Help me choose a portable MP3/digital audio player

Me

[GB]

She who must be obeyed :) has given me permission to purchase a portable MP3/digital audio player for my upcoming birthday. And I don't want to touch off a debate over the quality of lossy audio codecs like MP3 and WMA or AAC compared to CD audio. MP3s and WMA's serve their purpose, IMHO, which is to let you listen to a bunch of music on a portable player when you're out and about and don't want to haul around a stack of CDs and aren't really interested in whether what you're listening to is CD audio quality or not. When I'm listening at home on my main stereo, in a setting more conducive to being able to distinguish and appreciate good sound quality, I of course have different expectations.

Anyway, I currently have a little item I picked up for $50 on eBay called a Nex iA that uses CF cards and plays MP3 and WMA files, and while it isn't the finest piece of electronic equipment I've ever held in my hands, it has GREAT sound for a cheapo unit playing compressed audio files, it has an equalizer that actually works and even lets you bypass the presets and set the bands yourself.

However, I'd kind of like to upgrade, although I'm not sure yet whether I'd like an upgraded flash player with a gig or so of internal memory instead of the CF cards (that's appealing because my first inclination is not toward something that I could store an entire music collection on, I'm more of a "toss a few hours of music on the thing, push the power button and forget about it and go work in the yard" kind of fellow) or a hard-drive player (the more I think about it, though, it WOULD be intriguing to have that much music at your fingertips).

I've researched the idea backward and forward for the past few weeks, have spent too much time looking at digital audio player forums, review sites, etc., and really can't make a decision because it seems like all of these things, including the ubiquitous iPod, have their strengths and weaknesses.

So, do any of my brother or sister Freepers have any experience with these things, and if so could you give me a little input as to what you're using and how they've done for you?

Right now, if I were to get a hard-drive player, I'm leaning toward the iPod because I actually like the iTunes software and because of the circumstantial evidence at least that Apple's AAC codec gives better sound quality at lower bit rates than MP3s or WMA (FYI, when I make MP3s, I use the LAME encoder set at alt.preset.standard; I've not done much with WMA), or the Dell DJ. The Creative players are interesting, but they seem to be notorious for the headphone jack tearing up about every 48 hours because of a soldering defect that appears to be the rule rather than the exception.

If I were to get a flash player, I'm leaning toward a couple of 1 gig possibilities, a Samsung Yepp and a couple of models by Cowon/iAudio, because they support another compressed audio codec called Ogg Vorbis which supposedly gives even better fidelity, compared to MP3, at lower bit rates than AAC.

If anyone has any experience with these particular units, or can suggest some others, I'd appreciate the help.

[CarrotAndStick]

One more

[CarrotAndStick]

In case the pictures above are not visible:

http://www.akihabaranews.com/en/news_9937.html

[GB]

That's a nice portable setup. I have a couple of CD/MP3 players, a Phillips and a Rio Volt, and I still like the idea of CDs. But from my experience with the little Nex player I mentioned ... which is tiny, 3.1 inches by 2.5 inches by .9 inches ... it's nice to be able to put a whole lot of music on a tiny little thing and stick it in your pocket. I'm using only a 128 MB flash card in mine right now and you can get like 50 songs on that. Very convenient.

[scott says]

I have to admit I have no clue about mp3, so I can't make a informed response. I did check out a link that had files...some were excellent, but some of the shows , I had much better recordings, from the master audience source tapes. It will take time to accumulate a really comprehensive database, but ,yeah, its excellent that such an endeavor is underway...as it should be, : )

[coconutt2000]

You can use AAC and MP3 simultaneously. This means you can encode your music in MP3 using another software suite, and then import the music into your Music Library.

For the longest time I had mixed MP3's and AAC on my iPod. I finally converted it all to AAC, and that was as easy as selecting all my music and telling iTunes to do the conversion.

[coconutt2000]

iPod Shuffle - Supported Audio Formats

MP3 (8 to 320 Kbps), MP3 VBR, AAC (8 to 320 Kbps), Protected AAC (from iTunes Music Store, M4A, M4B, M4P), Audible (formats 2, 3, and 4) and WAV

iPod, iPod Mini, iPod Photo, iPod U2 - Supported Audio Formats

AAC (16 to 320 Kbps), Protected AAC (from iTunes Music Store), MP3 (16 to 320 Kbps), MP3 VBR, Audible (formats 2, 3, and 4), Apple Lossless, WAV, AIFF

[scott says]

Once again, I will admit my ignorance of the mp3/ipod technology...my attitude is QUALITY FIRST, I would rather have a"bulky cd " and player that had excellent audio quality, than a "convenient" little unit that played 100 songs...thats just me, quality/substance over quanity and easy use. If they make these units that DO both, then obviously that is the way to go. I'm sure that will be the case, as the technology unfolds...damn, I'm not even done transferring my cassettes to cd, NOW I have to transfer everything to mp3, or whatever is the next thing?...argh!!!..stop the machine...where is the pause button? lol

[CarrotAndStick]

And that's why I still prefer Audio CDs to MP3s any day. That "clean" sound simply disappears with MP3.

Have you heard of SACDs and Audio DVDs?

[scott says]

Yes, I have...it SOUNDS like you and I are on the same NOTE...from what I have heard, these mp3 little toys just don't have the quality...I'm sure there are some machines that do. But I haven't heard them,you know what? I still prefer the sound of a record album played on my turntable,{Dual,with Moving Coil cartridge stylus} to cds! The digital age is awesome, but somethings are still better in analog.For live,bootleg recording, you can't beat the DAT recorders...I'm not impressed with the"compressed" high volume music files, I'm old school, GIVE ME QUALITY OR GIVE ME DEATH!...s-dog

[CarrotAndStick]

I too am a stickler for high fidelity audio. That's probably why I prefer aural entertainment to visual ones, since almost always audio quality is sacrificed when video is involved. That's probably why I am paranoid about not buying any audio system that can also handle video, since I feel a part of the audio processing capabilities are diverted for video processing.


Anyway, since you mentioned vinyl records, you'll love to know about this. But needs a lot of 'em monies for one of these:

http://www.elpj.com/

ELP Laser Turntable: No Contact, No Wear!! Laser stylus reads record grooves using light, not a needle No groove contact, no record wear Pure analog playback Easy to use Accurate and musical Starting list price: $15,000 US The all-analog ELP Laser Turntable plays records by using nothing more than a laser beam of light. The result is lightning fast transients, life-like harmonics, and a musical honesty that cannot be achieved with a diamond stylus. Play your favorite vinyl or old 78 RPM records as many times as you like, because you will never again worry about record wear. Perfect for record collectors, archivists, or vinyl enthusiasts.

[scott says]

THAT IS IMPRESSIVE! There is still something better with the analog recordings, digital is better for "convenience", but I really do prefer analog recordings.

[CarrotAndStick]

MP3 probably approaches true CD quality at 240 to 320 kbps encoding, but then, owing to the large file sizes at this level of encoding, you're better off with audio CDs.

[CarrotAndStick]

No, the laser pickup player IS analog.

[CarrotAndStick]

Ther's more information here:

http://www.elpj.com/about/how.html

[Spktyr]

iPod + Apple Lossless. Problem solved.

[scott says]

GB...I'm transfering Dead tape now...Long Beach 8-28-81...holy cow. soundboard 3rd gen A+...my mind is melting... : ) on cd, not mp3..give me a shout..s-dog

[Quix]

I don't have experience with the IPOD

I do have with Samsung's approx 1" X 1" X ~2" 1 GIG MP3 device.

And

The Sony MINIDISC player which stores with the condensed formats approximately 12-14 HOURS of music on one mini disc.

I like both the above. Certainly the Samsung is most compact. I haven't seen it recently at Best Buy--only the 512MB versions. But it's very handy and good quality sound.

Have had trouble with various software and music sites getting my play lists together and downloaded as I want. So haven't been using the Samsung until I get that act better together.

I think along with the player, it's critical to have very COMFORTABLE and good quality earphones. I prefer the IN-EAR variety and may have to get ear molds made for mine. I forget the brands I'm using but it's an expensive one and I like it. I think Koss has a tolerable one, too.

FWIW

[Bug]

The combination of the iPod and iTunes is unbeatable. At 51, I don't get excited about new things very often. My iPod mini is one of the coolest things I've ever owned. It's well designed, does what it's supposed to do and does it well, and it's off the charts in the cool factor. It has transformed my long southern California commute and my gym workouts.

[GB]

OOOOH, I want one of those!

[GB]

I'm really with you .... as I said, to me these toys, and that probably is a good word for them, are good for what they do, which is let you take several hours of reasonable quality music on the go without having to drag a CD player around. They serve that one purpose well. They're not designed to produce audophile quality sound. Although they're getting better. As I said, when I encode an MP3, I am very persnickety about it and do it just so, and I think I do OK as far as the quality. Although at a 128 to 192 variable bit rate, which is what I use, you can certainly tell that it's not CD audio.

People are working on it, though. I mentioned the compression codec called Ogg Vorbis which a lot of folks are excited about, supposedly you can get the fidelity of 192, 224, 256 bit rate MP3s at much lower bit rates (i.e., smaller files) with Ogg. The problem is, only a few machines support it right now because it takes more battery power to run it, and a selling point with a lot of folks who buy digital audio players is how long the battery will hold a charge.

Also, I've heard some rumblings through the grapevine, take it for what it's worth, that on official release CDs, the record companies are (a.) already compressing the files a lot more than they used to and (b.) are planning at some point down the road to outright go to MP3s.