Kalamata, I agree with your point of view in general, perhaps not in every specific detail but I do think we are in the “little season” at the end of the millenial kingdom and that Christ’s reign has been spiritual; then at some near-future time, the visible second coming will take place and we’ll be into the eternal righteous kingdom of God.
I believe what has caused a general uncertainty as to times of prophecy is that various signs and timetables are given for both “end times” and the first set were not followed by a visible return (only the spiritual reign) so while some agree with you and me, others (perhaps a majority) are watching for the first end time that leads into the millenial kingdom.
Jesus will sort this out for us and either way things will improve, whichever of the two events is really just ahead, as it seems obvious that “an end time” is approaching given the signs apparent to all.
But the preterist viewpoint just seems devoid of hope for the world, and I refuse to believe this is the eternal fate of humanity, to be living like wild animals in a lawless satanic dystopia. We were told to expect a new earth and I believe it is this earth, purified, so that the standards of heaven (if indeed that exists now somewhere else) can be met here as well. As was always intended for the faithful.
“There will be some who will not taste death before they see the son of man coming in his kingdom” — I always thought that was a reference to the appearing of Jesus in the period up to Ascension and the immediately-following revelation of the holy spirit to the faithful at Pentecost.
And that speaks to the veracity of the spiritual nature of the thousand year kingdom. As to its actual duration and when it started, I agree in general with Kalamata that it is just a long interval of spiritual rule by Jesus, and nuances of translation have left an impression it is exactly 1,000 years long. It could be longer or shorter, and where I don’t necessarily agree with Kalamata is on a starting time as early as 70 A.D., but whatever, it seems to be in its final stage now and the world is very similar to what we were told to expect when the battle jumped from heaven (where we were not witness to it) to earth (where we are witnesses and full participants).
Since the various well-known timetables probably refer to the already-finished first end time, there is no reason to suppose that Jesus is still “years away” and that 3.5 or seven or any other number of years “must” now occur. In the little season, Satan is finished off by the return in power and great glory of Jesus. And it can’t be too soon, we’ve had it with that guy.
Peter, the preterist view i an optimistic view. We do not have to fear a coming great tribulation and destruction of the planet, etc. We gloriously share the gospel, living under Christ the King.
10 CLUES TO UNDERSTANDING THE NEW HEAVEN AND NEW EARTH
The “new heaven and new earth” of the Bible is popularly thought by Christians to be a future world of perfect utopia. In the new heaven and new earth there will LITERALLY be “no more tears, pain, or death.” But watch out on this! We are given clues in the Bible that the popular view may be flawed.
Thesis: Some uses of the nouns “earth” and “heaven” refer to realities in the cosmos (Genesis 1:1; etc.). However, the “New Heaven and New Earth” is a Hebraic metaphor for the New Covenant in Christ. It is not the same thing as heaven itself. The primary texts about this are Isaiah 65/66, Matthew 5:17-18; 2 Peter 3, and Revelation 21. Let’s take a look.
CLUE #1: If the new earth is to be understood literally, we would logically have to understand the new heaven literally also. But, if God lives in heaven, why do we need a new heaven? Hmmm.
CLUE #2: In Matthew 5:17-18, Jesus ties the passing of heaven and earth with the passing of the Law. So, if the Law has already passed away and we are now under Grace, we must be in the new heaven and new earth now!
CLUE #3: In Matthew 24:34-35, Jesus puts the passing away of heaven and earth in his generation, coincident with the destruction of the temple (Matthew 24:2).
CLUE #4: In Isaiah 65/66, we see that God’s enemies are destroyed, but regular human history continues. Houses and vineyards will be built in the new heaven and new earth. We also see that children are born in the new heaven and new earth. There is SIN in the new heaven and new earth. And, indeed, people still DIE in the new heaven and new earth (Isaiah 65:20; 66:24)! So, the new heaven and new earth is not the eternal state—heaven itself, nor can it be a utopian millennium.
CLUE #5: In Isaiah 66:19f, we also see that regular human history continues after the “final judgment.” The survivors of Armageddon evangelize those who never heard of God. Get that? There are people on earth who never heard of God in the new heaven and new earth! This is not Utopia-ville.
Continue here for all TEN CLUES:
https://prophecyquestions.com/10-clues-to-understanding-the-new-heaven-and-new-earth
>>Kalamata, I agree with your point of view in general, perhaps not in every specific detail but I do think we are in the “little season” at the end of the millenial kingdom and that Christ’s reign has been spiritual; then at some near-future time, the visible second coming will take place and we’ll be into the eternal righteous kingdom of God.<<
My hope is that Satan and his evil works are soon destroyed, the dead are resurrected and judged, the nations are healed, and everyone lives happily ever after, like this:
“the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. And there shall be no more curse” — Rev 22:2-3 KJV
“One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.” — Eccl 1:4 KJV
>>I believe what has caused a general uncertainty as to times of prophecy is that various signs and timetables are given for both “end times” and the first set were not followed by a visible return (only the spiritual reign) so while some agree with you and me, others (perhaps a majority) are watching for the first end time that leads into the millenial kingdom.”
The way I understand the scripture, Christ’s return in 66 AD was to gather his elect (the chosen seed of Israel — the small remnant,) and to judge the rest of Israel. See Dan 12:1-2.
The elect — the 144,000 Isrealites (Rev 7, 20:4-6) — have been serving him day and night in his temple since his return.
>>Jesus will sort this out for us and either way things will improve, whichever of the two events is really just ahead, as it seems obvious that “an end time” is approaching given the signs apparent to all.<<
I see different signs than most Christians since I studied the scripture on my own for decades without the influence of pastors or commentators.
I believe that over the past few decades, Satan and his army have been teaching our children to doubt the word of God — the first sin in the Bible — although it began when Darwin corrupted science. That practice became the norm with the removal of prayer from schools and the rise of militant atheism.
>>But the preterist viewpoint just seems devoid of hope for the world, and I refuse to believe this is the eternal fate of humanity, to be living like wild animals in a lawless satanic dystopia. We were told to expect a new earth and I believe it is this earth, purified, so that the standards of heaven (if indeed that exists now somewhere else) can be met here as well. As was always intended for the faithful.<<
I agree. I have had many debates with full preterists over the years. They tend to rely on audience relevance (which I do) and grammatical exegeses (which I do,) but they avoid the grammar in what I believe is one of the most important verses, which is:
“After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.” — Rev 4:1 KJV
According to the grammar of that verse, John was seeing the future from that point forward, which contradicts one of the most important doctrines of full preterism — that Satan was kicked out of heaven at the cross (See John 12:31, Rev 12.) Rev 4:1 indicates Satan was cast out of heaven after John wrote the Revelation and before the destruction of Jerusalem, during which time he made war with the early Christians:
“Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time... And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.” — Rev 12:12, 17 KJV
“Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.” — Rev 3:10 KJV
Under that scenario, Satan was bound when Jerusalem and the temple were destroyed — when the power of the holy people, the Law, was taken away (Daniel 12:7) — at which time the “thousand-year” reign began (Rev 20:2-7.)
Mr. Kalamata