Posted on 11/28/2021 1:50:53 AM PST by House Atreides
Today I’d like to take a look at a shooting out of Lubbock TX that is suddenly getting a great deal of news and social media coverage—the shooting death of Chad Read by William Carruth.
As is so often the case, there is, unfortunately, a lot of confusion about how to understand the use-of-force legal issues in this case, with a great deal of misunderstanding of both the relevant law and how it should reasonably apply to the facts of this case. In addition, there’s a great deal of weight being put on factors that are, really, irrelevant to a proper use-of-force legal analysis.
So, hopefully, we can bring some clarity of understanding to this event, at least in the use-of-force law context.
OVERVIEW OF THE FACTS & VIDEO First, a quick overview of the facts of the Chad Read shooting. It appears that Read was upset because his ex-wife, at the Carruth home, had failed to deliver their son to Read for his scheduled custody transfer. While in the front yard, and later front porch, of the Carruth home, Read shouted and postured angrily at his ex-wife. Carruth ordered the angry Read off his property, a command with which Read declined to comply.
Carruth entered his home and emerged a moment later back onto the front porch carrying a carbine (a pistol-caliber long gun), presumably to attempt to compel Read to comply with his command to leave the property….
…Given that everything discussed in this analysis is based on … two videos, I’ll embed them right here, so as to avoid confusion as to what I’ll be referring to….”
(Excerpt) Read more at legalinsurrection.com ...
It's not up to the Lubbock Police to decide. Texas Attorney General's Office is handling any potential prosecution.
I have changed my opinion from righteous shoot to guilty.
At first I didn’t realize the 10 ft separation had occurred. I don’t know if the first time I saw the video that it didn’t show that or I looked down at my keyboard and missed it.
He just plain killed the guy. Sorry, but he did.
I would recommend watching Branca’s video. He explains the castle doctrine in detail and why it is not applicable in this case.
Regardless of what anyone here thinks, there is one very definite lesson in this story.
Self defense laws are very tricky. They have multiple traps for those who are Rambo dreamers.
If you read the lawyer’s detailed description of this event, you will see that during the event there were multiple times when the shooter was clearly entitled to shoot and multiple times when the situation changed and he was not entitled....
It does go back to the basics and they are that you can not successfully claim self defense unless the danger is imminent and the bad guy is able to kill or injure at that moment.
One point the lawyer overlooked in his write up is that this disagreement had gone on long enough that it was clear to everyone that the victim was not armed. The author did make it clear that the victim was more than arm’s length from the shooter.
Therefore at that exact instant there was no danger of death or injury.
The shooter is guilty of manslaughter. Although the victim was an asshole that deserved to be killed, the shooter picked the wrong time to do it.
The law does not allow you to pick a time convenient to you.
If you try to grab a cops gun and then advance on him he will shoot you. It would be a legal shoot.
I never shot anybody when I was trying to pick up my children for “visitation” (children never “visit” their father when they are minors), and I never got shot, either - but the emotions involved here are instantly understandable to anyone who has ever had to retrieve their children who are being unlawfully detained.
That having been said, I have two questions that I don’t see from the articles I have read (although commenters seem to know the answers):
1) Constant referral to the mother as Reid’s “ex-wife”. Media does this ALL THE TIME. The day after a woman shacks up with Teddy down the block does not make her a man’s “ex-wife”. The fact that they are separated (if they even are) does not make her his “ex-wife”. Question One: Were they in fact divorced legally?
2) Lots of commenters refer to the shooter as “her boyfriend”. Is that an actual fact? The maybe-maybe not “ex-wife” in the home of a man who then kills her maybe-maybe not ex-husband and the man is also her boyfriend? His burden of proof just went through the roof, maybe especially in Texas.
If Carruth was conspiring with the mother to illegally interfere with the children’s right to their father, then as far as I’m concerned, he should hang. And I’m 28 years after my event, and mostly better about things.
They’ll do the same. And if they don’t, good luck with the jury sparky. He went on another man’s property and started acting hostile to his woman. Then grabbed at his gun.
West Texas in da house.
Read the article. He shot the man ten feet away who was not a threat.
What does it say when a man is on your property refuses to leave, threating voidance and repeatedly tries to take your weapon?
Amen to all
Reasonable posts
I’m often puzzled or dismayed how so many posters think killing an unarmed man is so easily justified
“I was afraid”
“They were in my yard”
“The pushed me”
“They we’re bigger”
I was raised in Jackson Mississippi born 1957 and lived in Dallas till first grade.
That was just not how we were taught, you either fought or you ran or you cal the cops ..I realize they’re limits to such actions...at times ...
However...I had a man ....from Texas.....Houston....tell me a scared man with a gun will shoot you quick
I don’t know if castle applies or not but it’s interesting to see tha law application evolves
Philosophically and morally it’s a bad kill to me and yes the wife bears responsibility too
Legally we’ll see....
Victim: Chad Read.
Phone recorder woman in car: Jennifer Read, married to Chad Read prior to his death. 'I have it on video' quote
Shooter: William “Kyle” Carruth, boyfriend of Christina Read.
Ex wife: Christina Read, Ex wife of Chad Read, mother of his children and girlfriend of Carruth.
Estranged wife of Carruth: State District Judge Ann-Marie Carruth[Not there or in video]
“She sounds like trash, who withheld her child seeing his father.”
She thinks only the father has to follow the court ordered visitation order. The court-ordered visitation rules don’t apply to her highness. Blatant setup.
The thing to do is call the sheriff and document her refusal. Show a pattern of disregard for the visitation order and the children’s relationship with their father.
This whole ‘it’s just a bar fight at the house’ mentality is moronic. She denied his time with his son. She knew it would set him off. Then puts her squeeze into it to block him from his kids enraging him even more. Then has him killed so she can collect his life insurance payout to the two kids being their executor.
I was leaning toward guilty of manslaughter before reading this article. Now I am more inclined toward innocence.
First, I think the author’s Tueller Drill analysis is garbage. The 21 feet is the dustance required to respond to an attack. At twenty feet you get stabbed. At 22 feet you get off a shot. That does not guarantee that at 22 feet you successfully stop the attack.
At 3 feet a large attacker may sustain wounds and then take your gun and kill you with it. I think one of the bad guys in the FBI Miami shootout may have been hit 11 times and was still shooting. You can’t just take the Tueller Drill numbers and scale them the way the author did.
The author allows that just a simple shift of weight on the part of the dead man could have justified the shooting. If I was on the jury there is no way I would convict based on whether the shooter perceived such a shift of weight. If the article represents the prosecutions case, I now lean toward innocence. In my mind people don’t have to be perfect in cases like this. It is just not reasonable.
Sure, 'cause that always works...
That was only true, I think, if the shot man did not shift his weight.
Consider also that the author grants that just prior to the shooting, deadly force would have been justified. Put yourself into such a scenario. How much might your judgment be affected by having just experienced a situation in which you would have been fully justified in killing someone. The ex husband created this deadly situation and paid a price for it.
We could very easily be discussing a death caused by the ex husband taking the rifle and killing the resident if the altercation had continued without the shooting that occurred.
Similar to the Rittenhouse case we are seeing more people who believe that they need not fear armed self-defense.
Single mothers are the absolute worst type of person a man should ever have a friendship with. Right next to a fbi plant.
And really the relationship status is irrelevant - there was obviously a custody arrangement and it appears the wife had not met that, but speculating about any of this is just that - speculation.
Read seems to have felt like it was ok to “go off” on the whole thing. He was aggressive and confrontational, ignored orders to leave the property, and in grabbing the weapon did in fact attack Carruth.
Read should have just left and let Child Services handle the issue, instead deciding to “handle” this himself. Carruth gave him ample time and warning to do so. And if he felt the child was in danger then call DPS, however that did not appear to be an issue.
All that said Curruth is looking at manslaughter at a minimum.
I'm sorry you had to go through what you did, and after all this time it still affects you. I never had children so I haven't a metric to understand your feelings. But I have in-laws and close friends who went through this stuff and watched the children suffer the most.
Best to you Jim Noble.
Does the law require a homeowner to submit to an intruder/assailant without end?
Not in MO, and I hope certainly not in TX.
I think if this occurred on the street, where both men may have had a lawful right be and neither yielded, it would be more difficult, but this once again, is private property being occupied by a dangerous antagonist who may have had no lawful right to be there after being told to depart.
Read shoulda moved off and awaited the police. He died on the other dude’s front porch. Not sure how much more “invasive and obtrusive” one can be.
We shall see.
“What does it say when a man is on your property refuses to leave, threating voidance and repeatedly tries to take your weapon?”
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That he’s law enforcement in a leftist blue county/state?
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