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Humans and Neandertals likely interbred in Middle East
Science ^
| 28 January 2015
| Michael Balter
Posted on 01/29/2015 1:26:30 PM PST by SunkenCiv
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To: BroJoeK
Tell me where the mtDNA is located. What is nuclear dna? I am studying my own DNA and have studied Y-Dna, Mt-dna and autosonimal DNA. Nuclear dna was never mentioned. Also assuming a 50 year generation and 50,000 years the DNA would be so diluted that prehistoric dna of less than several thousand parents would not even show up.
61
posted on
01/30/2015 6:47:05 AM PST
by
mountainlion
(Live well for those that did not make it back.)
To: SunkenCiv
There really doesn't seem to be much difference between the neanderthal man and homo sapiens. What reason would there be (other than geographical separation) that they couldn't have intermingled?
.
62
posted on
01/30/2015 7:32:02 AM PST
by
FBD
To: mountainlion
mountainlion:
"I am studying my own DNA and have studied Y-Dna, Mt-dna and autosonimal DNA. Nuclear dna was never mentioned." Perhaps these definitions will help:
"Nuclear DNA, or nuclear deoxyribonucleic acid (nDNA), is DNA contained within a nucleus of eukaryotic organisms.[1]
Nuclear DNA encodes for the majority of the genome in eukaryotes, with DNA located in mitochondria and plastids coding for the rest.
Nuclear DNA adheres to Mendelian inheritance, with information coming from two parents, one male and one female, rather than matrilineally, as in mitochondrial DNA.[2]"
"Nuclear DNA and mitochondrial DNA differ in many ways, starting with location and structure.
Nuclear DNA is located within the nucleus of eukaryote cells and usually has two copies per cell while mitochondrial DNA is located in the mitochondria and contains 100-1,000 copies per cell.
The structure of nuclear DNA chromosomes is linear with open ends and includes 46 chromosomes containing 3 billion nucleotides.
Mitochondrial DNA chromosomes have closed, circular structures, and contain 16,569 nucleotides.
Nuclear DNA is diploid, inheriting the DNA from both mother and father, while mitochondrial DNA is haploid, coming only from the mother.
The mutation rate for nuclear DNA is less than 0.3% while that of mitochondrial DNA is generally higher.[5]"
"Autosomal DNA is a term used in genetic genealogy to describe DNA which is inherited from the autosomal chromosomes.
An autosome is any of the numbered chromosomes, as opposed to the sex chromosomes.
Humans have 22 pairs of autosomes and one pair of sex chromosomes (the X chromosome and the Y chromosome).
Autosomes are numbered roughly in relation to their sizes.
That is, Chromosome 1 has approximately 2,800 genes, while chromosome 22 has approximately 750 genes.
There is no established abbreviation for autosomal DNA: atDNA (more common) and auDNA are used."
Here's my interpretation: autosomal DNA is a sub-set of Nuclear DNA which consists of all 46 chromosomes including about thee billion base-pairs, also called nucleotides
Does this clarify it for you?
mountainlion: "Also assuming a 50 year generation and 50,000 years the DNA would be so diluted that prehistoric dna of less than several thousand parents would not even show up."
Here's what shows up in DNA analysis of today's humans versus ancient Neanderthals: amongst humans, the differences in our DNA amount to around one-twentieth of one percent of all our three-billion base-pairs, or around 1.5 million base-pair differences.
Between modern humans and Neanderthals, the differences are around .12% or around 3.6 million base-pair differences.
But here's the key finding: some of those Neanderthal differences also show up in some modern human DNA, specifically, non-African humans.
No Africans have these "Neanderthal alleles".
So the suggestion is, interbreeding between humans and Neanderthals, most likely in the Middle East, when modern humans first left Africa to settle the rest of the world.
Does that explain it?
63
posted on
01/30/2015 9:25:40 AM PST
by
BroJoeK
(a little historical perspective.)
To: BroJoeK
Does that explain it?
That pretty much explains things. My experience is in DNA has been in the genealogical area. Most of these articles are long on theory and short on detail. My family tree seems to go back to ancient Troy and I am trying to verify some of it through DNA.
64
posted on
01/30/2015 9:35:07 AM PST
by
mountainlion
(Live well for those that did not make it back.)
To: mountainlion
mountainlion:
"My family tree seems to go back to ancient Troy and I am trying to verify some of it through DNA." The ancient Romans (i.e., Augustus) claimed their ancestors came from Troy, as extolled in Virgil's Aeneid, but to my knowledge, no physical evidence of that has ever been found.
65
posted on
01/30/2015 10:57:51 AM PST
by
BroJoeK
(a little historical perspective.)
To: FBD
Nope, there isn’t. There’s not even any meaning in the separation of Neandertal and us, we’re the same. The Replacement scenario is a body-beautiful/racial superiority model from the 19th century that is going to have to die.
66
posted on
01/30/2015 12:17:47 PM PST
by
SunkenCiv
(Imagine an imaginary menagerie manager imagining managing an imaginary menagerie.)
To: miss marmelstein; SunkenCiv
Hey, miss marmelstein, it is a known fact, chronicled in the Clan of the Cave Bear series, that Broud was hittin’ on Ayla every chance he got.
Proof of the puddling was the birth of Durc who was a half-breed.
There is so much evidence for this interbreeding in the record of that series that you can’t dismiss it out of hand.
67
posted on
01/30/2015 12:46:07 PM PST
by
wildbill
(If you check behind the shower curtain for a murderer, and find one... what's your plan?)
To: wildbill
I only got to Chapter 2 in that book about thirty years ago!
68
posted on
01/30/2015 12:58:55 PM PST
by
miss marmelstein
(Richard the Third: Loyalty Binds Me)
To: SunkenCiv
How many studies do we need to prove ancient humans and Neanderthals were just as horny as we are and they hit on each other??
To: miss marmelstein; SunkenCiv
Well, it was different for a boy.
When I got a look at the cover of that book with Ayla bare—ly covered in fur, I knew that there was more to anthropology than old bones and coprolites.
70
posted on
01/30/2015 1:08:14 PM PST
by
wildbill
(If you check behind the shower curtain for a murderer, and find one... what's your plan?)
To: BroJoeK
I found a link form Charlemagne going back to Troy. I have seen several lines that were completely phony. It would be nice to have a simple proof to either confirm it or denigrate it. I found it interesting that they first said that King Tut was Irish. It was later determined that he was related to half of the males of Europe.
71
posted on
01/30/2015 1:22:39 PM PST
by
mountainlion
(Live well for those that did not make it back.)
To: mountainlion
I doubt if any claims of relationship with ancient Troy are anything other than somebody’s self glorifying propaganda.
That was certainly the case with ancient Rome, and doubly so with any more recent.
So don’t give them any of your hard - earned money!
72
posted on
01/30/2015 3:36:16 PM PST
by
BroJoeK
(a little historical perspective.)
To: SunkenCiv
I’m sure you know this information, but it’s possibly new information to others. The reason for Neanderthals extinction, was ineffective internal heat control. Their bodies overheated.
https://mathildasanthropologyblog.wordpress.com/2008/12/22/neanderthals-could-have-died-out-because-their-bodies-overheated/
Neanderthal DNA reveals key differences from modern humans.
Analysis of DNA obtained from Neanderthal remains has revealed key differences from modern humans that suggest their bodies produced excess heat.
While in the cold climate of an ice age this would have provided the species with an advantage, as the earth warmed they would have been less able to cope. Ultimately this would have caused their extinction around 24,000 years ago.
Scientists at Newcastle University have put forward the theory after examining a particular form of genetic material which was obtained from the fossilised bones of Neanderthals.
By comparing it with that found in modern humans, they discovered that Neanderthals had key differences in the sections responsible for producing energy in all living cells.
Professor Patrick Chinnery, a neurogeneticist at Newcastle University, believes the differences in this mitochondrial DNA could have caused Neanderthals to be inefficient at producing energy, meaning their cells leaked heat.
73
posted on
02/01/2015 9:53:36 AM PST
by
FBD
To: FBD
Thanks FBD! This won't lead anywhere, IMHO -- it's like many such studies, it begins with the bias that the Neandertal went extinct, and tries to find the reason for something that never happened. Not long ago, the claim was that a cold snap killed off Neandertal because CroMagnon was better equipped to cope. It's ridiculous.
74
posted on
02/01/2015 3:16:54 PM PST
by
SunkenCiv
(Imagine an imaginary menagerie manager imagining managing an imaginary menagerie.)
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