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Physicists Discover a Whopping 13 New Solutions to Three-Body Problem
Science Now ^ | 3/8/13 | Jon Cartwright

Posted on 03/09/2013 9:25:20 PM PST by LibWhacker

It's the sort of abstract puzzle that keeps a scientist awake at night: Can you predict how three objects will orbit each other in a repeating pattern? In the 300 years since this "three-body problem" was first recognized, just three families of solutions have been found. Now, two physicists have discovered 13 new families. It's quite a feat in mathematical physics, and it could conceivably help astrophysicists understand new planetary systems.

The trove of new solutions has researchers jazzed. "I love these things," says Robert Vanderbei a mathematician at Princeton University who was not involved in the work. He says he, in fact, spent all night thinking about the work.

The three-body problem dates back to the 1680s. Isaac Newton had already shown that his new law of gravity could always predict the orbit of two bodies held together by gravity—such as a star and a planet—with complete accuracy. The orbit is basically always an ellipse. However, Newton couldn't come up with a similar solution for the case of three bodies orbiting one another. For 2 centuries, scientists tried different tacks until the German mathematician Heinrich Bruns pointed out that the search for a general solution for the three-body problem was futile, and that only specific solutions - one-offs that work under particular conditions—were possible. Generally, the motion of three bodies is now known to be nonrepeating.

Specific repeating solutions have been hard to come by, however. The famed mathematicians Joseph-Louis Lagrange and Leonhard Euler had come up with some in the 18th century, but it wasn't until the 1970s, with a little help from modern computing, that U.S. mathematician Roger Broucke and French astronomer Michel Hénon discovered more. Until now, specific solutions could be sorted into just three families: the Lagrange-Euler family, the Broucke-Hénon family, and the figure-eight family, the last of which was discovered in 1993 by physicist Cristopher Moore at the Santa Fe Institute.

The figure-eight family is so called because it describes three objects chasing one another in a figure eight shape. The Lagrange-Euler solutions are simpler, with the equally spaced bodies going around in a circle like horses on a merry-go-round. The Broucke-Hénon solutions are the most complex: Two objects dash back and forth on the inside, while the third object orbits around the outside.

The discovery of 13 new families, made by physicists Milovan Šuvakov and Veljko Dmitrašinović at the University of Belgrade, brings the new total to 16. "The results are beautiful, and beautifully presented," says Richard Montgomery, a mathematician at the University of California, Santa Cruz, who was not involved with the discovery.

Finding any solution is a daunting prospect. Three objects in space can be set off in infinite ways. Somehow, initial conditions—starting points, velocities, and so on—must be found that bring the objects back to those conditions so the whole dance can start over again. Šuvakov and Dmitrašinović's method was to start with an existing solution on a computer simulation and then tweak its initial conditions until a new type of orbit materialized, as they report in a paper in press at Physical Review Letters. "What we did was the most simple-minded thing that you could do," Dmitrašinović says. "We were shocked when we discovered all these things, and we were even more shocked when we discovered that they had not been discovered before us."

Faced with so many new solutions, the Belgrade physicists invented a new classification system. They used an abstract space called a "shape-sphere," which describes the shape of the orbits in terms of the relative distances between the objects. Three spots around the sphere's equator mark where two of the particles would collide, and a line drawn over the ball, which must avoid those spots, maps how near the objects get to each other. The simplest solution on the shape-sphere is of the Lagrange-Euler family. It is just a single point, because it corresponds to all three objects maintaining the same distance apart by orbiting (in real space) in a circle.

Others solutions are much more intricate, however. The researchers' new "yarn" solution looks like a ball of yarn on the shape-sphere, although its real space orbit looks even more complex—rather like a huge mass of spaghetti. (All the solutions can be viewed online.) Šuvakov and Dmitrašinović separated all the orbits—including the previously known ones—into 16 families based on their shapes on the shape sphere. They then sorted these families into four classes based on symmetry and other properties of the shapes, the first which included all the previous solutions.

The next step for the Belgrade physicists is to see how many of their new solutions are stable and will stay on track if perturbed a little. If some of the solutions are stable, then they might even be glimpsed in real life. Now, the only widely accepted three-body solution observed in space is a system made up of the sun, Jupiter, and one of the nearby Trojan asteroids, which make up a Lagrange-Euler type circle. But if we look at enough "exoplanet" systems beyond our own, we might see some of the new, more complex solutions, too, such as a solar system that looks like a heap of spaghetti.

"Observational astronomy is moving very quickly forward," Dmitrašinović says. But he adds that spotting one of the solutions will still be very difficult. "It will take a while. I'm pretty sure it won't happen tomorrow."


TOPICS: Astronomy; Science
KEYWORDS: body; catastrophism; physicists; problem; stringtheory; three; xplanets

1 posted on 03/09/2013 9:25:20 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker

WOW! I’m impressed, I guess ... what the heck are they talking about?


2 posted on 03/09/2013 9:27:57 PM PST by doc1019 (The rabbit hole that Obama is leading us down just gets deeper and deeper.)
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To: LibWhacker; doc1019

3 posted on 03/09/2013 9:34:54 PM PST by fieldmarshaldj (Resist We Much)
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To: doc1019
When two objects are orbiting one another under the influence of gravity, how will they move around one another? For any time in the future can you predict where they'll be with respect to one another, how fast they'll be moving, and in which direction. Newton solved that problem 300 years ago.

Can you do the same for three bodies? Mathematically, it's a much more difficult problem, which is surprising. As the article says, Euler made some progress. Personally, I was unaware that any further advancements had been made. I just figured it was one of those intractable things and that was that.

And four bodies, five bodies, etc.? Fuggedaboudit.

Check out the wiki article.

Pretty exciting.

4 posted on 03/09/2013 9:40:34 PM PST by LibWhacker
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To: doc1019

” - - - what the heck are they talking about? - - - “

1.) The essence of a great manager: Ability to keep many balls in the air.

2.) Juggling 3 objects in space.

3.) Opposites attract, but three is a crowd.

4.) One if by Land, Two if by Sea, and Three is one of those damn Obamadrones!


5 posted on 03/09/2013 9:43:38 PM PST by Graewoulf ((Traitor John Roberts' Commune Obama"care" violates Anti-Trust Laws, AND the U.S. Constitution.))
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To: LibWhacker

Thank you for clearing that up somewhat. I will research now that my curiosity has been peeked.


6 posted on 03/09/2013 9:45:12 PM PST by doc1019 (The rabbit hole that Obama is leading us down just gets deeper and deeper.)
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To: LibWhacker

French scientists discovered it first, called it a Menage a` Trois


7 posted on 03/09/2013 9:48:50 PM PST by bunkerhill7 ("The Second Amendment has no limits on firepower"-NY State Senator Marchione.)
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To: bunkerhill7

Almost. Problème des Trois Corps.


8 posted on 03/09/2013 10:12:48 PM PST by steve86 (Acerbic by Nature, not Nurture™)
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To: LibWhacker

Very cool. Can’t wait for someone to code up a simulator for it that I can run on my desktop.


9 posted on 03/10/2013 12:18:56 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: steve86; BunkerHill

:) So many responses. So little tyme...


10 posted on 03/10/2013 1:10:22 AM PST by poobear (Socialism in the minds of the elites, is a con-game for the serfs, nothing more.)
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To: steve86
Almost. Problème des Trois Corps.

Doesn't that involve 3 competing French socialist "brigades" attempting to not engage each other, while gloriously looking for a fight?

11 posted on 03/10/2013 1:10:37 AM PST by ApplegateRanch (Love me, love my guns!©)
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To: LibWhacker

Ok, who is up for solving the problem for four bodies?

“Enquiring minds want to know.....”

We are just dying to know!


12 posted on 03/10/2013 1:33:35 AM PST by Arlis (.)
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To: Arlis
Too many to count. :)


13 posted on 03/10/2013 3:00:49 AM PDT by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: LibWhacker
Newton solved that problem 300 years ago.

It might be more accurate to say that Newton placed a theoretical foundation under Kepler's solution. (Though Kepler thought planets orbited the sun, not the center of mass of the sun-planet system. Thanks for clearing that up, Isaac.)

It is also inaccurate to say that Newton did not solve the three (or many body) problem. The answer today is the same as it was in Newton's day, as my Gujarati Calculus professor would say, "Integrate, only." It's like Woody said about Buzz Lightyear, "That's not flying, that's falling with style." Same thing, these are not closed from solutions, they're integrating with style.

14 posted on 03/10/2013 5:13:10 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (What word begins with "O" and ends in economic collapse?)
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To: bunkerhill7

This is a classic Mafia math problem. Youse got three bodies, a large garbage bag and enough space for one and a half bodies in the trunk of youse car. The bodies is in a public spot where dey might be discovered at any moment. How do youse get rid of da bodies? (Use a no. two axe. Show all work.)


15 posted on 03/10/2013 5:31:00 AM PDT by Gen.Blather
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To: LibWhacker; All

Here is the three-body galler.

http://suki.ipb.ac.rs/3body/

Click on each for more info.


16 posted on 03/10/2013 5:32:45 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: Right Wing Assault

gallery


17 posted on 03/10/2013 5:33:16 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: Right Wing Assault

That’s neat, thx!


18 posted on 03/10/2013 5:58:16 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker

I would like to see all of the orbit animations in real space.


19 posted on 03/10/2013 6:02:42 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: Right Wing Assault

Me, too! Must take a long time for them to trace out those intricate butterfly patterns? They should just speed it up a thousand fold if necessary and let us see it!


20 posted on 03/10/2013 6:12:13 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

All the hubbub here is about 13 new solutions. I wonder if anyone has put an upper limit on how many there are?


21 posted on 03/10/2013 6:15:33 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: Right Wing Assault; Lonesome in Massachussets

You know, regarding my question to Lonesome in Massachussets about a theoretical upper limit on the number of possible orbits, we may be looking at a situation where there are an infinite number of possible three-body orbits out there. Wouldn’t that be wonderful? Could you imagine the possibilities for life, and all the different environments it might inhabit?


22 posted on 03/10/2013 6:59:34 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker

There are clearly an infinite number of solutions, just as there are to the two body problem. My take is that they are finding new classes of solutions.

One example of the three body problem is the moon-earth-sun. The system is powerfully perturbed by Jupiter and Venus, so it’s not really a pure three body problem, but it is representative of one class of solutions: Ms >> Me >> Mm, where “>>” means “is sufficiently greater than” with the two smaller bodies body in a nearly Keplerian orbit, and their center of mass orbiting the most massive central body . Another class are the famous Lagrangian points, which include thousands of Trojan (no smirking) asteroids. Another is the horseshoe (only in Lagrangian coordinates) orbit. It was believed that horseshoe orbits were only possible theoretical constructs, until asteroids in horseshoe orbits around earth were discovered.


23 posted on 03/10/2013 7:08:56 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (What word begins with "O" and ends in economic collapse?)
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To: LibWhacker
It looks like they are looking for periodic solutions, solutions that repeat.

Laplace, in Mécanique Céleste claimed to have "proven" that the solar system is stable. Newton thought that God had to intervene periodically to prevent chaotic disintegration of the solar system. When Napolean asked Laplace about the place of God in his universe, Laplace is said to have replied, "Sire, je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothèse". (Sire, I have no need of that hypothesis.) We know now that Laplace was wrong, but wrong with style. He was very right about a great number of other things.

I don't think you can properly introduce the three body problem without at least a mention of Poincaré.

24 posted on 03/10/2013 7:25:06 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (What word begins with "O" and ends in economic collapse?)
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets
Is there a limit on the number of classes of solutions?

Holy cow, my jaw dropped when I saw the MOTH III class. Maybe some science fiction writer of the future will set his novel in such a system? I hope so.

Poincaré... Way before my time and way over my head, lol!

25 posted on 03/10/2013 7:57:06 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: doc1019

Something about the Kama Sutra, I think.


26 posted on 03/10/2013 8:53:06 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: LibWhacker
So, astrogating around Pluto might be tricky?
27 posted on 03/10/2013 8:54:20 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: BenLurkin

Absolutely! When your astronauts got to Pluto, it’d be a bummer to find out Pluto wasn’t where you thought it’d be when you sent them and was traveling 50,000 mph too fast in the wrong direction. Could make for a messy landing. Before climbing onboard, they’d want to know you got an A+ in celestial mechanics and not just some affirmative action diploma in it.


28 posted on 03/10/2013 9:10:14 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker
Well, if it's me flying the thing I won't need any of that fancy stuf. 'Cause I don't understand it anyhoo.

I'll just use the 'ole seat 'o the pants.

Here we go!

29 posted on 03/10/2013 9:13:26 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: BenLurkin

That’s best, anyway. If fuel is going to be in such short supply that I need to be shot out of a cannon, because liberal luddites quake in fear every time someone mentions the atom, I’d rather stay at home. Give me a nice powerful Orion class ship and I’d be happy to hop onboard with a seat-of-the-pants pilot. We’d get there quickly, and if Pluto doing what we thought it would be doing, we’d change course, catch up, etc., and not worry about running out of gas. The only way to travel!


30 posted on 03/10/2013 9:44:56 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: LibWhacker
if Pluto doing what we

if Pluto WASN'T doing what we

31 posted on 03/10/2013 9:46:25 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: KevinDavis; annie laurie; Knitting A Conundrum; Viking2002; Ernest_at_the_Beach; Mmogamer; ...

Thanks LibWhacker.
 
X-Planets
· join · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post new topic · subscribe ·
Google news searches: exoplanet · exosolar · extrasolar ·

32 posted on 03/15/2013 9:46:01 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: 6SJ7; AdmSmith; AFPhys; Arkinsaw; allmost; aristotleman; autumnraine; Beowulf; Bones75; BroJoeK; ...

Thanks LibWhacker.

· String Theory Ping List ·
Silly String Ordinance
· Join · Bookmark · Topics · Google ·
· View or Post in 'blog · post a topic · subscribe ·


33 posted on 03/15/2013 9:46:35 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: 75thOVI; agrace; aimhigh; Alice in Wonderland; AndrewC; aragorn; aristotleman; Avoiding_Sulla; ...

Thanks LibWhacker. No, this three-body problem isn't about Obama and Benghazi.
In the 300 years since this "three-body problem" was first recognized, just three families of solutions have been found. Now, two physicists have discovered 13 new families. It's quite a feat in mathematical physics, and it could conceivably help astrophysicists understand new planetary systems.



34 posted on 03/15/2013 9:47:07 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Romney would have been worse, if you're a dumb ass.)
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To: Graewoulf

OR, the study of interacting conic sections. Think of each mass exercising its gravitational mass as a conic manifestation, with the larger portion of the cone representing the gravitational attraction spread over a larger volume of space, and the deeper into the cone toward the apex the more force is concentrated in the smaller volume of the cone. Now think of three body problem as the interaction of cones and conic sections of force ... hehehe


35 posted on 03/16/2013 11:46:41 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: MHGinTN

Yes! What you wrote!


36 posted on 03/16/2013 9:34:45 PM PDT by Graewoulf (Traitor John Roberts' Commune-Style Obama'care' violates U.S. Constitution AND Anti-Trust Law.)
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