This is what the issue we were discussing was about, Premillennialism vs Amillennialism in the first 3 centuries of church history, not dispensationalism.
No, Allan Patrick Boyd's thesis is dealing with Historical Pre-Millenialism. It is Boyd's, who is Pre-Millenial, conlusion that Historical Pre-Millenialsim was ~not~ the authoritive view of the ante-nicene church. My point regarding Ryrie is this: Ryrie at one point held the similar view as you do -that Pre-Millenialism was the dominant view of the early church. But because of Boyd's work, Ryrie has been convinced that this is not true. In other words, Boyd's study lead him to conlclude that Pre-Millenialism was actually the minority viewpoint -I'm just noting that Ryrie now concurs to lend credibility to Mr. Boyd's work. Mr. Boyd's work has nothing to do with the Dispensational Pre-Millenial monster.
"Moreover, as for Premillennialism being only found in the 19th century, it was reawakened in the 17th century,"
No, Historical Pre-Millenialsim has been found throughout the early church. Dispenasational Pre-Millenialism is the unheard of doctrine which infected the churches 1800 years after Christ's first coming.
"Again, the issue was not historical dispensationalism but Premillennialism."
Yes, I know. However, it is Mr. Walvoords intentions to link Dispensational Pre-Millenialism -which is his theology- to Historical Pre-Millenialism. And that is highly disengenuous.
"Moreover, Ryrie was not the one I was citing, Walvoord was."
your point being?
"I gave you the historical evidence, you give me a MA Thesis that is addressing dispensationalism not Premillennialism and I'm the one who is dishonest?"
yes, I gave you evidence, but as is your tendancy, you simply dismiss any evidence which disagrees with your position.
And help me out here, the fact that Boyd's work is a masters thesis affects the accuracy of his facts by.......???? What does the fact that Boyd discovered this during his research for his Master's Thesis? Are the facts of a Master's Thesis somehow less true than for a doctrinal thesis -or even less true than from a Theologian who received his doctorate 30 years ago? I don't get it. Is the fact that Boyd's work is a Master's Thesis somehow prove it is wrong? Help me out here.
"There isn't proof? I showed you quotes from different authors including Justin Martyr!"
You showed me one quote from one Pre-Millenialist -and this proves your case that Per-Millenialism was the dominant view of the early church how????
"Well, the 'last trump' could easily mean the final one in a series, not the final one ever sounded. We have trumpets being sounded in Revelation (Rev.8:2)."
If 1 Cor 15:51 declares that we will be raised and changed "At the Last Trump" -period. No need to go any further. The Last Trump is the last trumpet! (next you'll probably try to tell me it's the "last trump" -not the "last trumpet") We need not try to add thoughts to this passage, for it is quite clear. No more trumpets after the last trumpet. -it doesn't say anything a series or whatever -it simply says "the last trump"
So -until you can tell me that "the last trump" is indeed the "last trump" as 1 Cor 15 declares without a doubt -your claim of 'literalism' falls on deaf ears.
"Yes, the spiritual kingdom is real (the Kingdom of God) and so will be the Kingdom of Heaven be real also, a physical Kingdom with The Lord Jesus Christ ruling as the Son of God on the Throne of David "
He already is on his throne and currently ruling (Matt 28:18, 1 Cor 15:25, Romans 15:12)
The Kingdom of God ~is~ the Kingdom of Heaven
Matthew 13:11
He replied, "The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them.
Mark 4:11
And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
Luke 8:10
And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
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Matthew 11:11-12
I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. {12} From the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of heaven has been forcefully advancing, and forceful men lay hold of it.
Luke 7:28
For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.
Jean