in no further casualties. Or at least, no casualties beyond the Russian execution list. And any causalities that might arise if Russia continues its expansion into the Baltics.

But that’s ignoring the fact that Putin’s regime is propped up by imprisonment of opposition voices, police brutality against protestors, and state-sanctioned murder. The only way to install a puppet government in Ukraine (one of Putin’s “reasonable” demands) would be to use even more brutal repression.

The pro-Putin left doesn’t seem to care about the question: “What would happen to the Ukrainian people if they surrendered?” They just need a position on Ukraine that doesn’t challenge any of their other beliefs.

How did the far-left end up supporting Putin?

Let’s take a quick trip down memory lane.

In 2003, the United States and Britain launched an illegal invasion of Iraq.

This war was justified under some extremely shady pretexts. Namely, that the country’s leader, Saddam Hussein, was helping Al Qaeda (a lie) and hoarding weapons of mass destruction (also a lie).

If you were around in 2003, you probably remember that people did not take this lying down. The march to war was met with massive civil protests around the globe.

Over 10 million people in 600 cities marched against the war on February 15, 2003. Three million people marched in Rome that day, setting a world record for the largest single protest in history. The record is still unbroken.

People were mad.

Most of these protests were organized by groups like Stop The War in the UK. STW is a group, still active today, that formed immediately after 9/11 with the noble goal of preventing a military response to the terrorist attacks. And they were right about that, as we’ve seen in the intervening years.

STW has very complicated internal politics that would take hours to discuss, but the important thing to know here is that many of the leading members were veteran hard-left figures in the British Communist movement.

These people are furiously anti-capitalist and furiously anti-imperialism, which can sometimes boil down to straightforward anti-Westernism. To this group, anything that the West does is inherently wrong.

It’s wrong because the West is doing it, and it is therefore advancing Western goals. For these people, “West” and “Imperialism” mean the same thing. And the 2003 anti-war moved seemed to prove that they had a point.

My enemy’s enemy is my friend

Putin is catnip for these people because he has been aggressively fighting Western imperialism for years.

Plus, his RT network has personally enriched several of the voices in this movement.

As Putin became move confrontational with the west (Georgia, Crimea, Syria), these people became extremely skilled at taking the Russian side. After all, were all of these actions not a form of anti-imperialism?

If you believe that imperialism=The West, then yes.

And, if you believe that imperialism=The West, then the situation in Ukraine will make your head explode. Because the invasion definitely looks like imperialism, but the West are against it.

How can Putin, a guy who has been anti-West and is therefore great, do something bad?

Crushing democracy in the name of peace

None of the Stop The War-types came out in 2003 and said that Iraqi forces should surrender to prevent loss of life. In recent years, many of them came out and supported the incumbent governments of Libya and Syria.

Why did they stand behind Qaddafi and al-Assad? Because NATO were on the other side.

This position of “lay down your weapons and accept defeat” seems to be a recent idea among the far-left anti-war movement. As far as I’m aware, none of them recommend that either side in Yemen surrender to halt the slaughter over there.

So, what they’re really saying is, “hey, I know that being invaded is bad. But look on the bright side. At least you’re not being invaded by the West.”


TOPICS: Military/Veterans; Society
KEYWORDS: 2003; 2022; 202202; 20220223; 202205; 911; antiwar; antiwarons; antiwest; antiwestern; bernardoleary; communists; imperialism; invasionofgeorgia; invasionofukraine; leftists; nato; pedophile; primakov; putin; ritter; rt; russia; russiahoax; russianimperialism; russianinvasion; russiatoday; saddamhussein; scottritter; spies; spooks; stopthewar; ukraine; unarmsinspector; zottherussiantrolls
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To: freespirit2012

A JeffreyPedo = Jeffrey Epstein. Likes girls that are too old for Joe.


21 posted on 03/13/2022 9:52:07 PM PDT by kiryandil (China Joe and Paycheck Hunter - the Chink in America's defenses)
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To: kiryandil

That has me laughing so hard, I’m in tears.


22 posted on 03/13/2022 9:58:01 PM PDT by ConservativeMind (Trump: Befuddling Democrats, Republicans, and the Media for the benefit of the US and all mankind.)
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To: Steve_Seattle

“It’s not clear to me how saying it’s suicidal for Ukraine to keep up this fight is “supporting” Putin.”

Dude, you have to catch up...

The new narrative is: Anything short of advocating the nuclear destruction of Russia...is pro Putin (the Nazi clone).

Neutrality, and advocating the US stay the hell out, is pro Putin and anti everything good and decent in the world.


23 posted on 03/13/2022 10:03:54 PM PDT by Mariner (War criminal #18)
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To: DoodleBob

a earlier post described Zelensky as wanting to prove he was ‘woke’ - which should enamor the Left to him. OTOH, it’s the people of Ukraine of all classes who are fighting back against being told what to be or say. And the Left can’t stand for any examples of that kind of behavior. It might spread.


24 posted on 03/13/2022 10:04:33 PM PDT by blueplum ("...this moment is your moment: it belongs to you... " President Donald J. Trump, Jan 20, 2017) )
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To: DoodleBob

Saddam Hussein was harboring terrorists, in fact was hosting Zarqawi and a cell of Zarqawi’s mostly Egyptian al Qaeda affiliates right in Baghdad proper well before the war, when Saddam, on the advice of Gen. an Douri, was wooing Islm
amid extremists by enacting Shariah law, writing the Qur’an in Saddam’s blood, and building a gigantic mosque with minarets designed to resemble Russian weapons. Zarqawi’s terrorist cell beheaded a Chaldean nun there in Baghdad, and his other cell based in northern Iraq assassinated Saddam’s opponents among the Kurds as well as assassinated US AID diplomat Lawrence Foley. Zarqawi founded ISIS and al Dhouri, his son, and a bunch of Saddam’s intelligence personnel-after Saddam was killed- swore an oath of allegiance to ISIS emir Zarqawi. Before the war, Saddam was also yucking it up with Russian General Primakov, who was responsible for removing evidence from Iraq to Syria and Lebanon.


25 posted on 03/13/2022 10:07:14 PM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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To: Williams

We identify our enemies by the positions they share with our other enemies.


26 posted on 03/13/2022 10:08:11 PM PDT by Mariner (War criminal #18)
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To: kiryandil

He’s disgusting


27 posted on 03/13/2022 10:18:09 PM PDT by HollyB
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To: Mariner
The conga line of left wing haters on the Twittsewer spewing hatred at Putin is endless.

One example is that POS in my post #3.

Some people are just too old to understand how to scout the opinions of our enemies.

I think you engaged with one such.  winking face

28 posted on 03/13/2022 10:28:51 PM PDT by kiryandil (China Joe and Paycheck Hunter - the Chink in America's defenses)
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To: HollyB
Be a shame if the Russians did something about his opinion.

Getting cancelled by Twitter is one thing [Twitter should have made him remove this tweet], but getting cancelled by the Russians is another thing entirely...  winking face

29 posted on 03/13/2022 10:34:24 PM PDT by kiryandil (China Joe and Paycheck Hunter - the Chink in America's defenses)
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To: DoodleBob

I don’t think the Ukes should surrender their country. If the Russians were insisting on unconditional surrender or insisting that all of Ukraine be absorbed into Russia then I’d say by all means fight bitterly even if you are badly outgunned.

On the other hand, those are not the terms that have been offered to them by the Russians. What they’ve insisted on is:
1) let the Russian dominated regions of Ukraine go
2) get rid of the Nazis like the Azov Battalion
3) be neutral. Not in the EU or NATO but otherwise, just like Finland or Austria, do as you wish so long as you are not openly hostile to Russia.

Are those terms so onerous that the Ukes should be willing to endure a bloodbath to prevent them? They’re not in the EU or NATO now. They’d give up nothing there. Is it so important to control areas dominated by Russian speaking ethnic Russians who don’t want to be ruled by Kiev? As for the Nazis, I’d be just fine with the Russkies ridding us all of them.


30 posted on 03/13/2022 11:10:25 PM PDT by FLT-bird
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To: kiryandil

I don’t understand that kind of thinking. How is that anything but bigoted and cruel? Is denying some person in Russia the medication they need going to stick it to Putin? Is it OK because they happened to be born in Russia?

and this guy is an “ethicist”.

Disgusting.


31 posted on 03/13/2022 11:12:29 PM PDT by FLT-bird
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To: DoodleBob
From the thread on Lee Camp's interview with Scott Ritter, on this thread (link), Camp has staked his claim as a pro-Russia shill and Ritter is low rent expert for hire. They don't count for much.
32 posted on 03/13/2022 11:15:19 PM PDT by Widget Jr
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To: FLT-bird
He pulled the same cr@p with the vaccines: post #8
33 posted on 03/13/2022 11:16:37 PM PDT by kiryandil (China Joe and Paycheck Hunter - the Chink in America's defenses)
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To: kiryandil

Sad this attack on innocent people. Most not involved in political crap.


34 posted on 03/14/2022 1:14:33 AM PDT by antceecee
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To: FLT-bird
I don't think the Ukes should surrender their country

You conveniently forgot Putin's demand that Ukraine demilitarize: no army larger than 60,000

with no NATO umbrella and no army it's an unconditional surrender, with no defence for future Russian invasions

35 posted on 03/14/2022 3:45:16 AM PDT by tlozo
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To: piasa
It is an attempt to demoralize Ukrainians. The same people that claim Ukraine cannot win are also the ones who constantly scream how invincible Afghanistan is.

Exactly.

It is a tragedy for Western civilization.

Just because seriously evil people support Ukraine, does not mean Ukraine does not deserve support.

Putin obviously ordered the invasion because of the weakness of the Biden administration.

The Biden administration, it appears, wanted a wag the dog moment to hold onto power through the mid-terms.

The Biden administration makes noises about supporting Ukraine... but mostly wants to appear to support Ukraine to gain political advantage in the coming elections.

36 posted on 03/14/2022 3:46:45 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: tlozo

OK, it is not to be militarized. It will be a buffer state. Japan isn’t militarized either yet they have had their national sovereignty for generations. The reality is that Ukraine is losing and will lose. They were never going to win. It’s better to accept that reality and get fewer people killed than waste lives over a hopeless cause.


37 posted on 03/14/2022 4:06:45 AM PDT by FLT-bird
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To: tlozo

OK, it is not to be militarized. It will be a buffer state. Japan isn’t militarized either yet they have had their national sovereignty for generations. The reality is that Ukraine is losing and will lose. They were never going to win. It’s better to accept that reality and get fewer people killed than waste lives over a hopeless cause.


38 posted on 03/14/2022 4:06:45 AM PDT by FLT-bird
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To: FLT-bird
It will be a buffer state

It's called a puppet state not a buffer. As to they can't win, Ukrainian's don't have to win, they just have to keep killing Russians even during the occupation. Eventually Russians will leave.

39 posted on 03/14/2022 4:57:05 AM PDT by tlozo
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To: DoodleBob

The only differences between socialism and fascism are in the lies told in order to inflict totalitarianism on a gullible populous.


40 posted on 03/14/2022 5:19:28 AM PDT by nagant
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