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To: NYer
I have a real problem with your post. Sure, you are carried away with emotion--but emotion makes for bad Catholicism. It blinds us to truth. Let me remind you: it was during this pope's reign that an unprecedented wave of scandals have washed over the Church. Dioceses around the world are packed with apostate bishops and cardinals. A gay subculture is flourishing in our seminaries and parishes. The problem has been worsening for decades--from the days before John Paul II was shot. He has known about it and done nothing. It has only worsened. Excessive adulation is wrong because it is a sin against the First Commandment. This is a man, not God. He is infallible in a very restricted area of the Faith. I suggest you look at the mixed picture his papacy presents.
5 posted on 07/27/2002 4:26:01 PM PDT by ultima ratio
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To: ultima ratio
Don't go giving them a dose of true reality now, it won't win you any friends here. What they want is another "praise the Pope" thread.
6 posted on 07/27/2002 5:07:41 PM PDT by Iowegian
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To: ultima ratio
it was during this pope's reign that an unprecedented wave of scandals have washed over the Church. Dioceses around the world are packed with apostate bishops and cardinals

Actually, the scandals have their roots in the church of Paul VI. And modernism goes back to the turn of the century, when Pius X wrote an encyclical against modernism.

And as for "all the church" scandals, what you see is a few 20 year old scandals being blasted all over. They are terrible, but not universal, nor even common. Many European and US bishops are wishy washy in defending the faith, and after JPII dies, many of us suspect that Europe and much of the US will schism away from Rome.

What is little noticed however is that most Christians live in the third world.

The Episcopal church in the US and UK is being revitalized by missionaries from Africa and Asia.

And if you look in most diocese that still strongly defend the faith, you will find that they have priests from other countries working here. We just ordained a priest from Kenya to work in the local inner city. And my mother's parish has a young Vietnamese priest who came here as a refugee as a child.

The US church is fat and lazy, but don't judge the church by one small country.

7 posted on 07/27/2002 6:26:14 PM PDT by LadyDoc
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To: ultima ratio
You are not a Roman Catholic. The arrogance you display in attacking the Holy Father shows that you are beyond the pale of your rights under Canon Law, and the spirit of dissent which is present in your posts shows you to be an enemy of the Holy Father and an enemy of Holy Mother Church.

You are using a new screen name, but you are churning out old invective against the Pope. If you continue to post in this fashion you will find that you have crossed the wrong "Mother Bear", and I will oppose you at every turn.

9 posted on 07/27/2002 6:47:15 PM PDT by Siobhan
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To: ultima ratio; Iowegian
Ignoring (if you can) his office, he is a man worthy of great praise. Read about him, study his life. His vision of a world torn between the spiritual and the secular, between atheism and faith, has led to a geopolitical revolution. And, he is in fact, the Vicar of Christ on earth.
15 posted on 07/27/2002 7:09:38 PM PDT by narses
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To: ultima ratio
I suggest you look at the mixed picture his papacy presents.

Bravo.

41 posted on 07/28/2002 4:18:23 PM PDT by MarMema
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To: ultima ratio
You mention feelings (emotions).

Feelings just are. They are neither right nor wrong. What you do with the feelings is far more important. For example, if I feel angry, I can stuff it and flare out at someone later in the day for no reason at all. Or, I can confront the person with whom I am feeling angry right then, and let them know what is angering me as long as I do it in a civilized manner, not condescending or belittling, etc.

Feelings or emotions are want drive us to action. Think about a family confronted with a burglar.......and the father's feelings about protecting his family totally overide the thought process of seeking safety.

Just something to think about. I think you were talking about heartfelt judgments, rather than emotions or feelings.

Now on to the other comments about Pope John Paul II.

Yes, he may have sat on this information, but I am in no place to judge, for I don't know all the details.

Secondly, Popes have made mistakes before. We have examples in the Crusades and Inquisitions of misguided and mistaken judgments by Popes. For these I ask your forgiveness of the Catholic Church. So many people think that everything that a Pope says or does falls into the "infallibility" category.

I am sure that you are aware that the infallibility refers only to matters of ecclesiastical dogma. And in this category there have been only TWO papal decrees. Yes, only TWO, and they both had to do with the Blessed Virgin Mary.

I may be wrong in some of my wording here, but I am pretty sure I have the facts right.

47 posted on 07/28/2002 7:35:17 PM PDT by Salvation
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