Posted on 12/29/2002 9:23:52 PM PST by PFKEY
Hope no one minds the vanity too much.
I was thinking last night about this idea and was trying to make it jive somewhat with the notion of predeterminationalism if that is the correct word.
Also was curious regarding what the various Christian denominations taught on this subject.
Get your Bible. Or go to www.justbible.com
The thief, was he immediately taken up into heaven-- after all the Lord could have sent him, tout suite.
Why should God have done that? That has only happened to two people. And they certainly were not thieves.
Or did he hang there, suffering with and alongside of the Lord, and share in the crucifixion?
He suffered for his crimes. He had nothing at all to do with Jesus Christ being there. One deserved to be there, one did not. The thief didn't share in Jesus death for your sins.
What an ineffable honor!
There is no honor in the cross, only shame.
His sins were forgiven, no punishment was even due him, was there?
If you commit a crime, you still owe your pound of flesh to the law, and to justice. No matter if your sins are forgiven or not.
That isn't my doctrine. Baptism doesn't save anyone, it never has and it never will.
John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son
John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
Tacky, tacky. You know I don't believe in salvation by works.
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Amen. You might have some sense after all. How far do you go with this?
I had forgotten that I wanted to ask if you read/have read any Doestoevsky? In particular, The Grand Inquisitor from the Brothers Karamazov?
Jael is it Biblical to have people in authority over you? Is it biblical to have a gospel that is correct?
It seems to me you belong to a church with no accountibility or oversight..it is every man for himself..that is spiritually dangerous
You answer that and we will discuss it..
What is the Church?
People sometimes speak of the church downtown, etc. Of course, we understand that they are referring to the building that the church meets in. However, that is not the "the Church" at all, but the meeting place of the Church.
For example the Roman Catholic Church is not the true church, but a counterfeit. It is the false church of the antichrist.
This body is made up of all Christians who have been born again during the Church Age and joined together by the Holy Spirit, in Christ.
"Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular." I Corinthians 12:27
Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all."
Ephesians 1:20-23
II. What Does the Headship of Christ Mean?
In the above scriptures the New Testament church is likened to a body with Christ as its Head.
III. What Are The Implications of the Headship of Christ?
The Lord Jesus Christ is not a figurehead; He is the living, operative, and preeminent Head over every New Testament church. What does this mean in practice? For any Baptist church, the implications of the Headship of Christ are that:
A local Baptist church administers Christs laws. Therefore, no local church has the right to make any resolution that is not in conformity to Gods Word. This is in contrast to the ex-Cathedra pronouncements, synods, councils, and sessions conducted by men who make rules and regulations which are then dictated to their "churches."
When a mans body does not respond to what his head is telling him, he is very sick. Likewise a church should not involve itself in extra-Biblical works, for its only command is to be "always abounding in the work of the Lord" (I Corinthians 15:58), "as My Father hath sent Me, even so send I you" (John 20:21), and this means doing the things the Lord did on earth during His public ministry that is, preaching, baptizing, and teaching.
Apart from the pastor, church members do not have to answer to anyone regarding spiritual things only to Christ. I Corinthians 3:9-17 refers to the church as a spiritual building, and tells us that we are to be judged according to how we build up our church.
IV. Who Established The Church?
It is Christ Himself who established this spiritual organism. Here we want to emphasize that the church (though often called an organization) is actually a living organism with a living head. One becomes part of it only by the new birth.
V. Who Has The Authority To Rule The Church?
Jesus Christ is the Head of the New Testament church.
Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all." Ephesians 1:20-23
"For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body." Ephesians 5:23
"Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence."
Colossians 1:13-18
In I Peter 2:25 the Lord Jesus Christ is referred to as our "Shepherd" and "Bishop." In I Peter 5:4 He is called the "Chief Shepherd" in a context which makes Him THE PASTOR of every Baptist church. While the word pastor means Shepherd, the pastors of Baptist churches are properly known as under-shepherds. Under the authority of Christ, they rule over the church.
A necessary factor in organization is leadership. This is exhibited in the many forms of worldly organizations: An army needs officers. A sporting team needs a captain. A business needs management, and so on. In each case the body concerned may function, but certainly not as well or efficiently as it would with good leadership. In the same way a church will only be able to serve God if it has God-given leadership.
In Gods chain of command, scriptural leadership brings order out of confusion. When sin first entered in, God put the man over the woman to restore order in a state of chaos, Genesis 3:16; I Corinthians 11:3. God placed parents in a position of authority over their children to ensure orderly development, Exodus 20;12; Psalm 58:3; Proverbs 22:6. God ordained human government to prevent anarchy, Judges 21:25; Romans 13:1-7. In the same way the Lord has set pastors over His churches to "set in order " things that may be wanting, Titus 1:5.
Scriptural church government places a pastor in the position of oversight (Acts 20:28), leadership (Ephesians 4:11), and rulership (Hebrews 13:7, 17) over the congregation. Pastoral leadership is an integral part of church government.
Dr. Linton Smith
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