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I'm not familiar with Tom Baugh, nor have I been to this website before a friend recently sent this to me. I will further state that I never saw footage of military personnel confiscating private weapons after Katrina. The only footage I saw was of law enforcement personnel doing so. Nevertheless I still think much of what Tom Baugh says is compelling, and I also think much of it applies to law enforcement. Like many, I have a desire to respect and admire our military and law enforcement organizations, and to be grateful for their sacrifices for the life and freedom I've enjoyed. Over the past few decades though, as I've watched the left coil itself in snakelike fashion around our civil institutions, I've had little doubt that they wish to do it with our military and police as well (Pat Schroeder, Tailhook etc.). Politics notwithstanding, I know that soldiers obey orders, and that military and police officers pursuing careers might consider which side their bread is buttered on. Anyway....
1 posted on 07/20/2010 1:18:39 PM PDT by VR-21
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To: Travis McGee; Squantos; SLB; ATLDiver; Joe Brower; archy

Worth reading ping. Maybe even worth a ping list ping.


2 posted on 07/20/2010 1:24:11 PM PDT by FreedomPoster (No Representation without Taxation!)
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To: y'all

Marking this thread.


3 posted on 07/20/2010 1:39:34 PM PDT by Cyber Ninja (Rebuke, Renounce, Repeal, Repeat,...)
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To: VR-21

This has always been the case throughout history. Soldiers and cops will always obey the orders of those in charge except in certain very narrow circumstances and I can only think of two that come to mind.

During WWI the French army told the officers to shove it and rebelled for a few weeks, didn’t kill any of the officers but refused to go into combat. It took the deaths of hundreds of thousands of French soldiers to cause this and it was pretty much obvious to all that their lives were being literally thrown away by the French general staff. After a few weeks the Americans were pouring in as replacement cannon fodder and the French killed the leaders of the mutiny.

The other was the break up of the Soviet Union, the soldiers were given the order to fire on unarmed civilians and they refused. I think it was partly because even the soldiers at that time could see the writing on the wall but even well trained soldiers will have a hard time obeying an order to shoot their own UNARMED countrymen. If those countrymen had been armed it would have been another story, they would have mowed them down without mercy.

Eventually every democracy degenerates into a dictatorship either through popular choice (Venezuela - Chavez), internal usurpation (Rome - Caesar) or external force (Athens). That’s why the founders made the central government weak and did not want a direct democracy. Well Lincoln/FDR changed the first and technology has pretty much changed the second.


4 posted on 07/20/2010 1:53:07 PM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: VR-21

Two points of contention with respect to the article. First, An officer’s oath is to the constitution, not the president, not the flag, not the branch of service, but to the constitution. Second, congress cannot change (amend) the constitution without ratification by 2/3 of the several states.


5 posted on 07/20/2010 1:53:11 PM PDT by Senior Chief (Here I am, right where I left myself.)
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To: VR-21

“Which is why uppity colonels don’t stay colonels for very long. Political appointees, my friends. That vision you have in your head of the noble military protecting your rights is just a dangerous fantasy. A fantasy you have to get rid of right now, before it gets you killed.”

Bravo Sierra. The only way to un-colonel a colonel is through a dismissal adjudged by a court martial or by a grade determination after an involuntary discharge. This guy’s full of crap. I’m not a political appointee, I am appointed by the commander-in-chief (the one holding the office on my commissioning date), not by a particular person.

Colonel ( :-P ), USAFR


9 posted on 07/20/2010 2:21:09 PM PDT by jagusafr ("We hold these truths to be self-evident...")
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To: VR-21
"Congress can change that Constitution any time they like." Not very familiar with the process. To amend it takes 3/4 of the states, I believe.
13 posted on 07/20/2010 2:31:44 PM PDT by Gaffer ("Profiling: The only profile I need is a chalk outline around their dead ass!")
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To: VR-21

Finally, someone with the eyes to see the truth and the guts to tell it.


18 posted on 07/20/2010 2:50:41 PM PDT by B-Chan
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To: VR-21

Why do you think Strategic missile crewmembers carried sidearms when they were locked safely 150 feet underground behind a blast door? Not for their own protection from intruders. If one crewmember refused to follow an authenticated EAM, he might be persuaded to carry out his duty, or vice versa.


20 posted on 07/20/2010 2:57:55 PM PDT by CholeraJoe (I saw Ellen Page bend a Paris street into a cube and it looked as real as the moon landing.)
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To: VR-21
Police and National Guard Disarm Civilians

More Katrina gun confiscation, by the Nat'l Guard, police, sheriff's dept., Coast Guard

22 posted on 07/20/2010 3:16:43 PM PDT by FroedrickVonFreepenstein
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To: VR-21

bookmark


28 posted on 07/20/2010 3:34:48 PM PDT by jonno (Having an opinion is not the same as having the answer...)
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To: VR-21
This says nothing of how the Active Duty and Reserve forces would react to an insurgency along the lines of Iraq.

Many would be gung-ho at first...and many, over varying periods of time would decide to abandon their posts to go home or join the insurgency.

The KEY to such movement would be the insurgency would have to be perceived as as holding the high moral ground.

No women, no kids. Don't damage the means of production/distribution. Focus on the apparatus of government ONLY. Reach out to the cops...allow them to patrol the streets to keep the peace IF they "look the other way".

Punish only the forces of oppression. Win the hearts and minds of the people.

30 posted on 07/20/2010 3:52:48 PM PDT by Mariner (USS Tarawa, VQ3, USS Benjamin Stoddert, NAVCAMS WestPac, 7th Fleet, Navcommsta Puget Sound)
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To: VR-21
In a similar discussion on another forum, I pointed out that THIS IS THE PURPOSE OF OATH KEEPERS.

There are orders we will not obey. I suggest all who are interested visit the Oath Keepers website.

35 posted on 07/20/2010 4:37:15 PM PDT by oneolcop (Lead, Follow or Get the Hell Out of the Way!)
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To: VR-21

I frequently have a fleeting moment where I would like to shoot a Colonel. Only it would not be to save the Constitution, it’s because he is my annoying bossy brother.


67 posted on 07/24/2010 6:40:28 AM PDT by kalee (The offences we give, we write in the dust; Those we take, we engrave in marble. J Huett 1658)
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