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Archaeologists Discover Ancient Church-(heh JC and Armagedon... are we having fun?)
ap ^ | 11.7.05 | na

Posted on 11/05/2005 9:26:41 PM PST by Flavius

JERUSALEM - Israeli archaeologists on Saturday said they have discovered what may be the oldest Christian church in the Holy Land on the grounds of a prison near the biblical site of Armageddon. ADVERTISEMENT

The Israeli Antiquities Authority said the ruins are believed to date back to the third or fourth centuries, and include references to Jesus and images of fish, an ancient Christian symbol.

"This is a very ancient structure, maybe the oldest in our area," said Yotam Tepper, the head archaeologist on the dig.

The dig took place over the past 18 months at the Megiddo prison in northern Israel, with the most significant discoveries taking place in the past two weeks, Tepper said. Scholars believe Megiddo to be the New Testament's Armageddon, the site of a final war between good and evil.

Tepper said the discovery could shed new light on an important period of Christianity, which was banned by the Romans until the fourth century.

"Normally we have from this period in our region historical evidence from literature, not archaeological evidence," he said. "There is no structure you can compare it to, it is a very unique find."

Channel Two television, which broke the story Saturday evening, broadcast pictures of a detailed and well-preserved mosaic bearing the name of Jesus Christ in ancient Greek and images of fish.

Pietro Sambi, the Vatican's ambassador to Israel, praised the find as a "great discovery."

"Of course, all the Christians are convinced of the history of Jesus Christ," he told Channel Two. "But is it extremely important to have archaeological proof of a church dedicated to him? Certainly."

Joe Zias, an anthropologist and a former curator with the Israeli Antiquities Authorities, said the discovery was significant but unlikely to be the world's oldest church. He said there were no churches until Emperor Constantine legalized Christianity in the fourth century.

"The earliest it could be is fourth century and we have other fourth-century churches. I think what is important here is the size, the inscription and the mosaics," he said. "I think it is an important find as far as early Christianity but I wouldn't say it was the oldest church in the world."

The Antiquities Authority said more than 60 prison inmates took part in the dig in recent months. Channel Two said there is speculation that Israel may move the prison and open a tourist attraction in its place.

"If it's between a prison and a church, I would like a church," Zias said. "You can put a prison anywhere."

Israeli Tourism Minister Avraham Hirshzon said the discovery could greatly increase tourism to Israel.

"If we nurture this properly, then certainly there will be a large stream of tourists who could come to Israel. There is great potential and together with the evangelical center in the north could bring great strides in tourism," he told Channel Two.


TOPICS: Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: archaeology; christianity; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; history; israel
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To: NYer

Handy dandy list thanks!


41 posted on 11/07/2005 7:44:36 AM PST by FourtySeven (47)
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To: Iscool
Jesus said:
Mat 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

Jesus is condemning the hypocrisy of the Pharisees. He is saying that they desire the titles of respect for their own purposes, not for the glory of God; which is certainly wrong. He is not categorically condemning the use of titles of respect, but rather the misuse of them for one’s self interests.

If you disagree, then I ask you the following questions:

1) What do you call your male parent?

2) The passage in question also says not to call anyone teacher. Have you ever called anyone teacher?

3) In searching the New Testament, I came across numerous examples of New Testament authors calling human beings fathers. How do you explain this?

Here is a truncated list of some examples:

  1. Matthew Chapter 1 – Men are called "father" so many times that I quit counting.

  2. Romans 4:1-18 – St. Paul calls Abraham our father no less than eight times. In fact, the name Abraham means "father of the multitude."

  3. Romans 9:10 – Isaac is called our father

  4. 1 Corinthians 4:15 – St. Paul calls himself a father to the Corinthians.

  5. 1 Corinthians 10:1

  6. Galatians 1:14

  7. Ephesians 5:31 and 6:4

  8. Philippians 2:22 – St. Paul calls himself a father to Timothy

  9. Colossians 3:21

  10. 1 Thessalonians. 2:11

  11. 1 Timothy 5:1

  12. 2 Timothy 1:3

  13. Hebrews 1:1, 3:9 and 12:9

I could continue multiplying verses, but I think I’ve already become redundant. The point again is that our earthly "fathers" in the faith are not an end in themselves – like gurus – but that they are representations (albeit sometimes poor ones) of our heavenly Father; as St. Paul says in Ephesians 3:14-15 "For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named." The Catholic practice is, and always has been, the same as the early Church (Catholic Church) that St. Paul is called "father" in those passages because he is a spiritual father. Priests are called "father" because they, like St. Paul, are spiritual fathers.

Source: Catholic Bible

42 posted on 11/07/2005 8:28:06 AM PST by NYer (“Socialism is the religion people get when they lose their religion")
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To: NYer

Indeed!


43 posted on 11/07/2005 12:50:05 PM PST by afraidfortherepublic
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To: NYer
I have gone to Greg Laurie's church for twenty-five years. It is not a denomination, but practices New Testament Christianity—that is, the Church founded by Jesus Christ, the only mediator between God and man.

So this list is a little off, because I'm certainly not Catholic.

44 posted on 11/07/2005 7:59:28 PM PST by Salem (FREE REPUBLIC - Fighting to win within the Arena of the War of Ideas! So get in the fight!)
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To: Flavius; SJackson; yonif; Simcha7; American in Israel; Slings and Arrows; judicial meanz; ...
This made the front page of our local paper today.










If you'd like to be on or off this
Christian Supporters of Israel ping list,
please FR mail me ~
  -  -
MikeFromFR ~
There failed not ought of any good thing which the LORD had
spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass. (Joshua 21:45)

Letter To The President In Support Of Israel ~
'Final Solution,' Phase 2 ~
Warnings ~



The future of Arab controlled Gaza.

"Palestine is the wrong name for their State. It should be called Anarchy."—FReeper sgtbono2002
"Then let's wait and see what the Arabs do after they take Gaza. There's nothing like Arab reality to break up a Jewish fantasy."—FReeper Noachian
A student told his professor he was going to "Palestine" to "fight for freedom, peace and justice,"—Orwellian leftist code words that mean "murder Jews."
The Nature Of Bruce ~

45 posted on 11/07/2005 8:00:51 PM PST by Salem (FREE REPUBLIC - Fighting to win within the Arena of the War of Ideas! So get in the fight!)
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To: NYer

A typo in your list, NYer. The Anglican Church was started by King Henry VIII (not VII as the list shows), as you surely remember, in response to the refusal of the Pope to grant an annulment to Henry's marriage to Catherine of Aragon.


46 posted on 11/07/2005 8:22:04 PM PST by Ciexyz (Let us always remember, the Lord is in control.)
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To: Salem

An Israeli tourist agent's dream: Come visit the church nearest the battlefield of Armageddon. Apocalypse Now, indeed!


47 posted on 11/07/2005 8:27:09 PM PST by Ciexyz (Let us always remember, the Lord is in control.)
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To: Unam Sanctam
"Is there a translation of the mosaic inscription anywhere?"

Yeah. It says "All your floor tiles are belong to us."

48 posted on 11/07/2005 8:30:51 PM PST by Rokke
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To: Salem
"So this list is a little off, because I'm certainly not Catholic."

Sure it is a little off. But it makes some people feel better if they can claim to be "the first". Interestingly, the Mormon church also claims it is the only "true" Christian church that can trace its origins to the church Christ founded. It is a silly competition that reveals a sense of insecurity rather than demonstrating evidence of purity.

49 posted on 11/07/2005 9:05:43 PM PST by Rokke
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To: Rokke
  !
50 posted on 11/07/2005 9:08:44 PM PST by Salem (FREE REPUBLIC - Fighting to win within the Arena of the War of Ideas! So get in the fight!)
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To: Iscool
That's pretty lame...

An apt description for linguistic literalists like yourself.

51 posted on 11/10/2005 12:21:56 PM PST by A.A. Cunningham
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52 posted on 02/22/2016 9:48:46 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Here's to the day the forensics people scrape what's left of Putin off the ceiling of his limo.)
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
Middle East and terrorism, occasional political and Jewish issues Ping List. High Volume

If you'd like to be on or off, please FR mail me.

..................

Related threads

Israeli Archaeologists Discover Roman-era Christian Building

53 posted on 02/23/2016 5:06:41 AM PST by SJackson (What I’m watching in him (O), is uncertainty...a leader doesn’t gMiddive sh*t...he gets it)
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To: Iscool

Catholicism dates back to the first century. That is to say, The existence of an apostolic church consisting of local congregations. The idea of a great apostasy at the time the Constantine liberated the Christian churches, or by convening the Nicene Council comes from the Reformation period as a means of opposing Roman authority. If Constantine’s government, and the government of his son ever acted to impose Church authority on dissidents, it was at the behest of his Arian and semi-arian bishops to suppress the trinitarian doctrines of that Council.


54 posted on 02/23/2016 10:31:16 AM PST by RobbyS (What about the size of the national debt?)
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To: Iscool

Well, then I guess i have been wrongly named, because my four kinds call me Farther. Seriously, doesn’t Paul call himself Timothy’s father in Christ?


55 posted on 02/23/2016 10:34:52 AM PST by RobbyS (What about the size of the national debt?)
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To: Rokke

Some have better historical claims than others. Joseph Smith made his claim based on some tablets he says he found buried in New York State. This was in the 19th century.


56 posted on 02/23/2016 10:39:15 AM PST by RobbyS (What about the size of the national debt?)
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To: x5452
I think at best we can pray they abandon their religion of hate.

Love your enemies. Pray for those who persecute you.

I pray for their repentance and conversion.

If that doesn't happen, I will defend myself and my community with lethal force if necessary.

57 posted on 02/23/2016 10:43:24 AM PST by NorthMountain (A plague o' both your houses.)
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To: SJackson

The Romans did not actually ban Christianity. Rather its actions were like that of the Soviet Union, which restricted its actions/officially persecuted it. It actually thrived under Diocletian’s restoration of order. Then WHAM, the Great Persecution, which came close to destroying the Church in the eastern part of the Empire.


58 posted on 02/23/2016 10:45:17 AM PST by RobbyS (What about the size of the national debt?)
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To: SJackson

The Romans did not actually ban Christianity. Rather its actions were like that of the Soviet Union, which restricted its actions/officially persecuted it. It actually thrived under Diocletian’s restoration of order. Then WHAM, the Great Persecution, which came close to destroying the Church in the eastern part of the Empire.


59 posted on 02/23/2016 10:45:18 AM PST by RobbyS (What about the size of the national debt?)
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To: RobbyS
Well, then I guess i have been wrongly named, because my four kinds call me Farther. Seriously, doesn't Paul call himself Timothy’s father in Christ?

Being a father or acting as a father are not the same as being called a father, especially in the context of the scripture where it is spoken of...

Your kids want to call you father, since you are their father, fine...Altho Paul called himself the father of so many who were not his actual children, he never intended anyone call him father other than his own children...Paul made that clear in his teaching...That's the part you guys ignore...

Joh_8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication;

When were were spiritually born again,

we have one Father, even God.

We received ONE Spiritual father...Only one...The need for a priesthood and the priesthood was eliminated...

Mat 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

60 posted on 02/23/2016 11:10:56 AM PST by Iscool (Trump will Triumph)
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