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To: DouglasKC
Thank you for responding during these slow times on the thread. See Becky, I didn't kill the thread. :-)Doug? Does Halley consume alot of alcohol? :-) His arguments are weak and I'll explain why.

They neither marry nor sexually reproduce (compare Luke 20:34-36). Also, this explanation would violate the principle made clear in Genesis 1 that each kind reproduces only “according to its kind.”

Luke 20:34-35 Jesus was explaining "in the resurrection" the order of things. Nowhere in those scriptures do we read the natural order of things here in this world cannot be violated. Since there are NT verses that confirm Genesis 6, we know that it has been violated.

Furthermore, the risen Jesus explained that “fallen angels,” or demons, are not able to manifest themselves materially like He and the righteous angels can (Luke 24:39; compare verses 40-43; Genesis 18:1-8, 16; 19:1). Rather, we see demons in Scripture only possessing individuals or appearing as ghostly apparitions.

In Enoch, non-canonized writing, nonetheless the half brother of Jesus and more than a few anti-nicene fathers viewed it as scripture, it explains that demons are the spirits of the nephilim, the offspring of fallen angels and humans. Since they were conceived in this earthly realm it is required they remain here until the fulfillment of all things.

In any event, human beings were clearly the problem here—not angels. God says, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever” (verse 3) and “I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth” (verse 7). Thus, the giants mentioned must have been human also—descendants of Adam and Eve (compare Acts 17:26). These very tall people were destroyed in the Flood. But there would be more like them following the Flood, who were descended, just as everyone else in the post-Flood world, from Noah—again, not angels (compare Deuteronomy 2:20-21; 3:11). Consider Goliath, whom David slew. He was more than nine feet tall (1 Samuel 17:4). But he was still just a man (verses 24-25, 33)—not some human-demonic hybrid.

This argument holds no water since the nephilim were half human.

The second explanation in Halley’s is far more reasonable and better fits the context of the passage. Genesis 4 gives the story of Cain and Abel and follows with the genealogical descent from Cain. Genesis 5 is called “the book of the genealogy of Adam” (verse 1). It starts with God’s creation of Adam and how Adam’s line continued through Seth. As with the angels, Adam was a “son of God” by creation (compare Luke 3:38)—though even more so since Adam was made in God’s image (Genesis 1:26; 5:1-3). Of this family line through Seth it is stated, “Then men began to call on the name of the LORD”—which could also be rendered “called after the name of the LORD.” Then, in the next chapter, Genesis 6, we see “the sons of God” (men of Seth’s godly line in this explanation) intermarrying with “the daughters of men” (women of Cain’s ungodly line).

There are a few problems with this. If the godly line of Seth intermarry with the ungodly line of Cain, why do only males from the godly line procreate with females from the ungodly line? Also right before the flood Noah and his family were the only righteous. What happened to all the rest of the godly line of Seth?

There is even a third possibility, in which “sons of God” should be translated “sons of the gods,” as the Hebrew word elohim here, plural in form, can sometimes refer to false gods instead of the true God. In this explanation, wicked men referred to as sons of the gods (either pagan worshipers or perhaps men claiming to be demigods themselves) forcibly “took” innocent women as wives—an example perhaps of the evil conduct of the day.

2 other places "bnai elohim" shows up in the OT. When the "sons of God" came before God along with Satan in the Book of Job. And when the "Son of God" showed up in the furnace in the book of Daniel. All 3 times not a word about humans. Perhaps these fallen angels were posing as false gods. I have no problem with that.

For someone who's an advocate for the gap theory and pre-adamic civilization, I'm surprised you don't believe this. :-)

48,416 posted on 04/24/2003 8:53:42 PM PDT by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: Invincibly Ignorant
Luke 20:34-35 Jesus was explaining "in the resurrection" the order of things. Nowhere in those scriptures do we read the natural order of things here in this world cannot be violated. Since there are NT verses that confirm Genesis 6, we know that it has been violated.

Sure the natural order can be violated, but when it comes to angels God did not create them with the ability to reproduce with humans. Why would he? If they could manifest human bodies they might be able to, but it's doubtful that God even gave them the power to reproduce. Angels and humans are different kinds, as differenet as elephants and horses.

In Enoch, non-canonized writing, nonetheless the half brother of Jesus and more than a few anti-nicene fathers viewed it as scripture, it explains that demons are the spirits of the nephilim, the offspring of fallen angels and humans. Since they were conceived in this earthly realm it is required they remain here until the fulfillment of all things.

Interesting...not inspired, but interesting. :-)

But he was still just a man (verses 24-25, 33)—not some human-demonic hybrid.
This argument holds no water since the nephilim were half human.

God could have said "My spirit will not strive with man nor nephalim forever...". That would have been clearer if that were the case. It's like saying there's a bunch of half dog/half human people running around. It just can't happen.

There are a few problems with this. If the godly line of Seth intermarry with the ungodly line of Cain, why do only males from the godly line procreate with females from the ungodly line?

Easy. They were the fast and loose women... :-)

Also right before the flood Noah and his family were the only righteous. What happened to all the rest of the godly line of Seth?

They corrupted.

For someone who's an advocate for the gap theory and pre-adamic civilization, I'm surprised you don't believe this. :-)

I'm not sure I would characterize it as believing in a pre-adamic civilization. There is a chance that there were human looking creatures around before Adam and Eve, but my belief is more along the lines that they angels (eventually fallen) were given the habitation of earth originally. They sinned and the earth was destroyed and corrupt until the restoration by God.

Interesting discussion eh?:-)

48,505 posted on 04/25/2003 9:58:23 AM PDT by DouglasKC
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