Posted on 08/28/2020 5:49:22 AM PDT by grundle
Sure, your Saiga is awesome, but how many of those are out there, compared to the Remington 870 or Mossberg 500/590?
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I’m familiar with Saigas, I have a Saiga AK.
But I have a 5 shot pump and if the mob didn’t back off after 5 rounds I’d be in trouble. I can’t reload a pump that fast.
I can, however, swap 30 round mags out of my AK pretty fast
A surprising number and increasing as they’re now being made in the US. Chinese copies of them are going for about $400, too.
Sure, if all you can afford or get is a pump gun, well, it is what it is. But if you have the time and money to lay in stuff ahead of time, you can avoid a lot of problems that you can have with pump guns by getting a semiauto.
Worth noting that the US military is replacing their pump guns with Benellis to eliminate operator-induced error under stress.
Berserk crowds have a life beyond those of the individual members. No rationality. I would not like to be equipped with nothing more than a handgun of any caliber under those circumstances.
We are discussing mobs of irrational people that are out of control. Not 2 or 3 angry people who still have a sense of self preservation.
That man who kept running back and forth into the police pepper spray repeatedly is an example of someone who has lost the capability of rational thinking. Turn him into a crowd of the same & you have a very scary situation.
As noted in my other posts, I don’t really consider a pump gun that adequate for these situations, and you’ve touched on the biggest problem with them other than short-stroking.
I would also point out that Jeff Cooper’s ‘social work’ was mostly aimed at the more common home invader/burglar team/gang crew sort of thing and less ‘mass mob defense’. A pump is better than showing up with granpappy’s old over/under or side by side Fudd gun, sure, but once you’ve got more than five or eight assailants, you have problems. In these scenarios, you’re looking at 20+.
Kel tec ksg 25 or ksg couple that with kel tec’s RDB slung over the other shoulder...well, we don need no stinking badges!
Kel Tec KSG 25.
Unfortunately, that’s not so. There is the phenomenon of auditory exclusion. Then too there is the issue that the shots don’t register unless someone next to them or they themselves see something that ties to it. Mobs are actually collectively dumber than any one individual; large enraged ones do not respond to warning shots or even to some of their members being mowed down by shots. You have to kill or disable a certain percentage of their members, visibly, before the mob starts to waver and rethink.
Look into the psychology of human wave attacks; that particular disturbing phenomenon absolutely applies here.
Unfortunately, it’s unreliable and has all the usual pump shotgun problems. Plus if your pump hand slips it ends up in front of the muzzle. It also isn’t possible to visually clear the chamber in more relaxed times.
I have been working on my own firearms with my father since 12 years old, as soon as i get one, it will be reliable.
On the subject of shotguns, I’ve noticed that there are very few available right now in the self defense category.
Still plenty of the more costly long barreled hunting shotguns.
I bought my pump for home defense. Further out I will stick with the semi auto AK and AR.
I do have some rifled slugs, which are pretty awesome, but I doubt that I am skilled enough to hit an attacker from 50 yards out with that gun.
Good luck with that, there are people still trying to get the original KSGs reliable - sometimes the only fix is to get the factory to replace the whole thing.
I will say this, if i were to protect property during a riot, i want two weapons many reloads, and a wing man who is trust worthy.
Preferably two companions at a minimum, yes.
He should have had a mini-gun.
Sure looked like the ZOMBIE Apocalypse to me.
I mean who in their right mind advances UNARMED on
someone with an AR?
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