Not worth a zot 
Posted on 06/13/2012 6:05:21 PM PDT by Grig
This may be the post that gets me zotted, and if so, so be it, but it would be a nice sign of respect for free speech, and just plain old maturity if that doesn’t happen. I won’t lose sleep either way though.
All through the Clinton years FR played a key role in helping me really come to appreciate the wisdom of the founding fathers as Clinton violated their principles in so many ways. I found here a large community of wise, informed posters from a diverse background that added depth and clarity to the news of the day. It was here on FR that I found out about the WTC attack. Being Canadian, the second amendment always seemed kind of silly to me, but through FR I learned how wrong that view was and now wish my country had such a right for it’s citizens.
That was then, now more and more it has felt like FR has dwindled into an insular, nearly feral, group of political and religious thought police whose mission is to ferret out anybody who doesn’t fit their orthodoxy and get rid of them, while propagandizing against anything the disagree with. At times it feels more energy is spent attacking those who should be seen as allies rather than the true enemies. I used to spend a fair bit of time here each day, now perhaps a quick look once every few weeks because of this change in climate. I know many have left because of it, many have already posted their concerns about it, and their wise observations and suggestions have fallen on deaf ears.
I do feel I have a small measure of responsibility for the change (but no guilt). When FR started to fail to live up to it’s own rules about not bashing religions (when it came to my religion) we Mormon posters decided that instead of being party to the creation of long threads filled with contention that made it hard for the moderators see the difference in our behavior and theirs, we decided instead to simply post articles putting forward our position and leave the critics to show their true colors. (see http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/2013341/posts). Not only did the anti-Mormon posters oblige us and demonstrate the level of hate and bigotry in their hearts, but so did the anti-Momons within the leadership of FR. And thus began the decent of FR from a vibrant ad-hoc conservative think tank into an echo chamber of yes men with a loud group of religious bigots leading the way. It is sad to see it come to this, and I hope that the day comes when sanity returns. Something that needs to happen for that day to come is for the majority of people around here to face this reality: If you are not supporting Mitt Romney, you are playing into Obama’s hands. Any hopes of a brokered convention or third party conservative super-candidate are nothing but delusions fueled by a denial of reality. It comes down to either Mitt or Obama, and if you are not supporting Mitt you are helping Obama. Deal with it.
And don’t try to hide behind the idea that Mitt losing will be good in the long term for conservatism. That is putting your partisanship above your patriotism. Obama has done massive damage to the USA, and if you give him another 4 years you may not have a USA left at the end of his term. What good will this theoretical transformation of the GOP then? Truth is that if Mitt loses, no matter how conservative or liberal his campaign and policies are, the media will blame it on him being too right-wing and drive the GOP to the left as much as they can. Also, the good of the country should come first if you want to call yourself a patriot, and having Mitt in the White House will be much better for the USA than having Obama there.
While Mitt is not perfect (nobody is) I find many of the attacks on him so over the top, so full of exaggeration and fear mongering that ignores contrary evidence or any sense of proportion that I can’t help but suspect they hyperbole is just a mask for darker motives. The fact that in many cases these attacks come from those who also display great hostility towards Mormonism says it all. Deny it all you want, it is easy to see. For a satirical look at it, check this video I made: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG68yz-mMgE
I am going to make some predictions I would like to make, and I hope this thread stays around so that in years to come you can all look back and see how it turned out:
- every conservative you respect will vote for Mitt, all of them (perhaps a couple excepts, but not many) will even endorse him and perhaps campaign with him
- Mitt will become the next POTUS in a landslide victory,
- President Romney will do very well on the economy and on foreign affairs/national security
- President Romney will conduct himself with honor and integrity both in office and in his personal life
- He will be a better president than either Bush was
- You will hear conservative pundits call him this generation’s Ronald Reagan, or Ronald Reagan’s 3rd term or something along those lines
- President Romney will be re-elected in another big victory
- His Vice President will become POTUS after his second term
- If there is an assassination attempt on him, it will either be by the Chineese, or by some religiously motivated nutjob (Islamic or Evangelical)
And for those of you anti-Mormons out there, I have some prediction for you too. And these apply even if Romney is not elected as POTUS:
- Your grandchildren will call Mormons Christians, and look at Mormonism as the third branch of Christianity alongside Catholicism and Protestantism
- All the attacks against Romney that stem from the anti-Mormon garbage you have bought into will result in the attacker either apologizing, or in their loss of credibility. The more anti-Mormon attacks are made in the mainstream media, the worse the attackers will look.
- Your grandchildren will likewise look at such attacks as being as bigoted and wrong, even when they come from you.
- Some of your grandchildren or great-grandchildren will become Mormons, and after you are dead they will have temple ordinances performed for you, and you will be glad at the time that they do.
I dare you to post your own predictions of what a Romney presidency will result in.
I dare FR to leave this thread open and available for comments and to not delete a single comment from it.
I dare FR to start respecting freedom of religion by not playing favorites towards one religious group as is currently done by disallowing Mormon caucus threads, and if that is too big a challenge for you, the do away with the Religion Forum altogether.
I dare you all to give Mormons and Mormonism the respect it deserves to have as the 4th largest denomination in the USA, stalwart defender of traditional values, glowing example of Christian charity at home and around the world, the most conservative people of all religious groups, and staunch defenders of the principles of the constitution and values that built the country. No matter how much you disagree with us on religious matters, we are and should be treated as valuable conservative allies. Until FR does that, all they do is shoot themselves in the foot.
So do I.
But I also think
Less RINO than Juan McC. (such as on matters of restricting free speech)
and therefore a step in the right direction, even if (far) less so than Newt or Herman or Michelle.
Not worth a zot
later
You'll have to do better than that.
In the meantime, if Republicans do as well as they did in the last two Presidential races we are short 10 million votes of beating Obama.
He's plush. Not only that, the people on his team who are disappointed in him say they won't vote for him, but they're not saying they'll vote for a Republican.
That is very serious.
What's going on here is the GOP-e has known for four years that our Presidential vote totals have been declining and that Obama broke all records.
If he does as well, we lose. He has to lose 15% of his last vote total to get down in the territory where Republican votes are located.
The only way to overcome that is to have a really bright, sparkling, charismatic candidate who attracts people.
Just "thinking hard" at a problem isn't going to elicit a positive response out of the crowd who voted for Obama the first time.
Again, with a 15% loss in votes Obama still beats our guy. If you really cared about winning the election you'd come up with something.
BTW, the shadow of the Spring non-Primary in Virginia continues. We had exceeding light turnout yesterday and there were 5 contested House seats and a Senate seat at stake. Ordinarily you'd get folks out ~ this time they got what seems to be the same old same old. Keep that up and this Fall Republicans will lose everything in Virginia.
Tell your little buddy over there who works for Bolling on these matters that it is dangerous to discourage voting. People will make it a habit!
You’re welcome. There are a lot of people that really care about FR and are dismayed by what it has become.
Be assured though, the Flying Freeper Taliban Imams will be here any minute to dice you up ......
Thank you for your post. There are many that feel the same as you. During the primaries, it was getting really boring here, as there was really no discussion of substance which I as a fairly new FReeper had come to expect of this site. It was flaming against Romney and Mormonism 24/7 and vicious, virulent attacks against anyone supporting Romney. But don’t give up. Don’t go anywhere. Stay and work to unite bc we have a lot of work to do to get the real community jihadist creep out of the WH and the only possible way to do it is w/ Romney.
You were almost making sense up to that point.
Back to Kolob with you.
That was where he started to lose me too, but you have to expect a Mormon to be a Mormon. That's why I object to this "back to Kolob" jibe of yours. A Mormon is going to be a Mormon. In the meantime we have a country to save from the impending disaster that has been brought about by sixty-plus years of collectivist subversion. Can't we who want to patch and right the ship stop fighting among ourselves for long enough to stop it from going under and drowning us all? Especially since there are so many (non-Mormon) Americans and others that continue to punch new holes in the hull below the waterline?
I've tried saying this before but unfortunately, some care more about theological differences that have absolutely nothing to do with the Constitutional role of government. I'll tell you what I usually tell everyone, this too will pass.
You lie.
Splendid post. You say what many of us feel. I don’t judge anyone by their religion, it is above my pay grade.,
Are you claiming that none of the virulence directed toward Romney and his supporters is rooted in antipathy toward Mormonism?
Really?
There, more objective discussion about elections ~ it's hard to win when people who are supposed to be on your side are actually pursuing a private agenda that has nothing to do with the needs of the nation.
You are one of the worst offenders in this game of stiffling discussion.
I have a paper prepared demonstrating that you are a troll ~ no need to post it. Satisfies me that you have a problem.
BTW, calling me a liar is to engage in a personal attack. Please stop it.
You really do have to rehabilitate his reputation here.
I consider myself insular & feral. But I too am troubled by the thought police. I used to be addicted to FR. Now I just check in from time to time for old time sake.
I too for most of my life. I then moved abroad and live(ed) and work(ed) amongst those of the Islam faith. Hell yes. I judge "some" by their religion!
Why? Because even though they smile, say hi. act "normal" to a degree, they wish deep inside that you, I and infidels were dead. Least trustworthy people I have ever met.
Now of course all not bad, all not behave in such a manner, but fundamentally they have been taught and believe the western world is the great evil.
“When I think of Romney, I don’t think mormon. I think Rino. But that’s what we got. Mormon doesn’t even come to mind.”
From a Christian who believes the bible is the inspired word of God, DITTO. Mormonism has nothing to do with my possible decision to not crawl over the broken glass on election day.
So our grandchildren will become apostate? Doubt it ..zot.
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