The "Center Mass" Myth and Ending a Gunfight

GunsAmerica ^ | 12 February 2010 | Jim Higginbotham

[Erik Latranyi]

Surviving a gunfight isn't what you think it is. Don’t let conventional wisdom get you killed. A well place round to "center mass" in your attacker may not take him out of the fight. Lots of people stay in the fight after "center mass" hits, and some even win it. If you expect to win your gunfight, you have to make sure that you have effectively ended the threat of your attacker. One, two or even several well placed "center mass" shots may not do what you think it will, and learning to recognize this before you gunfight may save your life.

There is a self styled self defense “expert” under every rock, and perhaps two behind every bush, these days. If you have a pet theory on what might work on the street then you can probably find a champion for that idea who actually charges people to teach them that skill. But few of the experts out there have ever been in gunfights, and even fewer have studied real gunfights to see how things really work out when the bullets really fly for blood.

There are more misconceptions out there than I can cover in one article but the one that probably gets to me the most, even over all the caliber wars that rage interminably in the print and cyber media, is the nearly universal acceptance that shooting a miscreant “center mass” with ________(fill in your favorite make, model and caliber) shooting _________ (fill in your favorite ammunition) hyper speed truck killer is practically guaranteed to get the job done.

[mnehring]

pretend that you’re robbing the 7-11

Yep, that's something I think about every day...

[GonzoGOP]

Wow ... seems like the muzzle blast would enter the wound channel and pop the bad guy open like a nasty water balloon.

There is also a picture of a sawed off Lee Enfield. Gives you a 10 round mag and a smoother bold action. But in that case there was no evidence that the thing had ever actually been fired. Apparently the sawed off Mosin Nagant in various flavors was popular with Russian farmers, for what I have no idea. How do you say "Ya All Watch This" is Russian.

[Cuttnhorse]

In a CCW class I took, the VERY experienced instructor cautioned that it is a bit of a myth to assume the bad guys are all lousy shots...in reality they often practice a lot.

[Lazamataz]

How do you say "Ya All Watch This" is Russian.

Все наблюдают это.

[Shooter 2.5]

I’ll post to you since you make a lot of sense.

Center mass is too low according to modern medicine. I lost a lot of points by shooting center mass during an IDPA match where the target were covered by tshirts. IDPA targets have the “A” zone at the sternum. I learned a valuable lesson the easy way.

[rellimpank]

--agreed, but I've never hunted anything dangerous.

--best bullet performance I ever had was on a medium sized buck antelope with a .223 at about 60 yds, full tilt, sideways to me. At the shot, he pinwheeled down and never moved a muscle.Partner and I got there and to our surprise there was no visible wound. ( I knew I hadn't scared him to death.) When we got him open there was a quarter inch section of rib gone with the lung area totally pulped--instant death--

[Hacklehead]

“Center mass is too low according to modern medicine.”

In the 1920s-1950’s center of mass was used to indicate the abdomen. Over the years it moved higher to the chest area. The rationale was to increase the probablity of hitting either the heart or lungs which immediately stops blood flow or fill the lungs with blood respectively.

[El Sordo]

Interesting.

[Still Thinking]

[Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus]

Do you expect that Freepers are most likely to get in a gun battle with the SWAT team?

Oh, c'mon now, you've been on here almost ten years, and you have to ask???

[1COUNTER-MORTER-68]

I read the piece,,,

The writer is incorrect about some things,,,

Size does matter,,,

Ammo type does matter,,,

Shot placement(S) do matter,,,

The Moro Rebellion showed that the .45 cal. was needed to

take out somebody at close range that was going to kill

the US troops,,,

I keep the first 4 in my 1911 loaded with 230gr.HP’s the

last 4 are 230gr. ball ammo,,,3 extra mags of ball,,,

At home my Mossberg is loaded with Flechette rounds,,,

Shoot till the bad guy quits moving,,,

Then put a few more in the head...

[freedumb2003]

>>In a CCW class I took, the VERY experienced instructor cautioned that it is a bit of a myth to assume the bad guys are all lousy shots...in reality they often practice a lot.<<

I think that is the best way stay live — expect him to get you if you miss...

[freedumb2003]

Wow — the American entrepreneurial spirit never fails...

[Pilsner]

Oh, c'mon now, you've been on here almost ten years, and you have to ask???

I usually omit the /sarcasm, when not on Birther threads. But you did say that one's opponents would "most likely" be wearing body armor. That seems to me to be a less than 1/1000 chance.

[Shooter 2.5]

You were fine until the last comment and then you got carried away. You’re not an Oklahoma druggist, are you?

[1COUNTER-MORTER-68]

You were fine until the last comment and then you got carried away. You’re not an Oklahoma druggist, are you?
~~~
Nope,,,

IMHO : If you are in a fight for your life when you put

the bad guy down make damned sure that you Kill him,,,

“No Second Place Winner” is a good read if you can find it.

Bill Jordan gave me some pointers when I was a little kid,,,

Mr.Bill(RIP)told me this himself,,,

J.E.Clark was another one of my teachers,,,

Harold Terry was another,,,

DS Roberts was another,,,(US ARMY),,,

Last/First/Best teacher was my Dad,,,

All were World Class gunfighters/shooters,,,

I lived through the ‘Nam because of those Men,,,(67~68),,,

No we ain’t no “Oklahoma druggist” whatever that is...

[Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus]

I usually omit the /sarcasm, when not on Birther threads. But you did say that one's opponents would "most likely" be wearing body armor. That seems to me to be a less than 1/1000 chance.

Well, I've actually been being a little facetious, especially given certain FReepers' tendencies towards LEOs....however, there does seem to be an uptick over the past few years in crooks who invade homes claiming to be police, and wearing a lot of the gear, including body armour. Not exceedingly common (yet) but becoming more so.

[Joe Brower]

"Engage until the threat ceases to be a threat."

That's it. That's the entire goal that people lose sight of. I had it told to me as "don't stop shooting when you think the bad guy's dead -- you stop shooting when _he_ thinks he's dead".

That principle holds whether you're using a gun, baseball bat, hands and feet, whatever.

[Oztrich Boy]

why the heck did the person who first pushed that on the public think it was in any way either intimidating or effective?

The camera can do a tight closeup and frame both the gun and the actor's face in the same shot.

[1st I.D Vet]

Interesting,

I thought the article was 100% about “it doesn’t matter where you hit them”, and that you still have to have a lucky shot to shut someone down.

The tactical thinking behind the highly expandable rounds (frangible or otherwise) is that soft tissue damage is deep and vastly widespread as compared to simply punching small holes (from FMJ or hollow point) in your attacker.

The concept of the frangible rounds or fragmenting rounds is that as they penetrate shortly below the skin the soft tissue damage is magnified by a huge amount.

Take a look on line and compare what the rounds to do ballistics gel.

The round I could care less about, but I would rather the first couple shots shred instead of poke holes (like standard rounds) and hope one of them hits a vital organ.

of course, just opinion.