Thanks grundle.
Posted on 07/07/2025 11:58:25 AM PDT by grundle
I asked Grok:
Fact check:
Compared to the 1950s, here are some things that are far, far better in 2025:
Average life expectancy.
Square footage of housing per person. Houses today are much bigger, but the number of people in each house is much smaller.
Number of bathrooms per person in each house.
Percentage of homes with air conditioning.
Number of dental cavities for the average 18 year old.
Percentage of the population that is vaccinated against polio and measles.
Percentage of the population that has indoor plumbing.
Percentage of the population that takes a daily shower.
Being able to watch any movie that you want, whenever you want.
Size of average TV screen.
Percentage of the population that owns a color TV.
Percentage of the population that works at a desk inside an air conditioned office, instead of outside in the hot sun doing manual labor.
Every single one of these things is far, far better today than in the 1950s.
(end of my question)
This is Grok’s response:
Below, I’ll fact-check each claim by comparing the 1950s to 2025, using available data and historical context. I’ll aim to be concise while addressing each point thoroughly, citing sources where relevant. All claims will be evaluated for whether they are “far, far better” in 2025 compared to the 1950s.
1. Average Life ExpectancyClaim: Average life expectancy is far better in 2025 than in the 1950s.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Life expectancy at birth in the U.S. was 68.2 years in 1950 (65.6 for males, 71.1 for females).
2025: Life expectancy in 2023 was 78.4 years (75.8 for males, 81.1 for females), with projections suggesting a slight increase or stabilization by 2025.
Analysis: Life expectancy has increased by about 10 years, a significant improvement driven by advances in medical care, vaccines, and public health. However, recent stagnation due to chronic diseases and socioeconomic factors slightly tempers the “far, far better” claim. Still, the increase is substantial.
Verdict: True, life expectancy is significantly better in 2025.
2. Square Footage of Housing per PersonClaim: Houses are much bigger, with fewer people per house, leading to more square footage per person in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: In 1950, the average new single-family home was ~1,000–1,200 square feet, with an average household size of ~3.37 people, yielding ~300–350 square feet per person.
2025: In 2015, the average new home was 2,687 square feet, with a median of 2,467 square feet, and household size dropped to 2.54. This results in ~971–1,058 square feet per person. Recent data suggests a slight decline in home size (e.g., 2,386 square feet median in 2018), but the trend of larger homes persists.
Analysis: Square footage per person has nearly tripled due to larger homes and smaller households, strongly supporting the claim.
Verdict: True, square footage per person is far better in 2025.
3. Number of Bathrooms per Person in Each HouseClaim: Number of bathrooms per person is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Data is sparse, but homes typically had 1–1.5 bathrooms, with an average household size of ~3.37, yielding ~0.3–0.4 bathrooms per person. Many homes, especially older or rural ones, lacked full bathrooms.
2025: Modern homes often have 2–3 bathrooms, with new homes in 2015 averaging ~2.5 bathrooms for a household size of 2.54, yielding ~1 bathroom per person.
Analysis: The increase from ~0.3 to ~1 bathroom per person is a clear improvement, driven by larger homes and modern design standards.
Verdict: True, bathrooms per person are far better in 2025.
4. Percentage of Homes with Air ConditioningClaim: Percentage of homes with air conditioning is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: In the 1950s, air conditioning was a luxury; fewer than 10% of homes had it, with ~50% of new homes by the mid-1970s having AC.
2025: By 2015, 93% of new homes had central air conditioning, and ~87% of all U.S. households had some form of AC (central or window units) by 2020. This percentage likely increased slightly by 2025.
Analysis: The rise from <10% to ~90% is a dramatic improvement, making this claim accurate.
Verdict: True, the percentage of homes with air conditioning is far better in 2025.
5. Number of Dental Cavities for the Average 18-Year-OldClaim: Number of dental cavities for the average 18-year-old is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Limited data exists, but dental care was less advanced, with minimal fluoridation and poorer oral hygiene practices. Studies suggest 18-year-olds had ~4–7 cavities on average, with higher rates of untreated decay.
2025: By 2011–2016, CDC data showed ~1.5–2 cavities (decayed, missing, or filled teeth) for adolescents aged 12–19, with fluoridated water, better dental care, and sealants reducing decay rates. This trend likely holds or improved slightly by 2025.
Analysis: A reduction from ~4–7 to ~1.5–2 cavities is a significant improvement, supporting the claim.
Verdict: True, dental cavities for 18-year-olds are far better in 2025.
6. Percentage of the Population Vaccinated Against Polio and MeaslesClaim: Percentage of the population vaccinated against polio and measles is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Polio vaccine was introduced in 1955, with ~50% of children vaccinated by the late 1950s. Measles vaccine wasn’t available until 1963, so 0% were vaccinated in the 1950s.
2025: By 2020, ~93% of U.S. children (19–35 months) were vaccinated against polio, and ~92% against measles (MMR). Adult vaccination rates are lower but still significant. Rates may have slightly declined due to vaccine hesitancy but remain high.
Analysis: The jump from ~50% (polio) and 0% (measles) to ~92–93% is a massive improvement.
Verdict: True, vaccination rates for polio and measles are far better in 2025.
7. Percentage of the Population with Indoor PlumbingClaim: Percentage with indoor plumbing is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: In 1950, ~85% of U.S. homes had indoor plumbing, with rural areas lagging (some as low as 50%).
2025: By 2020, >99% of U.S. homes had indoor plumbing, with near-universal access in urban and rural areas.
Analysis: The increase from ~85% to >99% is significant, though the 1950s baseline was already relatively high.
Verdict: True, but the “far, far better” claim is slightly exaggerated due to the high baseline in the 1950s.
8. Percentage of the Population that Takes a Daily ShowerClaim: Percentage taking a daily shower is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Limited data, but daily showering was less common due to fewer bathrooms, cultural norms (weekly baths common), and water access issues in rural areas. Estimates suggest ~20–30% showered daily.
2025: Surveys (e.g., 2020 YouGov) indicate ~60–70% of Americans shower daily, driven by more bathrooms, better plumbing, and changing hygiene norms.
Analysis: The increase from ~20–30% to ~60–70% is notable, supporting the claim, though cultural factors influence showering habits.
Verdict: True, daily showering is significantly better in 2025.
9. Being Able to Watch Any Movie Whenever You WantClaim: Ability to watch any movie whenever you want is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Movie access was limited to theaters, with ~4–5 billion annual theater admissions. Home viewing was rare, with no VCRs or streaming.
2025: Streaming services (Netflix, Disney+, etc.) allow instant access to millions of movies. Over 80% of U.S. households have streaming subscriptions, and physical media (DVDs, Blu-rays) are widely available.
Analysis: The shift from theater-only to on-demand streaming is a revolutionary improvement.
Verdict: True, movie-watching availability is far better in 2025.
10. Size of Average TV ScreenClaim: Size of the average TV screen is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: TVs were ~12–20 inches (diagonal), with small, bulky CRT screens.
2025: Average TV screen size is ~50–55 inches, with some households having 65–85-inch screens, driven by affordable flat-screen technology.
Analysis: The increase from ~12–20 inches to ~50–55 inches is a dramatic improvement in size and quality.
Verdict: True, TV screen size is far better in 2025.
11. Percentage of the Population that Owns a Color TVClaim: Percentage owning a color TV is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: Color TVs were introduced in 1954, but only ~1% of households had them by 1959 due to high costs.
2025: Virtually 100% of TV-owning households (~95% of all households) have color TVs, with modern TVs exclusively in color.
Analysis: The rise from ~1% to ~95% is a clear improvement.
Verdict: True, color TV ownership is far better in 2025.
12. Percentage of the Population Working in Air-Conditioned OfficesClaim: Percentage working at desks in air-conditioned offices, rather than manual labor in the sun, is far better in 2025.
Fact-Check:
1950s: ~30% of jobs were in manufacturing, agriculture, or construction, often outdoors or in non-air-conditioned spaces. Office jobs were ~15–20%, with limited AC (est. <20% of offices).
2025: ~80% of jobs are in service or office-based sectors, with >90% of offices air-conditioned. Manual labor jobs are <10% of the workforce.
Analysis: The shift to office work and near-universal office AC strongly supports the claim.
Verdict: True, the percentage working in air-conditioned offices is far better in 2025.
Summary
All claims are true, with most showing dramatic improvements that justify the “far, far better” description. The only slight caveat is indoor plumbing, where the 1950s baseline (~85%) was already high, making the improvement to >99% significant but less “far, far” than others. Advances in healthcare, housing, technology, and work conditions have driven these changes, though socioeconomic disparities and recent health trends (e.g., obesity) warrant consideration.
If you’d like further details or specific data for any point, let me know!
(end of Grok’s response)
Lots of crap that we’re not really better off having more of.
Anyone with a pulse could have provided the right answer.
I was watching The Crown, and noted how pathetic things were generally and medically for George 6, as he was dying in 1952. Billions have it better today than he did, once you look past the power hierarchy malarkey.
Yep, lots of crap we really dont need. Now do % of blacks that are killed by other blacks, black crime rate, black babies born to single mothers, illegal drug use, alcoholic percentage and percentage of teens with fluorescent hair bashing art with hammers..
Saw a meme somewhere yesterday, in the 1950s a man could have a house, a car a stay at home mom and four kids on a Detroit assembly line salary.
Thanks grundle.
I would like to see if the following has become far worse today vs the 1950s
1. Average cost of state and federal taxes as a percentage of median salary.
2. Likely hood of becoming a victim of theft or violent crime.
3. Median age.
4. Average daily commute time.
5. Cost of median home as a percentage of median salary.
6. Percentage of single parent households.
7. Average K-12 teacher/student ratio .
8. Percentage of High school students who graduate.
9 Percentage of college students who graduate.
10. Cost of a four year degree as a percentage of median salary.
Add percentage of middle class households that have only one wage earner then vs now
I swear the more people use LLMs the lazier and less interesting they become.
True. A skilled UAW worker is about an $80k job. You need about $200k to support a family of four and a house in Michigan comfortably.
You can have all those things at that salary, if you want them.
Most seem not to.
What are you people spending your money on?
Sure, the 10 additional life-span years are good.
A lot of the rest of it? Not so much.
People smoked back then, and today they hardly do. That is another positive point. In fact, if you watch older movies, they are all smoking and drinking. Maybe hospitality was different back then, and you offer a smoke and drink to anybody who walks into your office.
Not everything is better today. Kids growing up in the 1950s knew who our first president was, what the flag symbolizes, and could walk to school, play outside and dive into swimming pools off of diving boards, which have all but vanished from America in 2025.
Homes may have more square footage today, but backyards are vanishing. And more and more people are living in “stack and pack” apartments and condos.
And on the cultural front, popular music today is unlistenable and perversity and wokeness pervade literature, movies and TV shows.
We have, indeed, seen progress, but progress doesn’t always mean that things get better.
That’s why lifespans in wealthy white/Asin/Hispanic suburbs tend to be a good bit longer.
ask the right question, get the right answer
The number one song in the USA today...this is the chorus:
I think you know what this is
I think you wanna, uh
No, you ain′t got no Mrs.
Oh, but you got a sports car
We can uh-uh in it
While you drive it real far
Yeah, you know what this is
Yeah, you know what this is
I rest my case.
California, where I live, was the hottest economy in the world during the 1950s. For most of the decade, we had Republican governors, (although Earl “Rabbit” Warren and Goody Knight were RINOs) and three Republican US Senators (One, Tom Kuchel, was a RINO, but Richard Nixon and Bill Knowland were good) and Republican mayors in San Francisco and LA.
Today, we have the highest taxes, highest gas prices, the worst roads, and the largest homeless population in the US.
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