Posted on 02/21/2009 6:30:20 PM PST by JoeProBono
In January 2009, I had the distinct pleasure to meet one of the greats of Ufology. Kathleen Marden is the niece of Betty Hill, who was involved with her husband Barney, in a highly publicized abduction on September 20, 1961. The factor that makes this unique is that the abductors brought their victims on board a spaceship, the likes of which defied imagination.
Betty and Barney Hills account is documented in the well written book CAPTURED! The Betty and Barney Hill UFO Experience by Kathy Marden and Ufologist and original Roswell crash researcher, Stanton T. Friedman, MSc, so I will not try to duplicate efforts. Instead, I will refer you to their work for the historical account.
This abduction by alien entities originated several notable firsts. This would become the most publicized alien abduction in history to date, due in part to the amazing level of detail that has become known. This account also benefitted from the believability of Betty and Barney. Never were there two people who shunned the spotlight more than the Hills. The Hills were leaders in their community and well-respected. Betty was a social worker, and both were members of the NAACP. Barney was passionate about his civil rights work, having contributed to the movement as a member of the U.S. Civil Rights Commission in his home state of New Hampshire.
Another first would be the use of hypnosis in the treatment of the Hills to uncover their hidden memories. Contrary to some claims, the Hills did not immediately remember everything that had occurred. The treatment was undertaken by Dr. Benjamin Simon, who was the first to theorize and later prove the validity of hypnotherapy in the treatment of Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder among war veterans. This was not the only factor that made Dr. Simon the perfect person to treat the Hills. Dr. Simon did not believe in the extraterrestrial hypothesis, the belief that some unidentified flying objects are in reality extraterrestrial spacecraft piloted by alien entities, what some derisively refer to as "little green men". By believing there to be another causal factor to their condition, the Hills were not "led" by the doctor into erroneous memory recollections. The introduction of Dr. Simon lent to the validity of the account of abduction by aliens.
oops that should have read Bien Hoa Air Base not Ben Hoa.
So, with the commie poseur-in-chief now in the highest office, he could cause world-wide chaos by merely releasing the ‘free energy’ technology on the world! Great, just what we need, a commie ready to tangle the world in an extra-terrestrial web of chaos.
IMHO, every full fledged physician is a scientist. Nice try though ...
Cheers.
Excellent quotes.
Have them saved on the bottom of my UFO ping list doc.
Thanks.
INDEED.
THX.
True enough.
I AGREE WHOLEHEARTEDLY.
John Mack was certainly a quality scientist.
The map of the stars, which Betty managed to diagram under hypnotic suggestion, was studied in 1974 by an Ohio schoolteacher who was also an amateur astronomer named Marjorie Fish. Ms. Fish spent five years looking for a match to the stars Betty Hill described. The match she found was subsequently challenged by astrophysicist Carl Sagan, he used a sophisticated computer program to compare the star systems and found only a vague connection.
Watch the TV version of Carl Sagan’s Cosmos. (You can probably get it on video at a library.) In it, he thoroughly debunks the Zeta Reticuli business by removing the lines from the “map”. It’s an illusion - if you connect the stars in the real map and the fake one with lines in the same fashion, the similarities between the maps will be exaggerated.
Here’s Carl Sagan debunking the “star map” on youtube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9VLAWxDut0
The Hill case has been thoroughly debunked so many times it’s not even funny. Did you know it took 6 months of “hypnotherapy” for Barney to come around to Betty’s story that he had been abducted?
The Hill’s is a classic case of “recovered memory”, just like other “UFO abductees”, victims of childhood sexual abuse and Satanic Ritual abuse.
Saying you believe in “some” cases of recovered memories like that of UFO abductees is like believing that “some” Magicians are “real” Magicians. Magicians all use the same tricks, just like hypnotherapists.
Recovered memories are totally unreliable and should be given little to no credence, ESPECIALLY when they drift off into the realm of weekly Satanic Rituals and baby killings in your parents basement, daily childhood sexual abuse and orgies for years on end with no conscious memory and being abducted, probed and forced to copulate with aliens.
By that standard, saying that by sheer volume, some of it must be true, then there are a bunch of normal midwestern families who slaughtered infants in Satanic Rituals every Saturday night as their children (some of adult age!) watched, but had no recall until they met a “hypnotherapist”.
There is no credible “science” about the Hill case, you state things about the case that have been explained and debunked. The Hill’s own psychiatrist Dr. Simon believed Betty made it all up and finally convinced Barney that it happened. It took Barney 6 months of “mind mangling” or “hypnotherapy” for him to become a “believer”.
bump for later
It is now accepted as fact by all the better informed researchers in the field that Carl Sagan was a paid government debunker. He had the clearnance, background, training, and evidently salary, to do it.
I always felt that was true before the evidence came out about him—some of it after his death.
I never believed a thing he said.
Cheers.
Did you watch the youtube piece where he explained the “star map”, do you dispute his conclusions? It seemed very straight forward and logical to me, there was nothing extraordinary about Betty’s star map at all. You or I could put dots on a piece of paper and explore the stars for similarities and surely find a constellation MUCH CLOSER to accurate than Betty’s star map.
I’d be interested to see the proof that Sagan was a government debunker, some quotes or something. If it’s just UFOlogists dismissing him as a government shill or debunker, well, you can just call anyone a government shill or paid debunker with whom you don’t agree with. I’m not a govt. shill, lol. I just enjoy getting to the bottom of lots of different phenomenoms.
Recovered memories always stuck in my craw because innocent people went to jail because of them and I did a lot of research about it.
I understand why you find Sagan convincing.
I still consider him a paid government shill.
I gathered there was an intensely emotional and personal thing about ‘repressed’ memories.
It outrages me as well that folks went to jail needlessly.
I googled and couldn’t find any evidence about Carl Sagan being a paid government shill. Personal feelings aside, he showed that Betty Hill had showed nothing extraordinary. It took the amateur astronomer 5 years to find a constellation that “matched” her map, and it didn’t really match at all. I don’t like Obama, but if he says 2 plus 2 equals 4, I will believe him, but only after I verify with a calculator. It doesn’t change that 2 plus 2 equals 4.
It’s not intensely emotional or personal with me about the recovered memories, I would think we would all be outraged that people suffered at the hands of these charlatans. I could only imagine if I had a goofy sister who went to some “hypnotherapist” and told us our parents were slaughtering babies in Satanic rituals. Many people went to jail and had to register as sex offenders because of these “hypnotherapists” I remember when it was all the rage, I even remember a Phil Donahue show about it. I even met a “Dr.” who was still touting the book “The Courage to Heal”, etc. to her patients, you can imagine how that conversation went.
There is no “good way” to get “recovered memories”, whether they pertain to childhood sexual abuse, Satanic Rituals, UFO adbuctions, past life regression, or “re-birthing”. Oprah even did a show on “re-birthing”, to her great shame.
If I run across the Sagan info again, I’ll try to post it and ping you.
Stanton Friedman tended to joust with him a lot. I found Stanton exceedingly more scientific and accurate routinely.
I watched that tele-movie about it while in the hospital years ago. It wasn’t even a mental hospital (I saw that one coming). Anyway, liked it then, in recent years (say, the last five or so) got to see some of it again (rental? library? rebroadcast? Don’t remember) and still found it enjoyable. The real Barney had died (a heart problem) by the time it was made, but Betty lived for quite a while thereafter. Thanks LVD.
:’D
At least you didn’t say “Singing Nun”.
Stanton Friedman tended to joust with him a lot. I found Stanton exceedingly more scientific and accurate routinely.
_________
Well, Stanton also wrote a book about the Hill’s and destroys his credibility with me by believing in “recovered memories”. Surely, in his heart of hearts, being a nuclear physicist and all that he should know to doubt “recovered memories”. Sometimes I wonder what he actually believes, he’s made his living off of UFO’s for a long, long, time now. If you buy “recovered memories” you’ll buy anything.
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