Posted on 03/30/2002 7:53:37 PM PST by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
Let's look at a bit more of the chapter.2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.First of all, it is apparent that Peter is speaking of a select group of people ... false prophets and/or teachers.
2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
7 And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
8 (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds;)
9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
10 But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.
11 Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.
12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet.
17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.
18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.
And if these characterize falling away, take a look at what they are described as doing (vs. 1, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 17, 18).
I.e. these are not christians who are (even) experiencing a crisis of faith. These are those which have heard the gospel, and, rather than believing it unto salvation, ... have chosen to misuse the gospel and/or the church as a source of earthly gain. To do this, they feign belief, and behavior appropriate to such belief. But this is only a ruse, and, ultimately they turn to their true intentions, and wreak havoc within the Church.
It would have been better for them to never have heard, ... than to have heard and to have practiced such a deceit. They are even harder to save now than they were before.
Not a very strong argument, IMO. If one of my daughters grows up to be a stripper, porn star, or something along those lines (God forbid!) I'm not gonna stop loving her, nor will she cease being my daughter. But if she continues in that sin (besides having grown up a Christian) and dies in that sin, will she inherit the kingdom of God? I doubt it.
So then you deny that you are a new creation in Christ as 2 Corinthians stated. Just like our fleshly birth was a one time thing, so is our Spiritual birth a one time thing.
I deny that being given a chance to live in the new creation means that we are assured of eternal life. It is not the same as salvation.
We are re-born in Christ and then our life begins. We can choose to nourish this life, or we can waste it. We can throw it away.
Adam and Eve were born into a world without death and they screwed that up. When we come to Christ we get the opportunity to join in His life.
SD
No, the son had to come back.
SD
Exactly.
27 And it came to pass, as he spake these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice, and said unto him, Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked.
28 But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.
Those that hear the Word and keep it, are the family of Jesus.
SD
They will be the bride of Christ. Remember, 5 of those 10 virgins in the parable knew Jesus they just tried knocking on the door to get to the wedding and they couldn't. They'll be saved but not as the bride of Christ.
28 But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.
Those that hear the Word and keep it, are the family of Jesus.
Rather (per the text), those that hear the Word and keep it ... are blessed.
Those who receive JESUS, ... even those who believe upon His name ... are the family of JESUS.John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Can't speak for the others but mine was that this guy really needs help with interpretation.
Huh? The foolish virgins, who ran out of oil, missed the boat. The entire point is that if you are not on guard, you will miss the party. If you don't get into the feast before the gate closes, you are eternally screwed.
All of the saved are the Bride of Christ. What are you talking about?
SD
But still it must certainly be taken into balance with all the other scriptures indicating that it is more than possible, once saved, to fail to persevere. The ones you first posted to me about(Link to orig post) tell a fairly complete story about the danger of recidivism, and its penalty. Against which the AS part of OSAS is simply innacurate.
In that light, perhaps it is another reference to those who blaspheme against the Holy Spirit, or who lead the little ones away from God. Those who, through their own actions put themselves outside of Salvation.
2 Peter 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. 20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
Whether the the they in verse 20 are the deceivers or the deceived, the verse clearly is about Once Saved people
"after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord" clearly refers those who had been saved,
how else can you escape?
v.
"Rather" does mean something.
Regardless, the point is mainly that those who keep the Word are blessed, not just those that make a proclamation of faith on one day.
SD
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