Magic mushrooms point to new depression drugs (Hope yet for Reid, Pelosi & Debbie Blabbermouth?)

msnbc.com ^ | 1/23/12 | Reuters

[NormsRevenge]

LONDON — The brains of people tripping on magic mushrooms have given the best picture yet of how psychedelic drugs work and British scientists say the findings suggest such drugs could be used to treat depression.

Two separate studies into the effects of psilocybin, the active ingredient in magic mushrooms, showed that contrary to scientists' expectations, it does not increase but rather suppresses activity in areas of the brain that are also dampened with other anti-depressant treatments.

"Psychedelics are thought of as 'mind-expanding' drugs so it has commonly been assumed that they work by increasing brain activity," said David Nutt of Imperial College London, who gave a briefing about the studies on Monday. "But, surprisingly, we found that psilocybin actually caused activity to decrease in areas that have the densest connections with other areas."

These so-called "hub" regions of the brain are known to play a role in constraining our experience of the world and keeping it orderly, he said.

"We now know that deactivating these regions leads to a state in which the world is experienced as strange."

[hinckley buzzard]

Carlos Casteneda was a fraud. He wrote his books as a lark beginning when he was a student at UCLA, pretending to have been mentored by an old Yaqui Indian in Mexico. He made a lot of hay out of them, including a degree in anthropology(of course). The books are a hoax, fictional. I knew Yaqui Indians in Tucson. They laughed at him. Think Ward Churchill, the mail order boxtop Indian from Colorado. Another bad joke on a university that deserves ridicule.

[Mother Abigail]

Your simple observation reveals the true problem in such research.

After a long lifetime in the field of medicine, it would be nice to assure you that most of my colleagues understand the mind/brain dichotomy - but it is not true.

And, as you wisely point out, when we try to use the brain to understand the mind the framework of reference is limited.

The revelation that decreasing the brains “chatter” would lead to an expansion of the mind, seems both rational and intuitive.

MA

[AnTiw1]

I did magic mushrooms probably a couple dozen times back in the day. In the northwest we used to pick them in cow pastures...boy do some farmers have a fit when you're picking shrooms from their cowflops.

But that was long time ago, and I'm old and don't do things like that anymore.

I'd still like to try peyote some day, though...bucket list ;^)

[wardaddy]

veteran of scores of psylocibin trips in the 70s

they grew almost year round back then and cattlemen didn't yet have fungicide addled feed....

but while they were an interesting mind. expansion sort of organic acid test for me

i must strongly advise against newbies trying such intoxicants without countering agents like xanax in large doses nearby

it is simply too dangerous for flimsy or vulnerable psyche(s)

i have seen folks bug out and change markedly forever

and when that happens....it begs the question what was the point¿

even though there is no question self perception does unfold and one does get a keen....very keen sense of molecular connection and a sense of creation....a higher power...inside all of us

imagine the strongest marijuana one may have smoked multiplied by 100it yet that still falls short in explaining

those who have been there...if any...here..will know

still...despite the education i got from it and in some cases...a certain discipline

i would never wish it on my kids....or on those not seriously prepared

I'm not speaking of dried little caps made inti tea...but rather multiple fresh off the patty caps...purple and golden...

or large Owlsley...who died recently...level ..LSD doses....or real peyote buttons

none of that should ever be consumed by the unprepared

fair warning....and then some. just read about it if you must.....

[wardaddy]

nice post dear

psychedelics are hard to explain except superficially

no question to me they are more than just some fluke like the numbing of alcohol or the hyper well being of cocaine or the hazy euphoria of opiates

the notion they were much much more complex than leisure intoxicants is quite true

still though....very potent....and many a constructed conscience is fragile. ....folks may not know but Whitey Bulgher was a govt sponsored acid tester in prison late 50s

how odd...

[TigersEye]

And, as you wisely point out, when we try to use the brain to understand the mind the framework of reference is limited.

Thank you. One might say the framework is upside down or backwards. Not many would give credence to what we are suggesting so I guess it's only rational and intuitive to those who have given that POV a try.

Truly objective scientific inquiry should automatically take a look at things in ways that defy the status quo though. Just as a matter of experimentation.

[dmz]

The error in that assumption is that brain and mind are not the same thing.

<><><><<

The late 70s philosophy student that still resides in me is forced to ask:

Is electro-chemical activity in the brain the same thing as a thought?

Sorry - couldn’t help myself, but I actually wrote my honors thesis on issues of mind/body dualism (and no, have never taught philosophy, and have never eaten from the public trough - I got a job instead).

[dmz]

I’d still like to try peyote some day, though

<><><><

Not terribly different from magic shrooms, IIRC. Generally mild effects lasting much less time than their chemical cousin.

[ZX12R]

Is electro-chemical activity in the brain the same thing as a thought?

The question for me would be: Which begets the other?

[Jay Santos CP]

I am fully, 100%, certain that Pelosi and Reid are on, and have been using, powerful psychoactive substances, on a doctor's prescription, for years and years.

Not trying to make a joke. They are medicated and they have been making decisions that affect your daily life.

Public officials should be forced to disclose any and all prescription medicine taken by them.

[TigersEye]

I am certainly glad to know that you have made an honest living. LOL ;-)

I can likewise say that I have never taken a dime from another taxpayer in spite of decades of apparent unemployment. :-)

Is electro-chemical activity in the brain the same thing as a thought?

That is the question ... I think. I would say not. To say what thought is is as difficult as to say, exactly, what mind is. To some there is really no difference. Thought is mind.

Where it really gets difficult is when it is suggested that every perception and, more than just perceptions, everything conceptual is mind. But what else is any perception or concept, whatsoever, no matter how much solidity one might attribute to it, other than a thought?

What is the brain then and what does it have to do with mind and thoughts? IMO it is simply an organ whose function is to control the body and serves as a biological interface and filter between mind and the physical body. But not necessarily the sole physical interface.

[TigersEye]

Public officials should be forced to disclose any and all prescription medicine taken by them.

Amen to that! Federal politicians in particular should be required to take regular drug and alcohol tests and psychological evaluations.

[dmz]

I am certainly glad to know that you have made an honest living. LOL ;-)

<><><><><

My advisor lo those many years ago suggested that not all of those who graduated with a degree in philosophy need teach or philosophize for a living. He knew I just wasn’t that deep, nor that into philosophy for philosophy’s sake. I studied it just to get girls. Until I fugured that I misheard the conversation I was eavesdropping on - I should have been a guitar player (although I am and was back then and that never got me girls either).

There is a school of British philosophy (those wacky linquistic philosophers) who suggest that a discussion of mental event (thoughts, feelings, ideas) is simply a discussion about electro chemical processes in the brain. That mind/body dualism is thought to be the case due to the lack of the proper terminology about which to speak of these mental events.

Some who study the philosophy of science are in the same boat, and that our resistance to the notion of monism is that ideas and electro chemical processes just seem different.

My advisor would be so proud right now :-)

[TigersEye]

Maybe you were too deep to make philosophy a career. Every real guy likes girls (and beer) so that's not an indicator. ;^)

I'm not sure what you mean by 'monism.' From the context it sounds like the view that mind and thought are just products of the brain. Not that a scientist should discard that possibility but that view certainly excludes the concept of life after death. It also makes other somewhat common experiences more difficult to explain.

[Pelham]

Keep in mind that Carlos Castaneda invented Don Juan out of whole cloth.

“Don Juan” must have appeared to Carlos among the stacks of the UCLA library since their records show that’s where he was when his books claim he was in the desert eating peyote with the Yaquis. He got his knowledge from reading the accounts of others.

[muawiyah]

I suppose you could eat cactus buds while in the stacks ~

You do know that you don't need to go to Mexico to get peyote. You could simply visit Warren Jeffs FLDS site ~ it's smack dab in the middle of the West Texas peyote range.

But you do make a good point ~ he'd had to have been sitting down to write and the preferred position is the squat (as I have been informed by users on the internet).