Posted on 04/26/2020 2:34:06 AM PDT by tired&retired
Doctors sound alarm about patients in their 30s and 40s left debilitated or dead. Some didn’t even know they were infected.
The man was among several recent stroke patients in their 30s to 40s who were all infected with the coronavirus. The median age for that type of severe stroke is 74.
As Oxley, an interventional neurologist, began the procedure to remove the clot, he observed something he had never seen before. On the monitors, the brain typically shows up as a tangle of black squiggles — “like a can of spaghetti,” he said — that provide a map of blood vessels. A clot shows up as a blank spot. As he used a needlelike device to pull out the clot, he saw new clots forming in real-time around it.
“This is crazy,” he remembers telling his boss.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
[With a CFR of less than one percent the argument to “just drive on through” is going to carry a lot of weight, at least at the beginning.]
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
And in Germany’s case, the same people are being tested multiple times, so the question is whether these people are being counted twice, if they test positive, negative and then positive again, thereby inflating the denominator, i.e. the infected number. Whereas you can only die once, so the numerator’s (i.e. dead) generally not inflated. Note also that Germany is counting the co-morbidities as the cause of death rather than the motive force behind the co-morbidities reaching a critical stage, i.e. the coronavirus, so the numerator is being tamped down as a matter of policy. That’s the reason behind a guy from Helsinki’s observations, re Nordlanders:
Even deaths can be covered up because a lot of people who die are going to be elderly who haven’t been tested and they’re not planning to test most of the dead. Curiously the people who are dying after being tested positive are disproportionately migrants
I suspect that it turns out that Sweden is in fact doing it right that shielding the elderly instead of shutting down the economy is better in the end but it doesn’t mean that the disease is sparing Sweden or that the low numbers mean anything, to the contrary, they’ve decided to let it spread and to keep their estimates of the real number secret. We’ll maybe know them after the epidemic once they start publishing studies – but only if it does turn out to be the right bet.
If corona turns out to be deadlier then it will be the thing that pops the entire “Scandinavian model” bubble. People abroad have been making the mistake of trusting Scandinavian governments and their invented statistics because Scandinavian people are honest in person.]
I think they get it but what is the alternative. Please show us when in history the entire population was quarantined. While this isn't a total quarantine; it's quarantine light for most of the nation.
Think maybe we should get back to letting the ill be quarantined while the healthy get on with their lives. Can't be a shut-in forever.
My dad was a mining engineer and his last decades were spent as a Federal Mine Inspector. Mine fatalities are a pretty rare event now as well due to years of hard work addressing the causes of mine fatalities. Sometimes even rare events have a big impact. People are emotional animals. If society needs what comes out of mines people have to be convinced to go in them, that their exposure to risk is being taken seriously and everything possible is being done to make it safe.
Not saying the mining industry should be used as a model for anything just pointing out that if you know the history of mine safety it had to be done. There was no other option or the miners would not continue to work. It’s what the mine strikes of the 50s were all about.
Look at the Potash Industry, the mines I worked in. New technology has made it obsolete. There are no more “Potash Miners”, they pump slurry into the ground and pump it out. Nobody goes underground anymore.
It keeps pointing back to China and a bio-weapon. A very ugly bio-weapon.
The question about the demographics is suspect until we know if the reason “old folks” succumbed was due to their “comorbidities” which is likely but there is also some element of “infected people were sent back to their bed at the home” which, I suspect, is going to be an effect that is more than trivial. Remember, it appears that a sizable # of the deaths are IN the “homes” in the NYC area where this “return to your old bed” policy was in place.
Hysteria journalism at its finest here.
* Impossible to extract exact numbers of those under 30 who died of stroke while having the Covid
* Scary language and hyperbole everywhere
[The question about the demographics is suspect until we know if the reason “old folks” succumbed was due to their “comorbidities” which is likely but there is also some element of “infected people were sent back to their bed at the home” which, I suspect, is going to be an effect that is more than trivial. Remember, it appears that a sizable # of the deaths are IN the “homes” in the NYC area where this “return to your old bed” policy was in place.]
Nursing homes are “medically rough” places. Very hard to have “hospital standards” of hygiene in a “nursing home”.
[Nursing homes are “medically rough” places. Very hard to have “hospital standards” of hygiene in a “nursing home”.]
covid-19 causes many, many small blood clots in about 40% of hospitalized. This does not happen randomly in the population.
This COVID-19 feature, as with other of its features, targets the OBESE. It especially targets the mobidly obese. Get the BMI (Body Mass Index) on the COVID-19 dead if you don’t believe that.
COVID-19 targets the mildly obese when combined with weakened lungs, heart, kidneys, liver and other organs. Of course, those organs are weakened by sugar, alcohol, tobacco, legal and illegal drugs and promiscuous sex and its STDs.
Each of us has a choice between a bad or a good lifestyle. Making that right choice is worth far more than a vaccine or drug to fight the disease once you get it.
(Full disclosure: I eat too much sugar.)
As part of vaccine development.
We can test that hypothesis by looking for increases in Democrat voter registration.
Yep. I know University of Penn is good. Cleveland Clinic is the best. Looking into others. Mine is specific to the root, so it would be a root replacement. That’s better than the arch, so there is that. Hoping by the time I have to get the surgery there will be some new technology. Really wish there was a non invasive method (a few reports that some meds can help stabilize or slow growth)
I’m following your thoughts on this topic and understand some of it well enough. Certainly there is more to this stuff than “the flu”. It appears to go far beyond that. Instead of weakly weighing in on the medicine I’ll stick with a layman’s perspective.
You don’t have to fear monger with this crap. The truth of it is bad enough and speculation of what we don’t know is much worse. While the risk of hospitalization is low and death lower the consequence outweighs the risk in a risk matrix from what I see. Risk management and that probability and consequence grid is something I have practiced for the better part of 40 years. The credit default swap failure was a low risk but the consequence was collapse and not a risk that should have been taken.
It is true that people die every day. Death is the only guarantee we have when we are born. However, what I am seeing is lingering after effects for survivors that few are discussing. I read an account in the local paper of a fellow from around here who got the stuff, managed for awhile at home but was eventually hospitalized. A 40 something father of two and his wife an MD, the whole family was infected. After weeks in an induced coma and on ventilator and at deaths door he was given plasma from his wife who had “recovered” 14 days prior. The next day he was off ventilator and out of coma of course. He is disoriented and faces months of therapy and immediate amputation of some toes and parts of fingers. It sounds to me questionable if this guy will ever be recovered to full function. He had zero prior conditions.
I read that the clouds on chest X-ray are not fluid as such but red blood cell parts left in the lungs as clots. That the blood has lost the ability to carry oxygen and that all the ventilator is doing is pushing enough oxygen into the remaining functional red blood cells to supply the body enough oxygen for survival and just barely or not at all.
I also read about necropsy results showing the lungs full of small clots and blood more like gelatin than blood.
The stuff sounds more like a blood disease than a respiratory one. Droplets and respiration are just the carrier for something that appears much more sinister to me.
What is even more sinister is in the speculation of what it really is and the long term effects we have not yet seen. Speculation becomes the territory of intrigue. Here is one for you, could it be first spread like a virus than become blood borne like malaria? There is also the question of immunity being functional.
It seems that we will all be infected eventually unless somehow it burns out. We are not quite old but mid-60 and so more vulnerable than not. We are distancing out here on the farm seldom going to town and only for groceries three times in 7 weeks. The goal is to avoid infection until more is known but I doubt we will avoid it forever or that anyone will. It appears to be a well engineered pathogen for warfare. It is the equivalent of wounding many to tie up lots of resources and get them in the open to wound even more and tie up yet more resources for a very long time.
We have been sequestered for seven weeks, the economy has been squashed for six weeks now. On that front I don’t believe we have registered that damage. It will be considerable and we will not be bouncing back I fear. I know that in my working years I could never have managed my business with any break longer than a few days without returning to a deep pit to dig out of.
The ICU is the “dirtiest” place in the hospital.
I’ve scrubbed cases where the aorctic valve was replaced as well. It’s a really big case. Penn and Cleveland Clinic have excellent reputations.
Your going to have to quarantine more than just the ill. You're going to have to quarantine all those who are susceptible to becoming seriously ill by this virus. The more we learn about it, the more people that definition includes. Also, we are now learning there can be long-term health effects from this disease. All we can do, and what we should have done from the start, is to let the young and healthy and those who show immunity go back to work, and let everybody else self-quarantine.
[The ICU is the “dirtiest” place in the hospital.]
The lung has a number of functions besides respiration. One function of the lungs is to filter out microemboli that do return from organs that allow “pass through” so it would be expected to find clots on the post Mortem. Trying to make it “worse than it is” or “better than it is” are political agendas that don’t interest me either way. I’m trying as much as possible to have an “agenda free” life here. I fully expect a level of several percent who will have sequelae, the most serious of which will probably turn out to be Reanl Failure. As far as a “minor decrement” in IQ a number of people actually perform better socially with a little of that (LOL), it’s what “Pre Frontal Lobotomies” were about.
They try but the worst bugs in the hospital are found in the plumbing of the ICU.
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